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  Reply # 356967 27-Jul-2010 10:18
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muppet: @mgcarley: Again, appreciate the time you took to reply.

The wheels on this farce have now pretty much totally fallen off though as your lack of technical knowledge is clearly showing. Of course, why you'd even be attempting to answer this instead of your Technical team makes no sense to me, but there's obviously no Technical team is there?


My staff will be disappointed to learn of their existential quandary.

muppet: It's pretty obvious why you won't share your AS number. It doesn't exist. In case people reading are thinking "Maybe it's best to keep it secret?" it isn't. It's a public knowledge thing, the AS of the company I work for is 17492 for example.


Good for you. I actually felt it best to not reveal it since you seem so intent on snooping and at this time I am not able to make certain information public.

muppet: I wasn't referring to you being a competitor to HNS when it comes advertising address space. What I mean is HNS giving you IP Address space of theirs and then supposedly allowing you to advertise that space to a competitor _of theirs_. This is how it'd have to work in your imaginary situation and, unsurprisingly, it doesn't work like that. If you want to multi-home you have to have your own IP Address allocation(s).


Perhaps you should have been clearer in your question then. We do, but we don't (have our own IP space). 

muppet: More-or-less the same routes/subnets? Sadly, routers don't care for more-or-less the same when it comes to routing. This is most absurd statement yet.


Anyone with one of those IPs will show up as being on HNS network, yes, however within their network they are addresses being utilized by my company for the time being and will be routed accordingly.

Since the bandwidth is purchased as part of a consortium, they all have to go to the same physical address/building. The lines all feed in to the same NOC and traffic destined for our network goes out some different cables over to our building.

How is this situation so difficult to imagine? Especially considering the same will have to happen for Hayai NZ until such time as we can give APNIC a reason to allocate us even a single IP address.

muppet: Finally, for APNIC to allocate IP Address Space and AS Numbers these days, they want to see equipment invoices with the name of the company requesting the IP Address space on those invoices. This is to stop people hording, you have to prove you have purchased the equipment on which the addresses will be advertised. You're not even sure if you might have registered under another name? Even though you can remember the names of people you've spoken to at APNIC?


At which point did I say I was not sure that we had registered under another name? This is part of the reason I did not tell you the AS number to begin with.

You're also answering your own question as to why we don't yet have any IP space - we can't show them an invoice for 10,000 customer routers yet (and thus can't show them that we have any number of active customers) and so they won't give us any IP space.

muppet: @everyone else: I won't annoy you anymore (sorry, people) posting in this thread. No doubt mgcarley will reply with 10 mumbo jumbo reasons as to why what I've said is wrong but there's no point arguing with someone who will just blindly make stuff up.


If you say so - just because I won't reveal every single detail to you doesn't make me wrong, but of course, as I've said, I don't really care about your opinion or whether you want to argue the toss. I don't mind proving you wrong by carrying out the previously mentioned plans, and I thank you for your input.

@muppet - Your name isn't Jonathan (or similar), is it?

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  Reply # 357013 27-Jul-2010 11:10
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@mgcarley: Again, you misunderstand (or don't know?) how APNIC works. You don't need to show them Invoices for 10,000 CPE's. Showing them the Invoices for the BRAS device(s) you'll be terminating the customers on is enough.

Also I can't see how you'd ever have been given an AS number seeing as you state you haven't been allocated any IP Addresses yet. I guess you're going to call in the one month clause though? Well, you have to. It's your only out.

APNIC are quite happy to allocate addresses, providing you can show how you'll use them. I'd say "Building a new ISP, here's the invoices for my core network devices, my technical staffs contact details" would probably pass that litmus test, wouldn't you?

My name isn't Jonathan, no, it's Tim.




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  Reply # 357053 27-Jul-2010 12:20
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muppet: @mgcarley: Again, you misunderstand (or don't know?) how APNIC works. You don't need to show them Invoices for 10,000 CPE's. Showing them the Invoices for the BRAS device(s) you'll be terminating the customers on is enough.


I also had to show them company incorporation documents, subscription projections and license information too, but for the number of customers we had signed up last August, their answer was that we should utilize someone elses IP addresses until we need about 4000 unique addresses. Our options were HNS or Railtel. The former was an easier arrangement.

muppet: Also I can't see how you'd ever have been given an AS number seeing as you state you haven't been allocated any IP Addresses yet. I guess you're going to call in the one month clause though? Well, you have to. It's your only out.


Nope. Got that with the associate membership. We had to have our own to peer with Google, and to have an Akamai box and to peer with Railtel and to peer at NIXI.

muppet: APNIC are quite happy to allocate addresses, providing you can show how you'll use them. I'd say "Building a new ISP, here's the invoices for my core network devices, my technical staffs contact details" would probably pass that litmus test, wouldn't you?


I disagree. These days, APNIC is absolutely NOT happy to dole out IP addresses willy-nilly - policies have been changing rather significantly for the past year or so, and they won't give out IPs unless we can justify the requirement for them, otherwise what's to stop me from simply buying something like a /15 block of addresses and possibly not using them if we don't reach our target subscription levels? We can afford it... it's only 500k rupees or so which is really quite a minor cost in the overall scheme of things - we couldn't even lease fiber to a single neighbourhood for that.

I expect the policies are to prevent startups similar to mine with under a certain number of customers from reserving more IP space than they actually need/can justify. Especially with the number of regional or even neighbourhood-specific ISPs (well, cable operators offering ISP-like service anyway) in India, I'm not entirely surprised.

I hesitate to speculate that because it may cause the breakup of a larger block which may mean it's harder for them to sell (even though in technical terms it shouldn't matter).

From what I understand, /22 is the lower limit - just ~1,000 customers - and so we do actually need to give them genuine numbers on how many nodes are on the network, but the policy is MUST have used at least a /24 from our upstream provider (or in our case, a parallel provider), which is what we're doing. I suspect that within days of service commencing, we will immediately apply for a bigger block based on actual subscriptions, but the block we've been allocated from HNS' address pool should suffice for about a month.

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  Reply # 357071 27-Jul-2010 12:51
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You got your AS Number (that you won't share) with your associate membership? What, was it like a prize or something? So APNIC don't even follow their own requirements policy anymore, they're just handing out ASN's to anyone?

APNIC's policies have changed over the last year a lot? Could you provide some sources for this new-to-me piece of information? They have a very clear, detailed website and their policies are published for all to see. Your apparent dealings with them are in stark contrast to mine over the last 6 months.

Why would Google Peer with you? You don't have your own address space. You don't have any customers yet. What possible advantage would Google have to peer with you?

Akamai? Read This. Notice this sentence: "Finally, Akamai ships free kit to any network with enough traffic. Unfortunately, the levels are significant, I believe it is 75 or 100 Mbps of Akamai traffic. (Hey, those servers ain't cheap!) But the requirement may be lower in .nz because of the higher cost down there."

You have no customers. Why would Akamai have given you boxes to install in your network? A /22 of network space isn't going to excite them into shipping servers.

Why not tell us your AS? Then I'll shut up and apologise. There is no possible secrecy around it, it's the Internet equivalent of a PostCode.

Tim




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  Reply # 357081 27-Jul-2010 13:07
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muppet: You got your AS Number (that you won't share) with your associate membership? What, was it like a prize or something? So APNIC don't even follow their own requirements policy anymore, they're just handing out ASN's to anyone?


Did you miss the part about us having connectivity to multiple providers AND being peered at an IX? We've fulfilled both of the criteria from the beginning.

muppet: APNIC's policies have changed over the last year a lot? Could you provide some sources for this new-to-me piece of information? They have a very clear, detailed website and their policies are published for all to see. Your apparent dealings with them are in stark contrast to mine over the last 6 months.


Exactly. I assume you're dealing with them as a provider with existing customers, we're dealing with them as a provider with none. Literally, from scratch.

muppet: Why would Google Peer with you? You don't have your own address space. You don't have any customers yet. What possible advantage would Google have to peer with you?

Akamai? Read This. Notice this sentence: "Finally, Akamai ships free kit to any network with enough traffic. Unfortunately, the levels are significant, I believe it is 75 or 100 Mbps of Akamai traffic. (Hey, those servers ain't cheap!) But the requirement may be lower in .nz because of the higher cost down there."

You have no customers. Why would Akamai have given you boxes to install in your network? A /22 of network space isn't going to excite them into shipping servers.


These arrangements are likewise part of our coalition with HNS - part of the reason we chose to work with them is that they have been receptive and flexible to new ideas, whereas the others were not (at least on the last-mile front), and this has been the easiest way for us to get as much on-net content from day 1, and considering the upcoming joint ventures coming up between us, is logical from our end.

And it's 40mbit/s according to Akamai's Bangalore office.

muppet: Why not tell us your AS? Then I'll shut up and apologise. There is no possible secrecy around it, it's the Internet equivalent of a PostCode.


It's not the ASN I'm concerned about. 

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  Reply # 357117 27-Jul-2010 14:14
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@mgcarley: I still don't understand though, how can you be peering with people when you don't have your own address space to advertise?
One of the fundamental things about multi-homing is having your own address space. That's because ISP's don't like it when you advertise address space they've allocated to you, to other ISP's. It's not how the Internet works.

You claim to be peering with multiple people, but to not have your own address space. How is that working? Based on this, I disbelieve you're peered with anyone. Thus I disbelieve you have your own AS.

Can you explain how your coalition with HNS means that Akamai will give you their boxes for traffic purposes? You waffle on about HNS being "receptive and flexible to new ideas" but that has nothing to do with Akamai. They're the ones that would need to be VERY "receptive and flexible to new ideas." What did they see that made them decide to send you their caching boxes?

How long did it take you to organise peering with Google? Did you organise all the legal contracts etc yourself? On what basis did they agree to peer with you? What AS of Google's are you peering with?

I find your claims of peering agreements very hard to believe. Usually you have a working network, customers, services etc. Then people will want to peer with you. It doesn't work the other way around.

*Why* won't you share your AS Number with us? You could even just PM it to me, I'll verify it then post an apology.

What it sounds like to me is that you're buying a link/bandwidth from HNS. They're giving you some address space. They no doubt have some Akamai boxes in their network, probably peering with Google etc. This I'd believe. It is of course a world away from the spin you're dishing out.

Finally: You have your own ISP, your own Core Network equipment, you peer with multiple peers, you're a APNIC associate, you have Akamai boxes in your network AND you peer with Google, yet your homepage is hosted by http://www.e2enetworks.net.in/ ? A VPS hosting provider? No no, Let me guess! You peer with them too, so it's free?

Tim




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  Reply # 357125 27-Jul-2010 14:30
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richms: I can assure you that around here there are no ducts, and no new overground cables are allowed. There is also no fiber to a cabinet that is not going to be installed for another year.

But why are people so intent on bashing the idea. Its not your money, hes not sponging of the govt at this stage because the govt is still screwing around with their socialist monopoly idea. so if he gets something working, then its great and can be used. If he doesn't, then its no loss to anyone but himself and his investors. (like the ill-fated first media stuff)

IMO we should be encouraging this type of thinking, not telling him why he cant do it.

And if he has tried in india and failed, then that is a good indication that the same mistakes will not happen here too.


A failure in India would imply a risk of failure elsewhere, although likely due to unrelated factors since the commercial environment is so different. However, an ISP startup needs to be flexible and I dont't see holding out for iintegrated CPE as a flexible thing, especially since they would be useless for FTTB in older MDUs that dont have Cat5 distribution. FTTB probably requires a vendor that supplies both Ethernet and VDSL multi-user nodes/ONTs since not all buildings have accessible cable pathways.

We dont really want another ISP going bust, but its true that NZ is not a friendly place for networks that would benefit from overhead cable or even new wireless base stations. Councils take the view that denying a resource consent is better than setting a precedent for competitors who also want to run their own overhead cables. You also need to be aware that Telecom's FTTN network is designed to prevent open access FTTP by leveraging local phone loops and and exchanges. It is allowable to plant an active cabinet OUTSIDE the phone exchange though, so you don't have to pay Telecom too much to host your OLTs unless they make it worthwhile.

HFN might also require their network to be open access, so your business model might include transferring premise fibre drops to HFN in return for shareholding in the overall network (at least until they sign up with CFH).




Qualified in business, certified in fibre, stuck in copper, have to keep going  ^_^



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  Reply # 357152 27-Jul-2010 15:09
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muppet: @mgcarley: I still don't understand though, how can you be peering with people when you don't have your own address space to advertise?
One of the fundamental things about multi-homing is having your own address space. That's because ISP's don't like it when you advertise address space they've allocated to you, to other ISP's. It's not how the Internet works.


Perhaps I'm not explaining myself well enough then, but as of now I feel like I'm bashing my head against a wall.

muppet:
You claim to be peering with multiple people, but to not have your own address space. How is that working? Based on this, I disbelieve you're peered with anyone. Thus I disbelieve you have your own AS.

Can you explain how your coalition with HNS means that Akamai will give you their boxes for traffic purposes? You waffle on about HNS being "receptive and flexible to new ideas" but that has nothing to do with Akamai. They're the ones that would need to be VERY "receptive and flexible to new ideas." What did they see that made them decide to send you their caching boxes?

How long did it take you to organise peering with Google? Did you organise all the legal contracts etc yourself? On what basis did they agree to peer with you? What AS of Google's are you peering with?

I find your claims of peering agreements very hard to believe. Usually you have a working network, customers, services etc. Then people will want to peer with you. It doesn't work the other way around.


Because HNS and we are basically one-and-the-same. I personally was involved in a very small amount of any peering discussions, that's not really my job. While I have a reasonable amount of technical knowledge, I am at C-Level and so there are people far brighter than I handling all the legwork.

muppet: *Why* won't you share your AS Number with us? You could even just PM it to me, I'll verify it then post an apology.


I've said it before and I'll say it again - the company in question is to remain confidential. I don't need an apology. I don't really mind whether and/or what you believe. I'm just going to do my thing.

muppet: What it sounds like to me is that you're buying a link/bandwidth from HNS. They're giving you some address space. They no doubt have some Akamai boxes in their network, probably peering with Google etc. This I'd believe. It is of course a world away from the spin you're dishing out.


No. We pay B/R/T just as they do, only the agreement from B/R/T is a common one. Let's say they buy an STM-16 from Bharti, and let's say that we pay for 8 of those STMs and the arrangement is beneficial because the price is discounted from the next lowest tier (STM-4) rather significantly. The address that this connection feeds in to is indeed HNS' office, however our traffic heads on over to our routers, first a big one on their premises, then onward to our racks in another building a short distance away.

From the outside, it does not look like a separate network, and for all intensive purposes, it isn't. At the moment, the billing does NOT match the topography were you to graph the route of the traffic until we get our own IP-space, in other words, we do not pay HNS, we pay Bharti & so on.

We've also applied to host a Sourceforge mirror as well. Yes, if anything, we are riding a little bit on the coat-tails of HNS, however when the long-term plan is for us to eventually assimilate their retail business then our respective companies can focus more easily: Hayai on the retail side, HNS as our exclusive wholesaler.

And guess what? HNS were also a huge help in getting last-mile access set up. Why? It's significantly easier for them to deal with cable operators on our behalf than have us try to forge new relationships with them - there are some 70 operators JUST in Mumbai. You can only imagine the amount of squabbling that goes on. Just google something like "Mumbai Cable Operator Death" and you'll see what I mean. Being that I'm white, my Hindi/Marathi skills are pretty sh*t, and many of them are sociopaths, I imagine they'd taje any opportunity to screw us.

muppet: Finally: You have your own ISP, your own Core Network equipment, you peer with multiple peers, you're a APNIC associate, you have Akamai boxes in your network AND you peer with Google, yet your homepage is hosted by http://www.e2enetworks.net.in/ ? A VPS hosting provider? No no, Let me guess! You peer with them too, so it's free?


So what? Although our site is currently hosted in one of E2E's hosting spaces (in our case, SpectraNet's DC in Delhi), E2E will be leasing space from us and given that Tarun is a personal friend, I thought it wise to support each others interests. He wants to get big in Streaming Media and so forth and I want to stream it. Win-Win, if you ask me. To paraphrase my mother-in-law: "That's how things work in India, get used to it or get out of my country."

I'm not sure if it's me or what, but it seems that foreign concepts are completely incomprehensible to you.

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  Reply # 357183 27-Jul-2010 16:03
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I have been watching this for a while and I have to now say a few things


Because HNS and we are basically one-and-the-same. I personally was involved in a very small amount of any peering discussions, that's not really my job. While I have a reasonable amount of technical knowledge, I am at C-Level and so there are people far brighter than I handling all the legwork.


You trying to claim you have all this peering etc is like me being a Slingshot customer (I'm not) and claiming that I have my own Akamai farm. you are making bloated claims as to your experience and network prowess.


No. We pay B/R/T just as they do, only the agreement from B/R/T is a common one. Let's say they buy an STM-16 from Bharti, and let's say that we pay for 8 of those STMs and the arrangement is beneficial because the price is discounted from the next lowest tier (STM-4) rather significantly. The address that this connection feeds in to is indeed HNS' office, however our traffic heads on over to our routers, first a big one on their premises, then onward to our racks in another building a short distance away.

From the outside, it does not look like a separate network, and for all intensive purposes, it isn't. At the moment, the billing does NOT match the topography were you to graph the route of the traffic until we get our own IP-space, in other words, we do not pay HNS, we pay Bharti & so on.


Sorry, this does not add up either. These SDH pipes will appear as individual /30 IP linknets so would be clearly visible at a routing layer.



We've also applied to host a Sourceforge mirror as well. Yes, if anything, we are riding a little bit on the coat-tails of HNS, however when the long-term plan is for us to eventually assimilate their retail business then our respective companies can focus more easily: Hayai on the retail side, HNS as our exclusive wholesaler.

And guess what? HNS were also a huge help in getting last-mile access set up. Why? It's significantly easier for them to deal with cable operators on our behalf than have us try to forge new relationships with them - there are some 70 operators JUST in Mumbai. You can only imagine the amount of squabbling that goes on. Just google something like "Mumbai Cable Operator Death" and you'll see what I mean. Being that I'm white, my Hindi/Marathi skills are pretty sh*t, and many of them are sociopaths, I imagine they'd taje any opportunity to screw us.




You are clearly just a customer of theirs, at BEST a downstream minor ISP. You are pretending to be more than this in an attempt to appear more credible.

The real issue I have with this is you have quoted prices and carried on as if you have a clue as to the cost of the broadband path -->

Customer site --> FTTH PON Network --> Local backhaul network --> National backhaul network --> International transit network--> Internet

There are hundreds of ISP's in this country, I have built more than one, and owned parts of one too. It is very clear to me that you have no real clue as to the cost or technical requirements of running such a provider. Do you have -





  • Capital to invest ? NO



  • Experience in successfully delivering such a service ? NO



  • Technical experience ? NO



  • New Ideas (practical ones) ? NO





You should at this point stop wasting everyone’s time pretending you have anything to offer that does not already exist here now.



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  Reply # 357247 27-Jul-2010 17:40
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noroad: 
You trying to claim you have all this peering etc is like me being a Slingshot customer (I'm not) and claiming that I have my own Akamai farm. you are making bloated claims as to your experience and network prowess.


Hells bells. All I said is I've been building something in India for 2 years and now I want to build something in NZ. I never claimed I was some all-knowing wise man godfather of the Internet. Anything I've said is based on things told to me in face-to-face meetings.

noroad: Sorry, this does not add up either. These SDH pipes will appear as individual /30 IP linknets so would be clearly visible at a routing layer.


That sounds reasonably accurate, but that would be something for the technical officer to answer. The fact of the matter is, however, with the setup the way it is, it simply appears as 1 network because the IP block is theirs. When that changes, you'd be able to tell.

noroad: You are clearly just a customer of theirs, at BEST a downstream minor ISP. You are pretending to be more than this in an attempt to appear more credible.


I value your opinion, Tony, however I have invoices that indicate otherwise.

noroad: The real issue I have with this is you have quoted prices and carried on as if you have a clue as to the cost of the broadband path -->

Customer site --> FTTH PON Network --> Local backhaul network --> National backhaul network --> International transit network--> Internet


I haven't yet quoted any prices for NZ, except some speculation about the cost of a basic install to a house. It may cost more, it may cost less. That's why I've been researching and asking around the people who actually build the networks.

noroad: 
There are hundreds of ISP's in this country, I have built more than one, and owned parts of one too. It is very clear to me that you have no real clue as to the cost or technical requirements of running such a provider.


Yes there are a lot of ISPs, but hundreds is an exaggeration.

I am aware of your position within the NZ ISP industry - congratulations on those. But we have been in business for a fairly similar length of time. The only thing that's different is that you've concentrated on this industry while comparatively speaking I am new to it in NZ.

Irrespective, I certainly don't intend to run this thing single handedly and this is why I would hire people like yourself to build and maintain such a network. At this point it could go either way.

noroad: Do you have -



  • Capital to invest ? NO



  • Experience in successfully delivering such a service ? NO



  • Technical experience ? NO



  • New Ideas (practical ones) ? NO




You should at this point stop wasting everyone’s time pretending you have anything to offer that does not already exist here now.


Actually:


  • My bank account would beg to differ.

  • Correct, but that's why I would imagine that hiring people who have said experience - such as yourself - as being a good idea.

  • Actually, I do. Probably not at the detailed level that yourself and many others may have, however that would again be why I would hire someone to do it for me.

  • I never said I had any new ideas. I want to take something that's available overseas and bring it here. Why is that such a problem? 


I'm aware that techies are normally quite... territorial - but there seems to be quite the attitude problem in NZ these days. Perhaps the recession biting a bit hard or something? I'm not seeing it in India, so people remain enthusiastic about projects of all scales.

Anyway, I suppose we can sufficiently suspend this discussion until I've built something tangible to show you. See you in a few weeks.

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  Reply # 357270 27-Jul-2010 18:11
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mgcarley: I'm aware that techies are normally quite... territorial - but there seems to be quite the attitude problem in NZ these days. Perhaps the recession biting a bit hard or something? I'm not seeing it in India, so people remain enthusiastic about projects of all scales.

Anyway, I suppose we can sufficiently suspend this discussion until I've built something tangible to show you. See you in a few weeks.

It's more that people are sceptical about those with no credentials or background making wild claims.  Claims that cannot be validated, and refuse to supply validation. If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.

The industry as a whole owes itself to consumers to not over-promise and talk in ways that are misleading -- and I think that you are really misleading people in forums such as this and IBBF.  I can find no evidence to the contrary.

I don't think anyone here would discourage a new operator from entering any market -- disruptive operators are always welcome -- but pretenders and time wasters that spread FUD are really not welcome.  The non-technical consumer population is niaive and easily misled, which results in unrealistic expectations being set, which leads to disappointment and frustration for both the consumer and the operators.



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  Reply # 357289 27-Jul-2010 18:47
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PenultimateHop: 
It's more that people are sceptical about those with no credentials or background making wild claims.  Claims that cannot be validated, and refuse to supply validation. If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.


Excepting telling one person the AS number, I think I've been pretty open about what, how and why. If I'm actually wrong about anything then so be it - plans can be adjusted.

PenultimateHop: The industry as a whole owes itself to consumers to not over-promise and talk in ways that are misleading -- and I think that you are really misleading people in forums such as this and IBBF.  I can find no evidence to the contrary.


The only mistake I had made was having an ambitious launch date. If we change the delivery method (different CPEs), we could reschedule it to be fairly immediate. Everything else has been ready for a number of months.

PenultimateHop: I don't think anyone here would discourage a new operator from entering any market -- disruptive operators are always welcome -- but pretenders and time wasters that spread FUD are really not welcome.  The non-technical consumer population is niaive and easily misled, which results in unrealistic expectations being set, which leads to disappointment and frustration for both the consumer and the operators.


Opinion is welcome, but I don't believe anything is overstated, nor is there any fear uncertainty & doubt. And I doubt that anyone on this forum is a non-technical consumer.

Anyway... like I've said, best I just build something to prove the concept and potential for a better service.

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  Reply # 357380 27-Jul-2010 21:04
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ripe tends to disagree with your assertions.

HNS has an Autonomous System Number of 38457.

http://www.ris.ripe.net/cgi-bin/lg/index.cgi?rrc=RRC001&query=12&arg=_38457_[0-9]

The above report shows the transit prefixes of AS38457 (Honesty Net Solutions)

Basically there's two ASN's downstream of HNS. Sureprep and Ankhnet. Which one are you?

Hmm. what's that smell?

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  Reply # 357388 27-Jul-2010 21:16
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jmenz: ripe tends to disagree with your assertions.

HNS has an Autonomous System Number of 38457.

http://www.ris.ripe.net/cgi-bin/lg/index.cgi?rrc=RRC001&query=12&arg=_38457_[0-9]

The above report shows the transit prefixes of AS38457 (Honesty Net Solutions)

Basically there's two ASN's downstream of HNS. Sureprep and Ankhnet. Which one are you?

Hmm. what's that smell?

Look it's a secret OK? It's critical to the awesome of the network that NO ONE know it.

Nice work, btw. I didn't bother to do this thinking that they'd have a ton of down-streams. Obviously not.




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  Reply # 357400 27-Jul-2010 21:56
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jmenz: ripe tends to disagree with your assertions.

HNS has an Autonomous System Number of 38457.

http://www.ris.ripe.net/cgi-bin/lg/index.cgi?rrc=RRC001&query=12&arg=_38457_[0-9]

The above report shows the transit prefixes of AS38457 (Honesty Net Solutions)

Basically there's two ASN's downstream of HNS. Sureprep and Ankhnet. Which one are you?

Hmm. what's that smell?


:)

Both of those showing are local cable network operators. HNS supply to quite a number of different cable operators around Mumbai - why would these not show up in their downstream? 

There is at least one other company is in the consortium, goes by the name of "Five Networks", but they're not showing up: do they not exist either? 

India is just not as straightforward as NZ - it's a mess.

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