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  Reply # 66205 3-Apr-2007 22:20
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Yeah and it can be any type of medium. Wifi or adsl or otherwise.
It all comes down to 'If I spend $xxxx on providing internet here, am I going to get $xxxx back any time soon?'

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  Reply # 66206 3-Apr-2007 22:25
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'competions'? Competitions? I am so confused...where am I?

 
 
 
 


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  Reply # 66207 3-Apr-2007 22:28
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g7viz: Cokemaster, you mis-understand the market. The competions does not want to replace the local loop because it is expensive to install and maintain. This is why the competions lobbied the government for access to the existing local loop. Access to the local loop allows the competion to offer services to the public that can also make them money.


The competition != market.
Remember that the owner of the local loop is also part of the market you refer to.

The competition lobbied the government because it allows them to 'cherry pick' profitable area for minimal investment. Of course they would push for it, because they would profit it from it and make a quick buck.

If they were serious about long term investments, they could always build their own network, you know like how Woosh did... until the whole announcement of LLU kinda scuttled that - whats the point in investing in radio equipment and being completely independent when government regulations make your life easier? Or whats with the whole local loop thing - there are so many technologies which offer better performance to the existing copper network - namely fiber and wireless... why not those?







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  Reply # 66208 3-Apr-2007 22:43
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weblordpepe: Yeah and it can be any type of medium. Wifi or adsl or otherwise.
It all comes down to 'If I spend $xxxx on providing internet here, am I going to get $xxxx back any time soon?'

Or 'can I lobby the government, cap in hand, so that I can get cheap access (over aging copper) to a network that my competition owns (and brought at the time)? While doing that, wiping out a large chunk in their shares... and then (as per previous link) suggest that more intervention is needed because opening the network is not enough, you have to pay them to come!'




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  Reply # 68092 22-Apr-2007 22:24
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I just signed up with Xtra on their max down and max up plan.
I'm happy with the up speed but downloads are really slow from international sites.
I have a new/fast computer, and only live 1.3 km from the exchange.
For example I downloaded Google earth from Google and only got 28 kB/sec.
Anyone suggest why that might be?



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  Reply # 68094 22-Apr-2007 22:33
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sounds like google was the limiting factor ie they could not provide you with more than 28kbps. not xtra's problem. but i do know xtra can get very slow at peak hours sometimes. if you really want to get super speed try downloading something from windows or sony to check




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  Reply # 68107 23-Apr-2007 08:01
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Google was only an example. Most other sites are the same.  Updating my antivirus for example.
Is the download speed I mentioned considered "very" slow?  Slow enought o think its a technical problem and not just the NZ adsl system?



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  Reply # 68115 23-Apr-2007 09:15
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hmmm shouldnt be. try downloading something from windows or sony. their sites seem to have limitless bandwidth. also go to nzadsl.co.nz/speedtest and speedtest.net and see what you get. also are you running some mcafee/norton etc thing? these "security suites" really suck up a lot of your computer's powers (ie your computer is "slow" in general, not just the internet)! the other stuff that can make computers "slow" overall are spywares and too many programs running. however that said, your internet should still be fast once it's latched onto the download, hows your computer in general?




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  Reply # 68146 23-Apr-2007 13:09
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antoniosk: The DSLAMS are still old.


Are they? ADSL hasn't been around that long in NZ. In that time, there's been at least one upgrade from Nokia Redback to Alcatel equipment, AFAIK.

The copper still has average runs of 4km, when ADSL is only really viable up to 1.5km.


Hmm, really? What do you base that on? Everything I've seen, including published specifications point to 6.5km being the limit. I've certainly always been further away than 1.5km from the exchange - think I'm over 4km away now, but still get over 6Mbit/s downloads and 6-700k uploads on UBS from TCL, which performed rather nicely overall.




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Reply # 68147 23-Apr-2007 13:17
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juha: ADSL hasn't been around that long in NZ. In that time, there's been at least one upgrade from Nokia Redback to Alcatel equipment, AFAIK.


At least nine years now. I was in the first ADSL trial, ran in Khandallah, Wellington. At that time I blew the 600MB cap in two days...





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  Reply # 68151 23-Apr-2007 13:31
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Right, but we're not talking about equipment that's been in service for the past 20-30 years or anything here. Everything's relative, but the Alcatel gear only went in 02-03... I think there may be some Nokias left in the network but don't know how many. And now Telecom's installing Alcatel ISAMs in the network, so I don't think it's correct to say the DSLAMs are old.




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  Reply # 68235 23-Apr-2007 23:40
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juha:
antoniosk: The copper still has average runs of 4km, when ADSL is only really viable up to 1.5km.


Hmm, really? What do you base that on? Everything I've seen, including published specifications point to 6.5km being the limit. I've certainly always been further away than 1.5km from the exchange - think I'm over 4km away now, but still get over 6Mbit/s downloads and 6-700k uploads on UBS from TCL, which performed rather nicely overall.


Yeah, it works when you are one of a few on the cable bundle of hundreds. Once every pair is lit up with dsl you will see the noisemargin plummet and the speeds along with it.




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  Reply # 68248 24-Apr-2007 05:54
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juha:
antoniosk: The DSLAMS are still old.


Are they? ADSL hasn't been around that long in NZ. In that time, there's been at least one upgrade from Nokia Redback to Alcatel equipment, AFAIK.

The copper still has average runs of 4km, when ADSL is only really viable up to 1.5km.


Hmm, really? What do you base that on? Everything I've seen, including published specifications point to 6.5km being the limit. I've certainly always been further away than 1.5km from the exchange - think I'm over 4km away now, but still get over 6Mbit/s downloads and 6-700k uploads on UBS from TCL, which performed rather nicely overall.


Sorry Juha, missed that you'd responded.

DSLAM's have an estimated useful depreciable life of about 4-5 years, so if indeed they went in around 2001/2 then they should be ready for replacement - this kit is more appliance-like everyday. They are old in the context of modern IT equipment (like Cisco Routers) rather than new in comparison to 30-year old Neax-61's.

Regarding the speed item, phyics is what allows me to comment. In NZ the typical Telecom configuration (old, big copper sheaths with a lot of signal down them) means that at 2km - like me from Kelburn exchange - you should get about 3072/256, and at greater than 3.3 you'll get less, and on it goes - a typical speed chart looks like a standard deviation curve.

I suspect there's an electronic cabinet between you and your place, meaning the real copper run is less than 1km, with a fibre-fed DSLAM connecting you - at 4km from an exchange you should be getting average speeds.

The speed you are getting is great though, so you should be rocketing in DSL2+ land.




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  Reply # 68249 24-Apr-2007 05:55
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freitasm:
juha: ADSL hasn't been around that long in NZ. In that time, there's been at least one upgrade from Nokia Redback to Alcatel equipment, AFAIK.


At least nine years now. I was in the first ADSL trial, ran in Khandallah, Wellington. At that time I blew the 600MB cap in two days...


Khandallah was number 2 on the list of priority DSL2+ exchanges, with Pakuranga being no 1....

No word on what the usage cap would be though...




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  Reply # 68253 24-Apr-2007 07:28
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g7viz: I have to agree with you.  Broadband in New Zealand really sucks.  NZ Telecom should be ashamed of themselves.  Unless they do something about it, and do it quickly, I can see people queuing up to leave them in the near future.   Roll on naked broadband.


Wait a minute... With naked broadband people will still be using the current infrastructure for last mile, because I don't see any ISP moving to deploy a new network. So, really you will still be a Telecom NZ customer anyway...

What about asking why ISPs are not investing? Because it's not all TNZ's fault, if you think about it. Bad services exist in other ISPs as well. How many times we read here about bad help desk services from Slingshot? Or why Vodafone does not answer queries sent via e-mail through their contact form?

It's the national past time to blame anything and everything on TNZ. Other day I read here someone blaming TNZ for something that didn't even have TNZ involved!

C'mon... Let's be realistic. It's not one company. It's the entire sector.






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