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# 214578 18-May-2017 15:48
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A friend of mine in Auckland  has just called me  telling me that Chorus  / Spark has told her that the copper feeding  a block of about 11 home units is past it's use by date and if they want to keep broadband the will have to go wireless.   She asked about getting fiber but was told that one person in the block had said no  so they could provide it.

 

 

 

I was under the impression that  this had changed and one person could not block a fiber install.  Is this correct and if so has anyone got a link.

 

She is picking up the wireless router tomorrow  but as she is not tech savy I think she will have a load of grief with this thing..

 

 

 

Thanx in advance..





Regards,

Old3eyes


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  # 1784323 18-May-2017 15:55
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At first glance, sounds like the slightly less than truthful Spark marketing being talked about in this thread


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  # 1784324 18-May-2017 15:55
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My understanding is that it has been written into law however the process has not yet changed within the wholesalers.

 

Some of the info can be found here:http://www.crownfibre.govt.nz/2016/06/law-changes-introduced-streamline-ufb-rollout/





Perpetually undecided.

 
 
 
 


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  # 1784325 18-May-2017 15:56
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Law hasn't changed yet. Even with the change though it's no guarantee that this would happen if it's been blocked previously, or would be blocked again in the future by somebody there.

 

 


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  # 1784329 18-May-2017 16:02
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Going back a few steps - who actually said that? Was it Spark simply trying to move her to wireless or is there a fault and outage that Chorus are refusing to reinstate?

 

 




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  # 1784332 18-May-2017 16:12
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sbiddle:

 

Going back a few steps - who actually said that? Was it Spark simply trying to move her to wireless or is there a fault and outage that Chorus are refusing to reinstate?

 

 

 

 

Thanx.

 

Apparently  Spark told her.  Sounds to me like they are  trying to get out of paying Chorus for the copper repairs and make more profit from the connection..   Every time it rains the line gets real noisy. 

 

I was hoping that the rule change would have gone thru and she could still get fiber..





Regards,

Old3eyes


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  # 1784335 18-May-2017 16:16
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old3eyes:

 

sbiddle:

 

Going back a few steps - who actually said that? Was it Spark simply trying to move her to wireless or is there a fault and outage that Chorus are refusing to reinstate?

 

 

 

 

Thanx.

 

Apparently  Spark told her.  Sounds to me like they are  trying to get out of paying Chorus for the copper repairs and make more profit from the connection..   Every time it rains the line gets real noisy. 

 

I was hoping that the rule change would have gone thru and she could still get fiber..

 

 

Spark agents are not asked to advise this.

 

 

 

While offering wireless service is a great offer, it is not a solution to faults as a hard sale. - This would be a judgement call and up to the customer. If this is not the case, clearly something has not gone right.

 

Please pass on details to me so i can look over what exactly has gone on here.





#include <std_disclaimer>

 

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.


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  # 1784348 18-May-2017 16:49
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old3eyes has passed details along to me here.

 

 

 

The relationship between the fault and the sale do not seem to be related, although i do feel the fault should have been looked at with a bit more detail, These cases are well past due and thus would be looking at a new fault.

 

This has been passed onto the outbound sales teams to look into the isolated case.

 

 

 

The upgrade to wireless for this customer datawise is a good move, If its ideal for the customer's situation that would really depend on discussions with the customer.

 

 

 

i'll sum this up with @JasonParis's comments previously on the situation. Having brushed sholders with Jason on Frequent disconnection issues I can personally say he really does feel this way. Copper is not going away, Fibre is the future but where wireless works all good.

 

 

Hi all,

Thanks for bringing me into the loop - first day back sorry and a bit to get through!

From the thread it does seem that some of the language being used by the team isn't right - so I'll get onto this tomorrow and sort it, plus listen to more of the calls to ensure that we get it right 100% of the time.

I also want to confirm that the copper network isn’t being shut down, but we do receive an average of 30,000 calls per month from customers who have a fault with their copper broadband. Therefore we are actively encouraging customers to move to either fibre or wireless broadband, depending on their individual needs. Copper broadband is an older technology that is not being invested in, in the way that newer technologies are by the lines companies and its a fact that this is turning up more and more as a poor customer experience for what is becoming an essential connection for many homes and businesses.

For customers who don’t need unlimited data, wireless broadband can be a game changer. Plug in and you are connected in minutes vs having to wait days or weeks for a technician from your lines company to connect you. The speed is significantly better than copper in most instances too. And because it runs over the mobile network, customers won’t have to worry about faults over winter or when it rains. If you don't need connected straight away and want unlimited data with the fastest speeds then fibre would be the best option for you or your business. However for businesses I'd still suggest you consider wireless broadband as a back up should your fibre drop.

From a service and sales perspective we have clear guidelines for our front line to explain where the product is or isn't appropriate, based on what other technologies are available at their address - and how they use their broadband. As it’s not always a black and white choice, we do need to ensure that clear expectations are set with customers. And as we know that there are a number of factors to consider, and we do offer a 30 day money back network guarantee.

Many New Zealand homes and businesses could have a much better connection than their current one. We see this because customers that have migrated to the wireless broadband give us great feedback and consistently recommend this product more than any other kind of broadband we sell. So we are comfortable going out and talking to customers about wireless broadband and fibre as both better options than copper.

Hope this helps.

Jason

 

 

https://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?forumid=39&topicid=207607&page_no=2#1704418

 

 

 

 

 

 





#include <std_disclaimer>

 

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.


 
 
 
 


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  # 1784489 18-May-2017 21:34
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sbiddle:

 

Law hasn't changed yet. Even with the change though it's no guarantee that this would happen if it's been blocked previously, or would be blocked again in the future by somebody there.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The new law comes into effect on 9th June.

 

http://www.legislation.govt.nz/regulation/public/2017/0081/latest/DLM7241715.html

 

Read the whole thing here: http://www.legislation.govt.nz/bill/government/2016/0146/latest/whole.html 

 

There are a whole bunch of bits that come into play, depending on the type of install and if there is a body corp but in summary:

 

- The requirement to fit out (future proof) every unit / tenancy is still required (i.e. run the pipe / conduit / dropoff but don't run the fibre)

 

- Chorus (or other LFC) send out a notice, they have x number of days (15 is the worst case) and it is deemed consent from all parties unless someone objects.

 

- They may need to do a design and send it out to all parties

 

- They need to give 5 days notice before starting any works.

 

- People can only object under certain conditions (see below), not liking your neighbor, being a general dick don't count.

 

- This does not apply to complex installs, such as having to dig up a whole driveway or road.

 

- Chorus only pay $1000 per tenancy, over this they ask for a contribution (e.g 6 unit flat black, they pay $6000, if the install is $8000 they ask for a $2000 contribution). As far as I can see this will remain the same, there is no requirement for other parties to pay. In business buildings the majority of won't pay a cent, it gets left to the tenant, often they end up paying for it all, but the whole building gets the benefit.

 

- There is a disputes scheme if someone objects.

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 Examples of category 1 and category 2 installations

 


Examples of category 1 installations are—
an installation that uses existing equipment such as ducts or conduit:
an aerial installation:
an installation that only disturbs soft surfaces and where those surfaces can easily be restored.

 


Examples of category 2 installations are—
micro-trenching where the width of the cut is not more than the prescribed width:
an installation that is predominantly below the surface, such as directional drilling, where the physical impact is limited to access points, or entry and exit points, that do not exceed the prescribed size:
open trenching where the size of the trench, once reinstated, is not more than the prescribed size.

 

 

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Objections

 

I don't know if you can even object to Cat 1 install

 

 

 

155N Grounds and time for objecting to exercise of statutory right of access to carry out category 2 installation
(1)
An affected person may object to the FTTP service provider or network operator exercising a statutory right of access to enter property and carry out a category 2 installation, on 1 or more of the following grounds:
(a)
the person disputes ownership of property that the proposed installation will make use of or disturb:
(b)
the person can demonstrate that the installation will have a materially negative impact on the value of the person’s property:
(c)
the person can identify ways in which the proposed installation will unreasonably impact on the person’s enjoyment of the property, or worsen an existing problem with the property, other than by having a visual impact alone:
(d)
the person can demonstrate that the proposed installation will impede the person’s plans for development of the property:
(e)
the person has an easement over the property affected and can demonstrate that the proposed installation will have an enduring impact on the terms and conditions of that easement:
(f)
the prescribed grounds (if any).
(2)
An affected person who wants to object to a network operator exercising a statutory right of access under this section must do so by giving a notice of objection to the FTTP service provider or network operator within 15 working days after receiving the preliminary notice and high-level design plan for the installation under section 155L(1)(a).
(3)
Nothing in this section, or any other provision of this subpart, affects the right of a person to cancel an order that the person has placed for an FTTP service to be installed.

 

 

 

155O Effect of objection to exercise of statutory right of access for category 2 installation
(1)
If the FTTP service provider, network operator, or person who placed the order with a retail provider for the FTTP service to be installed (in each case, person A) disputes the validity of an affected person’s objection under section 155N, person A may refer the dispute to the dispute resolution scheme.




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  # 1784569 19-May-2017 08:22
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Thanx folks for the answers.  I have passed this thread on to her.   She tells me that one other person in the block  got one of these wireless units recently and Spark came and put it in.  When she asked they said that they wouldn't .  I'll keep you posted but I suspect  this is not going to go well  due to the location of where her PC is  and where the existing phone line terminates  in the Kitchen and bedroom 1. She has a cord caddy running from Bedroom one to bedroom 3  to feed the ADSL to the router.  She will need to buy a set of  two or three cordless phones and plug the basestation into the phone port on the wireless router (assuming  they also cut off the old analog line at the same time)  using  the others as local powered remotes.  Hope the supply a RJ11 cord with the cordless. 





Regards,

Old3eyes


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  # 1784577 19-May-2017 08:30
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old3eyes:

 

Thanx folks for the answers.  I have passed this thread on to her.   She tells me that one other person in the block  got one of these wireless units recently and Spark came and put it in.  When she asked they said that they wouldn't .  I'll keep you posted but I suspect  this is not going to go well  due to the location of where her PC is  and where the existing phone line terminates  in the Kitchen and bedroom 1. She has a cord caddy running from Bedroom one to bedroom 3  to feed the ADSL to the router.  She will need to buy a set of  two or three cordless phones and plug the basestation into the phone port on the wireless router (assuming  they also cut off the old analog line at the same time)  using  the others as local powered remotes.  Hope the supply a RJ11 cord with the cordless. 

 

 

Assuming you mean one of those reel "cord caddies" these should be avoided at all costs and could even be the cause of her xDSL issues. These are flat cable that's incredibly good at picking up noise and in every case I've ever seen one used they have resulted in severe (not even minor or modest) degradation of the xDSL connection.

 

 


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  # 1784580 19-May-2017 08:34
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Sorry to slightly derail the thread.

 

I'm in a shared driveway situation, and one of two neighbours hasn't bothered to respond to consent, so come June 9th if I submit another request will they have 30 days to respond otherwise it's deemed implied consent?


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  # 1784583 19-May-2017 08:42
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It won't be 30 days, more like 15 days.

 

They will still need to do a design, send the design out, then issue a notice 5 days before coming onsite. I would expect 2-3 months under normal circumstances for it to get done

 

Did you try talking to the neighbor and seeing if they would sign the form?


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  # 1784595 19-May-2017 09:17
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Nah not yet, we're only renting so I didn't want to extend too much effort, but it's on the cards to go talk to them.

 

Our VDSL recently bumped up to 70/20 after dDLM as well so felt even less motivated to go chat


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  # 1784608 19-May-2017 09:54
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nas:

 

Sorry to slightly derail the thread.

 

I'm in a shared driveway situation, and one of two neighbours hasn't bothered to respond to consent, so come June 9th if I submit another request will they have 30 days to respond otherwise it's deemed implied consent?

 

 

Depends what category the install is, if it's a more involved category 3 then consent is still needed.


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  # 1784911 19-May-2017 18:33
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I imagine it'll just be a small cut across the driveway depending on which side they come from, if not it's all grass up one side from the kerb to ours


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