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671 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 172550 21-Oct-2008 16:25
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TinyTim:
Thus, in NZ, noone will be able to afford high speed broadband because of the high cost of deployment. Not until our GDP per capita is high enough that the high cost seems low.


Our GDP per capita is irrelevant in the short term, when concerning infrastructure spending, so even if it did magically increase a lot, it wouldn't help any time soon.


TinyTim:Or we have significant public investment.


Exactly. This is the only answer for NZ, so it's useless to argue all day long about population, population density, GDP per capita, etc, because massive public investment is the only thing that's going to get us out of this mess, and we should have done it a long time ago.

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  Reply # 172661 22-Oct-2008 02:10
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Anyone remember how much telstra spend on cabling up wellington? I seem to remember approx 22mil

Actually i thought it was Saturn networks that paid for that tellstra just bought it out and stopped the roll out it was supposed to be here in the bay a couple or more yrs ago which means we pay more for our Phone and get less for our broadband we dont evan get into the telstra big back yard which would suck if i made tollcalls at all

 
 
 
 


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  Reply # 172663 22-Oct-2008 06:50
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Athlonite: Anyone remember how much telstra spend on cabling up wellington? I seem to remember approx 22mil



From memory it was more like $500 million in total across all 3 regions. I'm sure somebody around here from TCL could probably give a more accurate figure. It was certainly far far greater than $22 million.

Edit: Found this from 1998 on the MED website.

  • Saturn launches a residential local telephony service in the Hutt Valley, with a rate of NZ$29.95 per month compared to Telecom's NZ$35.66. This is the first residential local wireline competition in New Zealand. Saturn subsequently expanded to part of the Kapiti Coast and some of Wellington's western suburbs by the end of December. Saturn is continuing to expand its residential telephony service to all of Kapiti and Wellington city and suburbs. It intends to complete its investment of NZ$230 million in the Wellington area by the end of 1999.



  • 891 posts

    Ultimate Geek
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      Reply # 172671 22-Oct-2008 07:57
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    Screeb:
    TinyTim:
    Thus, in NZ, noone will be able to afford high speed broadband because of the high cost of deployment. Not until our GDP per capita is high enough that the high cost seems low.


    Our GDP per capita is irrelevant in the short term, when concerning infrastructure spending, so even if it did magically increase a lot, it wouldn't help any time soon.

     

    It affects affordability - and if noone can afford the service then investors aren't going to get their money back. So it affects the business plan which drives the infrastructure spending.





     

    491 posts

    Ultimate Geek
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      Reply # 172674 22-Oct-2008 08:02
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    In Japan the mobile phones are way ahead as well.

    671 posts

    Ultimate Geek
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      Reply # 172807 22-Oct-2008 16:10
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    TinyTim:
    Screeb:
    TinyTim:
    Thus, in NZ, noone will be able to afford high speed broadband because of the high cost of deployment. Not until our GDP per capita is high enough that the high cost seems low.


    Our GDP per capita is irrelevant in the short term, when concerning infrastructure spending, so even if it did magically increase a lot, it wouldn't help any time soon.

    It affects affordability - and if noone can afford the service then investors aren't going to get their money back. So it affects the business plan which drives the infrastructure spending.



    We already pay far more than those countries with better broadband...

    Anyway, I was talking about the short term.

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    Master Geek
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      Reply # 172828 22-Oct-2008 17:10
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    Since there is such a squeeze on expensive international bandwidth with a number of ISPs at present (eg national speed tests going almost as fast as your sync rate and international being slow in peak times), I can't see what help fibre to the home or gigabit connections would be in the short or even medium term.  Though I do admit it makes a good election promise.  If national speeds are important and your ISP doesn't peer, move to one who does and tell the old one why you are leaving.

    In the next few years as Telecom cabentise people's sync speeds will increase and VDSL2+ will become a reality, so the fast national speeds will be there - in reality they already are here for many people, unless of course you like giving your money to an ISP who sends your traffic on a tiki tour.  Most people don't care because most of the content they want to look at isn't in NZ. Instead of Fibre to the home maybe the government should investigate buying a large chunk of the southern cross cable? :)

    I use KAREN in my job - even when you do get a gigabit connection on a 10gig national backbone (622mbit to USA) there are still plenty of factors that will prevent you from getting anywhere near the speeds your connection is capable of, even to a national server.. Hard drive speed, TCP window size, latency and so on come into play. After a lot of experimentation using jumbo frames (9000 byte mtu) myself in Auckland and a person in invermay managed to get around 480MBit on speed tests.  Add 200ms+ of latency to overseas servers and your TCP window size has to be huge to get even 100mbit.  google long fat networks.

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    Wannabe Geek


      Reply # 172868 22-Oct-2008 19:35
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    My personal opinion is that for NZers to have decent internet has nothing to do with bandwidth, its to do with content.  Until such time we have an economical way to stimulate individuals and companies to provide content and service via the local networks we could be provided a wet piece of string and get the same result as we have now.

    This is in line with some of the posts already submitted around Japan gets most of its content from Japan.  I'm currently involved in running fibre around Christchurch, and its great, but I always ask myself whats the benefit of what we are doing and I come to the same solution... we must be able to get content to individuals and to companies.

    Why lay fibre... well if you are doing a green fields network you would be crazy to lay anything else.  You spend the money digging the hole in the ground not what you put in the hole.

    1000mbps to the home, great idea but i also want to deliver 100Gbps to the company that provdes great services to the user across the local network.

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