UFB installation contractor left a big mess. Who's responsible?

Forums › New Zealand Broadband › UFB installation contractor left a big mess. Who's responsible?

1 | 2 | 3

2767 posts

Uber Geek

Subscriber

#1059000 4-Jun-2014 07:07

richms: Depends on the damage. Some damage resulting from adjacent work is unavoidable and not something that they should have to repair. Driving a digger thru a fence is something they would have to repair.

The people I know who have complained are upset about the footpath not having a uniform finish now and the grass area being a little uneven out the front of their house now, one had their ricketty old fence start to lean as it was being abused as a retaining wall somewhat as well. None of those should be fixed IMO. IMO cival works on the street should not have to reinstate things that happen on the property if they were not being negligent or careless. Digging will often end up making things move and when you choose home ownership its just something you have to deal with IMO.

The berm is usually 99% not owned by the home/landowner behind that front fence. This berm and footpath being dug up is owned by of course the local territorial authority (council).
Up to them how pretty the reinstatement will be and it is also up to the landowner/homeowner to take reasonable care i.e. mow that lawn….but they really dont have to mow this.

Samsung

Shop now on Samsung (affiliate link).

scuwp

3869 posts

Uber Geek

#1059015 4-Jun-2014 07:52

alexj: Anyone bother to read the FAQ on the UFF website? http://www.ultrafastfibre.co.nz/getting-connected/faqs

Thanks. I was looking for that last night but obviously missed it in my brain-fart moment.

I have an email back from Ultrafast this morning advising that they have a 'reinstatement team' and providing me their contact details. So it looks like they have plans in place for dealing with these issues which is good.

I am happy for the small bit of work I have to do on my property, but it was more a generic question regarding the install process for those that have already gone through it. As mentioned some of the home owners in my neighborhood may be having a harder discussion with Ultrafast from what I have casually observed.

richms: I hear ya, and largely agree re the verges etc provided they make a reasonable attempt to make things tidy, as with any service be it power, water etc. I am sure this work would have been provided for in their negotiations and pricing. Unintended property damage is another matter however IMO and homeowners shouldn't have to 'shut up and take it for the greater good'. Not living in a totalitarian state just yet.

Asked and answered - thanks all.

Lazy is such an ugly word, I prefer to call it selective participation

Bung

6328 posts

Uber Geek

Subscriber

#1059017 4-Jun-2014 07:53

richms: IMO cival works on the street should not have to reinstate things that happen on the property if they were not being negligent or careless. Digging will often end up making things move and when you choose home ownership its just something you have to deal with IMO.

If you could be a contractor and get away with that Telecom's First Media might still be operating. Damage happens but it should be the responsibility of whoever is doing the digging.

nickb800

2715 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#1059019 4-Jun-2014 08:05

richms: You get 1000s of $ worth of fiber install which will signifigantly advantage you for sales of the property in the near future and you are complaining about a bit of damage you have to cleanup?

#firstworldproblems

The scarcity of FTTH is rapidly decreasing as the rollout progresses, so by the end of the fibre rollout it will have virtually no effect on property prices

merve0o0

492 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1063304 11-Jun-2014 12:23

when they did our street it was over a month before they came back and finished the job.

pohutukawa

197 posts

Master Geek

#1065188 13-Jun-2014 20:39

scuwp: So UFB is being installed in my neighbourhood, however the contractor has made a hell of a mess of the grass verges, marked and damaged some fences, and even damaged some retaining walls with their equipment. We have got off quite lightly by comparison to some although I am looking at a couple of hours work and a few $$ to put everything back how it was.

Should that be my responsibility?

I have contacted Ultrafast and am waiting for reply. I thought there would be something on the website or on the web in general but nothing that I can see, so thought I would chuck it out there for discussion or experience from areas completed.

Do they contract someone else to come along and restore everything to a reasonable standard after, or is this it?

Chorus contracted our area out to Visionstream who in turn contracted it out to what must have been the bottom-tier (cheapest) bunch of muppets to ever get their hands on a shovel.

They dug holes they didn't need to. They piled mud and clay everywhere. They damaged the verges. They left the footpath unsafe with stuff overflowing onto it.

And their placement of the fibre pillars was inconsistent and woeful.

Then they took all the barriers away and pissed off.

When I pointed out that this was pretty much the worst job one could imagine, they came by and threw some grass-seed on MY verge. Not all the verges, just mine.

Chorus said it wasn't their issue as they had contracted Visionstream.

Visionstream said it wasn't their issue as they had contracted it out.

So I got onto Crown Fibre and they got onto Chorus and Chorus got back to me. It was the water company's fault. Then the electricity company. Then Chorus said it was the long, dry summer, and they were waiting for the rains before reinstating the verges. Everyone except the Chorus/Visionstream/Muppet chain.

I never got to the bottom of it.

Our verges have about three different types of grass, mounds where the clay was piled up, and are generally in a terrible state.

It seems that ultimately the approach is to do the quickest, easiest and cheapest job possible to get the damn pipe in there, and then point the finger at everyone else if somebody complains.

Whenever Chorus connect somebody up invariably the initial job was so poor they need to rip up the footpath and re-do a section. This isn't reinstated for sometimes months until there are a few strips that need re-doing and then they are all done together. They leave the cones around for ages.

Another thing I've noticed is that Chorus are pushing the use of "existing use" of overhead wires to the maximum possible. They say that hanging up a new (fibre) cable, instead of undergrounding, is "maintenance" under the law and start quoting all sorts of legal stuff if questioned.

Thing is, it isn't maintenance. It is the fundamental replacement of one type of cable with another. So my neighbour had his fibre undergrounded complements of my calling Chorus out on that one.

When Chorus came to provision our connection, they told us we were down a right of way, and needed consent from our neighbours.

Interesting approach from their super-sharp consents team, who were looking at the wrong, out of date data.

Nope, I said, try again: our connection goes straight out onto the road. Nope, they said, no it doesn't. You're just an armchair expert - we do all of this complicated stuff every day! Oh ok, I said, but why don't they send somebody out to check? No need, they said. So they didn't. Turned up ready to thrust down the driveway and couldn't find the point of entry on the house.

So I reminded them where it was. Oh, that's straight out onto the footpath they said. Yep, I agreed with them.

I hope Chorus goes broke, slowly but surely.

Bung

6328 posts

Uber Geek

Subscriber

#1065246 13-Jun-2014 22:23

Where was your local Council while this shambles was happening?

We haven't had any fibre done but the water mains have been done. All spoil removed as it came out of the trench, all fill new. All work temp patched at the end of each day with permanent seal done as each section pressure tested.

DarthKermit

5346 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#1065298 14-Jun-2014 00:05

Wow pohutukawa, you had a bad experience there!

Our installation of UFB was subcontracted to Downer EDI. They did a very neat and tidy job in this area.

We have no overhead wires of any kind in ours and surrounding streets, as it was all under grounded a long time ago.

This is one pic from the installation outside of our house:

They dug similar holes to this next to the grey phone pillar and used the existing white conduit to thrust the UFB conduit through. Afterwards, all the holes were backfilled and new tarseal (or concrete) was laid to re-instate the footpaths and road to its former look.

Whatifthespacekeyhadneverbeeninvented?

scuwp

3869 posts

Uber Geek

#1065397 14-Jun-2014 10:29

What Pohutukawa described was more like our neighborhood, although I have seen some reconstruction and tidying up of the verges in the last couple of days, spoil removed, topsoil replaced and seeded (like its actually going to germinate at this time of the year but however) and the the damage appears to have been largely attended to.

Lazy is such an ugly word, I prefer to call it selective participation

DarthKermit

5346 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#1065399 14-Jun-2014 10:35

scuwp,
Have you got any pictures of the mess?

Whatifthespacekeyhadneverbeeninvented?

Peppery

918 posts

Ultimate Geek

Trusted

#1066998 16-Jun-2014 20:38

Visionstream made a bit of a mess in our area in the process of digging up the sidewalks 4+ times, however they've cleaned it all up now even before UFB is available. No complaints.

pohutukawa

197 posts

Master Geek

#1066999 16-Jun-2014 20:40

Bung: Where was your local Council while this shambles was happening?

We haven't had any fibre done but the water mains have been done. All spoil removed as it came out of the trench, all fill new. All work temp patched at the end of each day with permanent seal done as each section pressure tested.

Council said it was Auckland Transport's problem.

AT referred me to Chorus.

Chorus....

pohutukawa

197 posts

Master Geek

#1067002 16-Jun-2014 20:42

DarthKermit: Wow pohutukawa, you had a bad experience there!

Our installation of UFB was subcontracted to Downer EDI. They did a very neat and tidy job in this area.

We have no overhead wires of any kind in ours and surrounding streets, as it was all under grounded a long time ago.

This is one pic from the installation outside of our house:

They dug similar holes to this next to the grey phone pillar and used the existing white conduit to thrust the UFB conduit through. Afterwards, all the holes were backfilled and new tarseal (or concrete) was laid to re-instate the footpaths and road to its former look.

Looks neat and tidy. Because they were cutting through tarmac or concrete that they actually had to think a bit and plan some.

Our holes were dug in the grass and thrusting was done along that line.

pohutukawa

197 posts

Master Geek

#1067006 16-Jun-2014 20:46

scuwp: What Pohutukawa described was more like our neighborhood, although I have seen some reconstruction and tidying up of the verges in the last couple of days, spoil removed, topsoil replaced and seeded (like its actually going to germinate at this time of the year but however) and the the damage appears to have been largely attended to.

Now AT have since been through and re-done the verge and footpaths. It's almost as much of a mess as when they started. The contractors made a rubbish job of formwork and concrete has blown through into gardens, verges, guttering, and they either toss earth over it to hide, or just leave it. AT don't care. They seem to have pretty close relationships with the contractors and appear not to wish to piss them off. Bizarre.

One might assume that Chorus/Visionstream knew that this was in the pipeline. All they needed to do was hold tight until somebody else came along and then it was "last man frees all".

driller2000

935 posts

Ultimate Geek

ID Verified

#1067014 16-Jun-2014 20:58

Standard infrastructure construction contracts WILL have reinstatement requirements set out in the Scope of Works and Specs.

Reinstatement work is generally carried out following the actual install work - often by a separate team - it does however need to be timely to minimise impacts / complaints.

Standard approach is to replace "like with like" (as much as possible) and there will be clauses in their construction contract to achieve this.

The Head Contractor (and Principal) will be liable for ALL damage caused by them (accidental or otherwise) - the Homeowner / Council / Third Party Asset Owners - should not have to pay anything - unless there is a betterment component to the reinstatement requested.

If its in the berm - Council will chase this up via inspections / snagging lists etc until all reinstatement is done.

If it's on your private property - you should do the same.

Personally I would be onto it within 5 -10 working days - with the Head Contractor. They should have sent a letter out listing who this was at the start of the works - in your case whoever the reinstatement person worked for would be a good start. Do it in writing as well. Chase them every few days - note details of discussions / reinstatement dates promised / names of persons conversed with. Be the squeaky wheel until it is rectified.

Note: This advice is based on delivering civil infrastructure projects for over 20 years as a consultant, client and contract manager.

EDIT - If you don't get any joy after a reasonable timeframe - take it up the tree - either management at the Head Contractor or the political arm of your local council. Local politicians can come in quite handy in this role as the Council Business Units need to respond pretty quickly when the pollies get involved. IMHO this should be an avenue of last resort iff you don't get a reasonable response / outcome through working with the Contractor etc.

1 | 2 | 3