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484 posts

Ultimate Geek

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  #160452 28-Aug-2008 13:53
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coffeebaron:
Balchy:
coffeebaron: It's still a phone line


Not under the TSO's definition I believe - again I may be wrong....

Yea, who knows? I guess another reason why the TSO is so in need of an overhaul.


Amen brother lol - it served its purpose a decade or so ago, but its aged rather poorly....




For billions of years since the outset of time, every single one of your ancestors survived, every single person on your Mum and Dads side, successfully looked after and passed onto you life.  What are the chances of that like?

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  #160453 28-Aug-2008 14:02
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Balchy:

As far as I am aware the TSO only covers POTS access and dial up, not broadband and therefore voip?  Hence it is not applicable in these cases - feel free to correct me if I'm wrong

 

The TSO takes into account the net *revenue* a loss-making line makes, so it includes additional services like tolls and broadband. That's so Telecom isn't subsidised for a line that makes a profit overall. However it doesn't include the *costs* of providing those additional services - if Telecom makes a loss providing broadband to rural customers then that's it commercial decision. 





 

 
 
 
 


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  #160457 28-Aug-2008 14:11
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coffeebaron:
Balchy:
coffeebaron: It's still a phone line


Not under the TSO's definition I believe - again I may be wrong....

Yea, who knows? I guess another reason why the TSO is so in need of an overhaul.


And as for naked DSL, I expect this would be treated as revenue just like the revenue of any other additional service. Or they may simply remove that whole line from the calculation.

 

(TSO determinations are a bit behind. THey haven't got up to this year yet so that haven't had to consider naked DSL/LLU.)





 

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  #160510 28-Aug-2008 16:36
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well i guess its just a matter of time now for the other ISPs to increase their prices or they'll feel the pinch too now that the UBA trial has ended.

will be interesting to see how things settle down after they all see eachothers pricing.


oh and kiwilink is a virtual ISP, they are probably getting squeezed by their host.

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  #160513 28-Aug-2008 16:41
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insane:
oh and kiwilink is a virtual ISP, they are probably getting squeezed by their host.

Hmm, interesting - I noticed their VoIP stuff seemed to have a bit of a Slingshot feel to it.




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  #160514 28-Aug-2008 17:02
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Before I had pots telephone, caller id service on it, 10 gigs xtra flat rate adventure plan - which i've been up to 14 gigs without being slowed down, and i used an answer phone for messages. Free local calling. Monthly cost $105

Now it's 10 gigs and $2.00 + GST after that. VOIP with charged local calling and sure all the smart services that go with it, unlike telecom though the caller id doesn't show up on phone so can't see who's ringing before answer. Total cost $90 per month plus anything extra spent.

Hopefully they'll honour the voip deal when signed up and give it free to me, otherwise for anyone else joining up there's another fixed cost of $5 a month plus GST (now fixed cost over $95 a month)

If other ISP's in same boat then I don't see a big future for naked DSL.

Admittedly compared to xtra's service the internet runs lot better, but then that was ADSL1.

If this is the case i'll probably cancel net at end of contract and hopefully some wireless solutions come along (don't need fastest internet on planet). Looks like it costs an arm and leg to use a bit of wire that thousands of other people are sharing.

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  #160516 28-Aug-2008 17:19
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rugrat:
Now it's 10 gigs and $2.00 + GST after that. VOIP with charged local calling and sure all the smart services that go with it, unlike telecom though the caller id doesn't show up on phone so can't see who's ringing before answer. Total cost $90 per month plus anything extra spent.


My suggestion would be to move ISP's. There has been no increase from Telecom and there are ISP's offering far better Naked ADSL plans than what you are now on.

 
 
 
 


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  #160518 28-Aug-2008 17:38
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sbiddle:
rugrat:
Now it's 10 gigs and $2.00 + GST after that. VOIP with charged local calling and sure all the smart services that go with it, unlike telecom though the caller id doesn't show up on phone so can't see who's ringing before answer. Total cost $90 per month plus anything extra spent.


My suggestion would be to move ISP's. There has been no increase from Telecom and there are ISP's offering far better Naked ADSL plans than what you are now on.


I agree,

If you need help with this send me a PM




Hmmmm




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  #160606 29-Aug-2008 01:44
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Thankyou good to know telecom hasn't increased wholesale rate. Maybe there's a drive to push the smaller ones out with cabinatisation (limited space) as someone above mentioned supras rates have hiked up as well, but at least it sounds like they're honouring contracts with existing customers.

Can't see them getting new customers though at those rates, so hopefully something will change.

If I ditch ship $150 charge as mentioned earlier, 4 months remaining. If it's just the small isp's (I think they're small ones not 100% sure) then will find something suitable later, thankyou.

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Snap Internet

  #160642 29-Aug-2008 10:00
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rugrat: Thankyou good to know telecom hasn't increased wholesale rate.


I don't like to barge in on discussions regarding other ISPs, but I can assure you that Telecom Wholesale have changed their pricing structure, Snap has similar price changes scheduled for 'non-urban' naked DSL customers.




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Ultimate Geek

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  #160659 29-Aug-2008 10:25
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RalphFromSnap:
rugrat: Thankyou good to know telecom hasn't increased wholesale rate.


I don't like to barge in on discussions regarding other ISPs, but I can assure you that Telecom Wholesale have changed their pricing structure, Snap has similar price changes scheduled for 'non-urban' naked DSL customers.


As Sbiddle said the structure has not changed it is the fact that they can now accurately enforce it.  As far as I am aware and yet again correct me if I am wrong this was always on the cards, so laying the blame on telecom in this instance I dont think is overly fair - the isps should have known this was just around the corner and either set their pricing accurately in the first place or given the customers a heads up?




For billions of years since the outset of time, every single one of your ancestors survived, every single person on your Mum and Dads side, successfully looked after and passed onto you life.  What are the chances of that like?

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Snap Internet

  #160669 29-Aug-2008 10:47
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I agree it isn't fair to blame Telecom soley for this problem, though until very recently it was near impossible to distinguish between an Urban and a Non-urban service location. We now have tools available to us that will give a result in a timely fashion making it easier to fetch pricing and service information.

There is still hot debate in our office regarding what we will do, and how we will do it regarding this. I'll post something when we have decided.




Snap

0800 BROADBAND (276 232)
www.snap.net.nz

@SnapInternet on Twitter
Snap Internet on Facebook

Our Social Media Team:
^RO Ricky - Technical Lead
^AT Ashleigh - Retail Marketing Coordinator



484 posts

Ultimate Geek

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  #160671 29-Aug-2008 10:52
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RalphFromSnap: I agree it isn't fair to blame Telecom soley for this problem, though until very recently it was near impossible to distinguish between an Urban and a Non-urban service location. We now have tools available to us that will give a result in a timely fashion making it easier to fetch pricing and service information.

There is still hot debate in our office regarding what we will do, and how we will do it regarding this. I'll post something when we have decided.


Thats fair enough - heres a spur of the moment idea - haven't run any kind of numbers so don't know if it makes fiscal sense - undercut your competitors by making your naked dsl a "loss leader" increase your over usage fee's and bank on customers getting add-ons to make up the difference

Supermarkets and a lot of other industries do it all the time, granted their product range is slightly larger but like I say I haven;t run the number and am not in the telco industry any longer so take what I say with a grain of salt lol




For billions of years since the outset of time, every single one of your ancestors survived, every single person on your Mum and Dads side, successfully looked after and passed onto you life.  What are the chances of that like?

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  #160673 29-Aug-2008 10:57
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so in light of all this good information (thank you everyone) it makes the whole naked DSL pretty much priced out of the market now.

What options are there for the many people that want Internet services, but not the phone services.
I was using Telstra's cable network previously, but due to being located down a 'long' driveway they wanted to charge obscene amount for cable charges which isnt viable when renting.

ps i'm in Christchurch (urban)



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  #160771 29-Aug-2008 16:52
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Only thing I don't get is why have the urban rates gone up?? You'd think if they couldn't tell urban from rural they would have averaged the charge, but now that it's charge rural more the urban rate has gone up more, doesn't make sense.

I agree with highlanda that anyone that just wants naked dsl without phone is now priced out of market.
Means pots was only costing $15.00 above the naked dsl price. (with caller id and line maintance, take them out and it's about $10.00)  This is crazy in my view.

Thanks snap person for info, just someone else posted that telecom rates haven't gone up, hard to get to grips with what's going on.

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