Changes to DLM Incoming

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'That VDSL Cat'
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# 1840856 7-Aug-2017 23:21

AidanP: Before I got the 17a profile the day before I had tried shorting out the dsl cable by exposing the 2 wires from an old dsl cable plugging it into the modem and the master splitter then waited for a connection then shorted them which did nothing exept limit our download speed to 10 mbps for a short period but the next day I found out that we were put to the 17a profile, I don't know if this was related to me shorting the cable.

often changes to the cabling can trigger port changes.

99% of the time, when i plug in my 7390 i jump straight to 17a, other times it happens is while line faults are being repaired.

I've always put the 7390 down to a logic choice by AVM pushing towards 17a rather than 8b for profile (it is a negotiation with ddDLM rather than a set profile as with DLM) - as mentioned previously in this thread, forcing this can cause very unwanted actions, I've physically broken my port twice.

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Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.

AidanP

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# 1840857 7-Aug-2017 23:24

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hio77:
AidanP: Before I got the 17a profile the day before I had tried shorting out the dsl cable by exposing the 2 wires from an old dsl cable plugging it into the modem and the master splitter then waited for a connection then shorted them which did nothing exept limit our download speed to 10 mbps for a short period but the next day I found out that we were put to the 17a profile, I don't know if this was related to me shorting the cable.

often changes to the cabling can trigger port changes.

99% of the time, when i plug in my 7390 i jump straight to 17a, other times it happens is while line faults are being repaired.

I've always put the 7390 down to a logic choice by AVM pushing towards 17a rather than 8b for profile (it is a negotiation with ddDLM rather than a set profile as with DLM) - as mentioned previously in this thread, forcing this can cause very unwanted actions, I've physically broken my port twice.

I am seeing my download speed being maxed out at 70 and upload speed at 20 as a result of being on 17a which is good so far but I just hope we stick to the 17a profile

xpd

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# 1848245 17-Aug-2017 20:36

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Sweet, looks like I finally got a tweak :D

Was originally getting 70/10, then when the profiles were being pushed out got 65/13 and now getting 64/29 :)

XPD / Gavin / DemiseNZ

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DS248

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# 1848354 18-Aug-2017 09:31

Interesting. I see we are now on Profile 17a. First time I have seen that. And as several on this forum previously suggested the result is not ideal for our situation. Data rate somewhat below previous max values on 8b (31883 kbps), with upload speed in particular impacted (down from 3035 kbps on 20 July to 2071 kbps).

Not change for the better.

hio77

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# 1848363 18-Aug-2017 09:43

ddDLM is probably just trialing again. I'd expect it to drop back again at some point.

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gobtob

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# 1849144 20-Aug-2017 11:38

The pings settling down. Might end up with the same line as before DLM :P

cddt

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# 1850605 22-Aug-2017 18:16

A big improvement here over the last couple of months. About 25% down, 50% up.

Line standard

VDSL2

Downstream line rate (kbit/s)

28955

Upstream line rate (kbit/s)

1531

Downstream SNR (dB)

4.6

Upstream SNR (dB)

6.2

Downstream line attenuation (dB)

27.2

Upstream line attenuation (dB)

12.8

Downstream output power (dBmV)

18.6

Upstream output power (dBmV)

Downstream CRC

1061

Upstream CRC

Downstream FEC

100883

Upstream FEC

hio77

'That VDSL Cat'
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# 1850674 22-Aug-2017 20:57

One thing i note is your snr on downstream is riding low, this is definitely causing higher than normal error rates.

Generally this is okay, but if ddDLM doesn't like those errors it may pull you back to 12dB and start retraining down again.

#include <std_disclaimer>

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AidanP

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# 1850676 22-Aug-2017 20:59

Today our modem reset and came back with an abnormal SNR margin as seen here

Also our upload speed had increased by 2 Mbps which i believe is a result of a neighbor dropping off the 17a profile :D

hio77

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# 1852123 24-Aug-2017 20:52

Don't you hate it when you get home to find one of your lines was messed with today?..

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littlehead

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# 1852169 25-Aug-2017 00:20

So I'm in central Christchurch and stuck in a dead zone of no-vdsl. Served from an exchange and just too far to get VDSL, and with no cabinets in my area put this close to the exchange, ADSL is my only option. I have UFB and Vodafone cable running outside my drive, but I am in a consent hell.

Anyway, I hoped the 998 bandplan changes might allow me to get vdsl, but nope, still not able to get it. My line attenuation is 29 so no chance. Then seeing DLM was coming to ADSL I hoped I might get some better speeds, but I monitored since the the roll-out in May and saw zero improvements. Oh well.

Fast forward three months to Monday night and I randomly notice my download speeds are faster then usual. My sync is usually around 15 Mbit/s down and the standard 1.0 Mbit/s up. Log into my modem and I'm now over 19.1 Mbit/s down and 1.20 Mbit/s up, which percentage wise is a huge increase. SNR had dropped down from 12 to 6. I keep monitoring and I log in tonight and I'm now on 19.7 down, 1.23 up and SNR 5. I am getting about 1500 RX errors every 24 hours or so, no idea if this is too many to be stable or not. Even so, getting a 20-30% increase in speed for nothing is very nice indeed, especially since I use Crashplan and am debating my options. I just hope it holds.

I do have a question though. I am currently using a Draytek 120 for my modem. I also potentially have access to a Draytek 130. Does anyone know if a 130 might give me a better or more stable sync? Is it a better ADSL only modem?

Shrapz

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# 1852215 25-Aug-2017 08:10

Latest tweaks look good, just need that latency to drop off!

Negotiated Connection Properties

Receive Direction

Send Direction

Max. DSLAM throughput

kbit/s

108832

51200

Min. DSLAM throughput

kbit/s

360

Attainable throughput

kbit/s

108777

45948

Current throughput

kbit/s

108777

45947

Seamless rate adaptation

off

Latency

7 ms

fast

Impulse Noise Protection (INP)

G.INP

off

Signal-to-noise ratio

Bitswap

Line attenuation

Profile

17a

G.Vector

off

Carrier record

A43

Error Counter

Seconds With

Not Remediable Errors (CRC)

Errors (ES)

Many
Errors (SES)

per
Minute

Last
15 Minutes

FRITZ!Box

0.02

Central exchange

0.02

smalltrader

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# 1852220 25-Aug-2017 08:20

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littlehead: So I'm in central Christchurch and stuck in a dead zone of no-vdsl. Served from an exchange and just too far to get VDSL, and with no cabinets in my area put this close to the exchange, ADSL is my only option. I have UFB and Vodafone cable running outside my drive, but I am in a consent hell. Anyway, I hoped the 998 bandplan changes might allow me to get vdsl, but nope, still not able to get it. My line attenuation is 29 so no chance. Then seeing DLM was coming to ADSL I hoped I might get some better speeds, but I monitored since the the roll-out in May and saw zero improvements. Oh well. Fast forward three months to Monday night and I randomly notice my download speeds are faster then usual. My sync is usually around 15 Mbit/s down and the standard 1.0 Mbit/s up. Log into my modem and I'm now over 19.1 Mbit/s down and 1.20 Mbit/s up, which percentage wise is a huge increase. SNR had dropped down from 12 to 6. I keep monitoring and I log in tonight and I'm now on 19.7 down, 1.23 up and SNR 5. I am getting about 1500 RX errors every 24 hours or so, no idea if this is too many to be stable or not. Even so, getting a 20-30% increase in speed for nothing is very nice indeed, especially since I use Crashplan and am debating my options. I just hope it holds. I do have a question though. I am currently using a Draytek 120 for my modem. I also potentially have access to a Draytek 130. Does anyone know if a 130 might give me a better or more stable sync? Is it a better ADSL only modem?

What you described in terms of sync speed changes really does sound like ddDLM is fine tuning your line and this is expected behaviour. From the forum, most people seem to get better sync speeds (both up and down) with ddDLM which is a good outcome.

1500 Rx errors rate over 24 hours is roughly 1 error per minute. This is probably well within stability tolerance. ddDLM will adjust your sync speed if it detects that error rate is going to cause stability problem.

Draytek made good modems. I don't believe going from a 120 to a 130 is going to materially affect your sync speed or stability. The external factors like in house wiring, master filter and external line quality play a far more important role for VDSL/ADSL (especially VDSL).

Torquenstein

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# 1853209 27-Aug-2017 10:55

Interesting, after 7 years in this house on a max download of 13Mbps on both VDSL or ADSL (And neighbours denying fibre upgrade on shared right of way), woke up this morning to see this;

I wonder if this improves my chance of getting a decent VDSL connection now

smalltrader

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# 1853212 27-Aug-2017 11:09

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Torquenstein:

Interesting, after 7 years in this house on a max download of 13Mbps on both VDSL or ADSL (And neighbours denying fibre upgrade on shared right of way), woke up this morning to see this;

I wonder if this improves my chance of getting a decent VDSL connection now

It looks like ddDLM is fine tuning your line. Could you post modem stats so that we can see errors rate, SNR and attenuation.
ddDLM is known to test upper and lower limit and then continuously adjusting sync speeds based on line condition. If the errors rate is too high ddDLM will bring down the sync speed.

On my VDSL line, ddDLM has adjusted download sync speed from 40Mbps to 68 Mbps and anything in between. As you can see this is a wide range.

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