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'That VDSL Cat'
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  Reply # 1878944 7-Oct-2017 12:12
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Jase2985:

 

why are you using a standard filter if you are on naked VDSL? remove that for a start.

 

 

 

 

inline actually works totally fine for VDSL.

 

not ideal but certainly works.





#include <std_disclaimer>

 

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.


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  Reply # 1879236 7-Oct-2017 23:11
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hio77:

 

Jase2985:

 

why are you using a standard filter if you are on naked VDSL? remove that for a start.

 

 

 

 

inline actually works totally fine for VDSL.

 

not ideal but certainly works.

 

 

 

 

Im going to ring chorus and pay for someone to come install a masterfilter. my net is so inconsistent its crazy

 

 

 

 


 
 
 
 


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  Reply # 1879244 8-Oct-2017 07:10
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you dont ring chorus, your ring your ISP, if your are in the auckland/waikato area give @coffeebaron a bell as he does them

 

are you testing over WiFi? or cabled connection.


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  Reply # 1879302 8-Oct-2017 10:46
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You'd be better off to get @coffeebaron to sort your wiring in the house
What is a filter going to do to a naked DSL line ?
Your issue most likely is in the house wiring if you have 4x jack points and only 2 work there is bound to be gremlins in here
Separate out wiring to the modem jackpoint.
If your jack points are daisy chained put modem at closest jackpoint to where DSL comes into house.


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  Reply # 1879417 8-Oct-2017 15:02
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Jase2985:

 

you dont ring chorus, your ring your ISP, if your are in the auckland/waikato area give @coffeebaron a bell as he does them

 

are you testing over WiFi? or cabled connection.

 

 

 

 

I test through a cabled connection. I am in the Levin, is there anyone around this area that does it?


'That VDSL Cat'
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  Reply # 1879421 8-Oct-2017 15:05
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aotearoa223:

 

Jase2985:

 

you dont ring chorus, your ring your ISP, if your are in the auckland/waikato area give @coffeebaron a bell as he does them

 

are you testing over WiFi? or cabled connection.

 

 

 

 

I test through a cabled connection. I am in the Levin, is there anyone around this area that does it?

 

 

Chorus is your best bet in that case.

 

 

 

Should be a pretty quick ME, normally turn around time is within 24 hours too..

 

Not the Cheapest, but hey, insures IW out of the mix.

 

 

 

Please do monitor by sync rates, not speedtest however. The influences possible there are far too high... 





#include <std_disclaimer>

 

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.


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Chorus NZ

  Reply # 1880228 10-Oct-2017 09:42
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aotearoa223:

 

 

 

 

 

Im going to ring chorus and pay for someone to come install a masterfilter. my net is so inconsistent its crazy

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hey aotearoa223, I m happy to perform an analysis of your connection if you'd like? Just PM me your address. Any request to log a fault or order a master splitter would still need to go through your Broadband Provider though. ^mike  

 

 


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  Reply # 1880341 10-Oct-2017 13:39
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Chorusnz:

 

Hey aotearoa223, I m happy to perform an analysis of your connection if you'd like? Just PM me your address. Any request to log a fault or order a master splitter would still need to go through your Broadband Provider though. ^mike 

 

 

Slightly OT, but keep it up there Mike.

 

 

 

Is great to see a chorus entity around here, Poor Brent used to get hammered with unreasonable stuff every time he popped up!

 

Hope you don't get hit with the same..





#include <std_disclaimer>

 

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.


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Chorus NZ

  Reply # 1881895 11-Oct-2017 12:03
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aotearoa223:

 

 

 

Im going to ring chorus and pay for someone to come install a masterfilter. my net is so inconsistent its crazy 

 

 

 

 

Hey aotearoa223, looks like your broadband provider placed a 24 hour test from 10/5/17 8:09 PM to 10/6/17 8:09 PM The test showed a good line, however, around 10/6/17 7:30 PM it showed the upstream bandwidth getting near full use (a master filter will get you more upload bandwidth in most cases).  The test stopped before we see it max out, though. I put a new test on that will run from 10/11/17 10:28 AM to 10/18/17 10:28 AM to get a more complete overview. 

 

Have you used a tool like PingPlotter https://www.pingplotter.com/products/free.html? It will give a more complete picture of what your ping is doing as opposed to speed tests. ^Mike


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  Reply # 1883008 13-Oct-2017 13:59
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@Chorusnz

 

My naked VDSL connection has had a rain related dropouts and re-syncs for the last 21 months. Taken ages for me to get enough confidence to report it as it is really stable in fine weather and therefore hard to pin down.

 

It has been logged as a fault with Chorus last week, but they bounced it back because it was "within spec" when they happened to test.

 

However around 23rd - 26th Sept I had two days with 30+ re-syncs each day during heavy rain. Sounds like one of your week-long diagnostic monitoring would be more suitable than a 24 hour one. Is that possible to arrange? Do you have access to historic re-sync logs too, to see the 60+ re-syncs in the week of 23rd Sept (followed by rock solid connection for a few days when the rain stopped).

 

I recognise because it is an intermittent fault, that it is harder to trace because it might be fully behaving itself when the Chorus tech happens to be looking. (Monday Afternoon to Tuesday evening was rock solid due to fine weather, but Wed morning at 00:24ish it dropped within seconds of the heavy rain hitting my roof! Two more re-syncs at lunchtime Wed in more rain too. Unfortunately, my modem is doing a grand job of attempting to hold onto the connection as well, so at 9am Wed morning the modem reported my signal to noise ratio margin drop to 2db from the normal 12db (as reported by the fritzbox stats).

 

Click to see full size

 

Had Chorus out again yesterday who re-terminated the demarc point (which is only 2 years old, so was unlikely to be the problem), and declared it fixed, but sure enough, had six dropouts again today in rain since 10am. Weather good here right now though, but raining on other side of valley, so there might be more rain later...

 

Click to see full size

 

Let me know if there is anything you can do.

 

Thanks

 

Mike

 

 

 

 

 

 


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Chorus NZ

  Reply # 1883075 13-Oct-2017 16:40
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@miked

 

Happy to help just PM me your full name and address.

 

I'll look into the line history but without any active motioning setup I'm not likely to get much useful info going back past the last 48hours.

 

 

 

^Mike

 

 

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  Reply # 1916877 11-Dec-2017 17:56
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Well, an update from my line. Mike ( @ChorusNZ ) has been awesome in the last two months.

 

He's stuck with my problem for several months to get me to a stable line with no water-ingress re-syncs (new overhead span required as expected!). Whilst they were on the case, they also removed of the multiples (bridge-taps?) in this section of the street as a bonus, such that my line is now regularly at 53/19 (compared to 20/5 a couple of months ago) and best of all no re-syncs due to rain or dew!

 

However that has left me a slight issue. My line holds 53/19 for several days (and has been as high as 57/20), whilst the errors slowly rise, then ddDLM re-syncs me dropping me to 15/10 where is seams to stay forever until I manually force a re-sync. Any manual re-sync instantly returns me to 53/19 until it next drops out. To give it optimal chance to sort itself, I've left it with @ChorusNZ up until now, and been resisting the urge to do any re-sync of it myself.

 

However, the conclusion is that this is ddDLM is doing its job correctly (dropping me down when the errors increase), so the next step is for me to do some tuning myself from my own end.

 

As a blunt test, I've tried moving all the stability/speed sliders in my Fritzbox one step to the left (they were fully to the right). This has caused me to re-sync at 39/19 for today, but is now looking less error riddled apparently.

 

Mike also suggested posting here to see if anyone else had any insight or thoughts on getting the most out of this line and my modem combo!

 

Some line info:

 

  • Line length approx 180m to street cabinet.
  • New ETP and master filter at demarc (on gable where overhead line joins).
  • Brand new overhead span to the house.
  • Cat5e/6 dedicated run from ETP to my network cabinet.
  • Naked VDSL from Voyager with no analogue phones on the copper.
  • Street Cabinet is listed as "Ikanos 2.1"
  • Modem is Fritz!box 7390 running latest 6.83 firmware

And stats to go with the various speeds I am seeing:

 

With Stability settings set to maximum speed eg:

 

Click to see full size

 

I get two sets of speeds:

 

Stats & spectrum when FAST at 53/19mbs:

 

Click to see full size

 

Click to see full size

 

 

 

 

 

And stats & spectrum when SLOW at 15/10mbs:

 

Click to see full size

 

Click to see full size

 

 

 

 

 

So from today I have moved the stability/speed sliders one step step left eg:

 

Click to see full size

 

Which has given me a middling speed of 39/19mbs with the following stats & spectrum:

 

Click to see full size

 

Click to see full size

 

 

 

Be happy to hear any thoughts people might have. I've put lots here already (sorry if too much info). If you want anything else I forgot though, let me know....


'That VDSL Cat'
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  Reply # 1916883 11-Dec-2017 18:22
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That slider is essentially setting the SNR up a little bit - this CAN mess with ddDLM.

 

 

 

Ideally, this sounds almost like RFI interference - is possible another line in the bundle is heavily crosstalking and killing your line when it's wet.

 

 

 

 

 

Honestly though, Given the complicated situation; I'd really want to dig down into the depth of it.

 

Mike seems pretty good at reading the graphs and such, so i'd say he's the goto and possibly slightly ahead of me there.

 

 

 

 

 

The thing i do find interesting from the details you have been able to share is, there appears to be a loss in power, accounting for the drop in speed - Typically if a modem was unstable and re-established to be stable, It would increase your SNR.

 

PSD marking is showing itself in your Bitloading quite clearly.

 

 

 

If your able to get a before and after copy of the Network analyser reports, i'd be very interested.. Isn't normally something that would be passed on though.

 

 





#include <std_disclaimer>

 

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.


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  Reply # 1916936 11-Dec-2017 18:49
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Thanks for that. Just to be clear, the water-ingress stuff is finally sorted! The random re-syncs in the rain are gone :)

 

The only issue remaining now is that the line slowly builds errors, until ddDLM decides it needs to do something, and stuffs me onto a slow profile. However, an immediate re-sync sees me back onto the faster profile. Some sort of cross-talk in the bundle is a good guess potentially. Especially since all the other lines in my section of the street are now also sync-ing faster as a result of the multiples/taps removal exercise.

 

Yes, we've deliberately held off touching the Fritz stability settings for the last 3-4 weeks since this should be fixable at the exchange end by ddDLM. However, since it is clearly not getting any better... rather than being stuck at 15/10mbs, I'm only just now testing it with a 1db noise margin increase to see if that helps it hold it above 15/10mbs!! (this is at Mike's suggestion for now).

 

@ChorusNZ Is it possible for @hio77 (that vdsl cat) to see the before and after Network Analyser reports?

 

Mike


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  Reply # 1916957 11-Dec-2017 20:22
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I don't think ddDLM is lowering your connection rate, its some sort of noise lowering your actual and attainable speeds while synced.
ddDLM would reset the connection and either raise your SNR profile or raise the Interleave depth (not visible on a Fritzbox)
Either would mean even after a resync your connection rate would remain lower.


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