Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.


View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5
801 posts

Ultimate Geek

Trusted
Full Flavour

  #2463500 16-Apr-2020 15:13
Send private message quote this post

Have to agree, having a single customer pay $50k-$250k (it does happen!) to extend the Chorus UFB network and then all the neighbours piggyback for next to nothing is a poor situation.

We're working on a co-op model for semi-rural communities, sounds like this might fit.

OP, feel free to PM me the address and we could look further into it.

I'll add that co-op isn't a silver bullet, getting a bunch of neighbours to all agree to fund something like this is very hard.



5 posts

Wannabe Geek


  #2463504 16-Apr-2020 15:24
Send private message quote this post

 

 

Wheelbarrow01:

 

There used to be a rural density option that chorus subdisised a ton to off something like this.
In general though. If there is a whole block wanting to get connected up and willing to pay , that would be done as a community build rather than POA.

 

This segues nicely to my next point. I have been in touch with the OP who gave me his address, and I note it is on a shared right of way with 7-8 other houses, and there are another 7-8 houses on the main road very close by. I have therefore lightly touched on the concept of community fibre build and suggested he approach his neighbours to guage their interest.

 

 

I appreciate your help in this instance and we had been given that recommendation prior. Our only struggles with that solution are that most of the demographic in the area are content on ADSL (despite the likely jump in housing price by installing fibre), and the absolute pain in the neck it is to try to organise a community build when explaining the price. Hypothetical: I tell them all it costs 205k but it'll go down as more people buy in. People would likely expect to be paying the price after 8 people, which realistically won't happen with my neighbours. People will opt out after hearing the price isn't what they expected, and then the people willing to pay the realistic amount required for Fibre would then be discouraged by the price jump. No harm in trying, at least.


 
 
 
 


3878 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  #2463506 16-Apr-2020 15:26
Send private message quote this post

BlinkyBill:

 

If I paid the full cost for something, wouldn’t I own it, or at least exclusive rights to it? 

 

Why couldn’t the OP sell rights to use the fibre, potentially for up to 140 houses, not to mention downstream houses. Why couldn’t the OP put that condition into the contract?

 

 

I’m sure the OP is free to build and operate their own fibre (or electricity network which operates the same way). It’s going to require several orders of magnitude more investment than they are suggesting here.


3878 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  #2463507 16-Apr-2020 15:29
Send private message quote this post

GGJohnstone:

 

What a nonsense.

 

The infrastructure install is not in a contest as regards price.  Clever and relevant people have priced it. 

 

However the proxi ownership is with Chorus.  They derive income from it in the form of rental and repair and no doubt from the install itself.

 

The quote to permit the queue jumping by OP should be in the form of a loan to Chorus.    Favorable term and rate to be agreed or no go and barbecue them.  They do not need the work.

 

 

It’s not “proxi ownership” by Chorus, the network is fully owned by Chorus.

 

The OP is in a location that does not have an ROI that gets over Chorus hurdle rate for investment. It’s pretty simple really.


1292 posts

Uber Geek

Subscriber

  #2463529 16-Apr-2020 15:43
Send private message quote this post

Handle9:

 

The OP is in a location that does not have an ROI that gets over Chorus hurdle rate for investment. It’s pretty simple really.

 

 

 

 

So if OP provides the investment capital for Chorus, he also gets the reward of paying for service over that equipment afterwards ? Nice (for Chorus).

 

 

 

Surprised no one has suggested satellite to OP - farmside and what not. Much lower investment , not sure what the monthly costs are though. 


3878 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  #2463530 16-Apr-2020 15:47
Send private message quote this post

elpenguino:

 

Handle9:

 

The OP is in a location that does not have an ROI that gets over Chorus hurdle rate for investment. It’s pretty simple really.

 

 

 

 

So if OP provides the investment capital for Chorus, he also gets the reward of paying for service over that equipment afterwards ? Nice (for Chorus).

 

 

 

Surprised no one has suggested satellite to OP - farmside and what not. Much lower investment , not sure what the monthly costs are though. 

 

 

I’m sure Chorus are salivating over $50 a month gross revenue for a $200k investment.


1292 posts

Uber Geek

Subscriber

  #2463531 16-Apr-2020 15:57
Send private message quote this post

Handle9:

 

elpenguino:

 

So if OP provides the investment capital for Chorus, he also gets the reward of paying for service over that equipment afterwards ? Nice (for Chorus).

 

Surprised no one has suggested satellite to OP - farmside and what not. Much lower investment , not sure what the monthly costs are though. 

 

 

I’m sure Chorus are salivating over $50 a month gross revenue for a $200k investment.

 

 

In my question, Chorus' investment is zero. And of course they charge for their service afterwards, thats the way it works in reality, I was just pointing out the unfairness.

 

If you want to avoid those on going subscriptions you need to own the network in which case you'll be paying to support it anyway.

 

This would only work out better for OP if he invests less or can sell access to the network to offset his costs, but I'm guessing he would already be in the telco business if that was his thing.


 
 
 
 


3593 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

  #2463581 16-Apr-2020 16:09
Send private message quote this post

Handle9:

 

I’m sure Chorus are salivating over $50 a month gross revenue for a $200k investment.

 

 

Let's say they got 50% of the 140 houses connected though, $50/month x 70 houses x 12 months = $42,000/year. Not sure on the upkeep costs but lets say 25%, so $31,500 on $200k investment - probably not bad in the infrastructure world??





Speedtest 2019-10-14


3878 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  #2463595 16-Apr-2020 16:30
Send private message quote this post

Zeon:

 

Handle9:

 

I’m sure Chorus are salivating over $50 a month gross revenue for a $200k investment.

 

 

Let's say they got 50% of the 140 houses connected though, $50/month x 70 houses x 12 months = $42,000/year. Not sure on the upkeep costs but lets say 25%, so $31,500 on $200k investment - probably not bad in the infrastructure world??

 

 

Do you really think Chorus are making a 75% net margin? Chorus have operating costs which will make up the majority of the that $50 of gross revenue.

 

While I don’t know I’d guess that you are looking at more like a 10% net margin. $4200pa on $300k investment (to connect 70 houses at $1300 each on top of the network build).

 

You can invest your money that way, I’d keep mine in the bank rather than take a 1.4% return.


5733 posts

Uber Geek


  #2463599 16-Apr-2020 16:39
Send private message quote this post

It is quite staggering that we have a model under which Chorus can: -

 

  • Require a user to pay a six figure sum for infrastructure to connect them to fibre,
  • Then get to own that infrastructure for $0.00,
  • Then get to connect other users,
  • Then charge ISPs to use the infrastructure,
  • All with no recompense to the user that originally paid for it all,

Some of those things in isolation would be reasonable, collectively they are a rip-off.





Mike

875 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #2463607 16-Apr-2020 16:51
Send private message quote this post

Welcome to public utilities in general, not just chorus


3878 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  #2463610 16-Apr-2020 16:55
Send private message quote this post

MikeAqua:

It is quite staggering that we have a model under which Chorus can: -



  • Require a user to pay a six figure sum for infrastructure to connect them to fibre,

  • Then get to own that infrastructure for $0.00,

  • Then get to connect other users,

  • Then charge ISPs to use the infrastructure,

  • All with no recompense to the user that originally paid for it all,


Some of those things in isolation would be reasonable, collectively they are a rip-off.



What is the practical alternative? There is less than zero incentive for Chorus to connect these types of properties and once connected they likely still.dont make much money as the cost of servicing a remote fault will be higher than similar properties in more built up areas.


545 posts

Ultimate Geek

Subscriber

  #2463612 16-Apr-2020 16:58
Send private message quote this post

MikeAqua:

 

It is quite staggering that we have a model under which Chorus can: -

 

  • Require a user to pay a six figure sum for infrastructure to connect them to fibre,
  • Then get to own that infrastructure for $0.00,
  • Then get to connect other users,
  • Then charge ISPs to use the infrastructure,
  • All with no recompense to the user that originally paid for it all,

Some of those things in isolation would be reasonable, collectively they are a rip-off.

 

 

Your last point is where the problem lies, as other users come on board, the original person who funded the project should be compensated

 

better still

 

I think you are either in a area funded by the government or you are not, and if you can get fibre or not should be determined by that


545 posts

Ultimate Geek

Subscriber

  #2463614 16-Apr-2020 16:59
Send private message quote this post

Handle9:

 


What is the practical alternative?

 


 

Those properties stay on copper


545 posts

Ultimate Geek

Subscriber

  #2463617 16-Apr-2020 17:02
Send private message quote this post

loceff13:

 

Welcome to public utilities in general, not just chorus

 

 

yup getting natural gas is another example, first person pays, its not right though.


1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5
View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic



Twitter and LinkedIn »



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:





News »

National Institute for Health Innovation develops treatment app for gambling
Posted 6-Jul-2020 16:25


Nokia 2.3 to be available in New Zealand
Posted 6-Jul-2020 12:30


Menulog change colours as parent company merges with Dutch food delivery service
Posted 2-Jul-2020 07:53


Techweek2020 goes digital to make it easier for Kiwis to connect and learn
Posted 2-Jul-2020 07:48


Catalyst Cloud launches new Solutions Hub to support their kiwi Partners and Customers
Posted 2-Jul-2020 07:44


Microsoft to help New Zealand job seekers acquire new digital skills needed for the COVID-19 economy
Posted 2-Jul-2020 07:41


Hewlett Packard Enterprise introduces new HPE GreenLake cloud services
Posted 24-Jun-2020 08:07


New cloud data protection services from Hewlett Packard Enterprise
Posted 24-Jun-2020 07:58


Hewlett Packard Enterprise unveils HPE Ezmeral, new software portfolio and brand
Posted 24-Jun-2020 07:10


Apple reveals new developer technologies to foster the next generation of apps
Posted 23-Jun-2020 15:30


Poly introduces solutions for Microsoft Teams Rooms
Posted 23-Jun-2020 15:14


Lenovo launches new ThinkPad P Series mobile workstations
Posted 23-Jun-2020 09:17


Lenovo brings Linux certification to ThinkPad and ThinkStation Workstation portfolio
Posted 23-Jun-2020 08:56


Apple introduces new features for iPhone iOS14 and iPadOS 14
Posted 23-Jun-2020 08:28


Apple announces Mac transition to Apple silicon
Posted 23-Jun-2020 08:18



Geekzone Live »

Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.


Support Geekzone »

Our community of supporters help make Geekzone possible. Click the button below to join them.

Support Geezone on PressPatron



Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.