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  Reply # 523200 19-Sep-2011 19:34
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sbiddle:
VDSL2 is a totally different beast to ADSL2+ however, and there are good reasons to avoid "bad" connections as power levels and noise become critical for good performance.
  


Do you mean that if Chorus let too much people to connect to VDSL2 with attenuations such as 17db (using higher power levels) they will create more noise (and more crosstalks on the lines underground) and therefore may impact on the performance of the other people connected to the same, say, cabinet?

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  Reply # 523244 19-Sep-2011 20:47
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maxzzz:
sbiddle:
VDSL2 is a totally different beast to ADSL2+ however, and there are good reasons to avoid "bad" connections as power levels and noise become critical for good performance.
  


Do you mean that if Chorus let too much people to connect to VDSL2 with attenuations such as 17db (using higher power levels) they will create more noise (and more crosstalks on the lines underground) and therefore may impact on the performance of the other people connected to the same, say, cabinet?


In a nustshell - yes. It's known as the near far phenomenon. Have a read up on upstream power back off (UPBO), this is a something that didn't exist with ADSL, however it's fundamental to get good performance from VDSL2.

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  Reply # 525815 26-Sep-2011 14:21
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Snap are talking about possibly restricting their VDSL so that only Fritz!Boxes can authenticate on their network.

Anyone who has played with the Fritz!Box able to tell me whether the device can act in half bridge mode, or turn off NAT - so I can get a public IP address presented on ethernet0?


I'm currently waiting for mine to be provisioned, but am bringing my own device at this stage (a ZyXEL)

Snap are charging $50 extra / month for VDSL, not bad IMO.      


Hint: Chorus try and charge a $400 wiring fee if DSL has never been activated on the line you are getting connected. Get your ISP to do a Naked ADSL connection first, for which there is no wiring fee if you already have a line coming in, then upgrade it to VDSL.         

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  Reply # 525904 26-Sep-2011 17:12
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jnimmo: Snap are talking about possibly restricting their VDSL so that only Fritz!Boxes can authenticate on their network.

Anyone who has played with the Fritz!Box able to tell me whether the device can act in half bridge mode, or turn off NAT - so I can get a public IP address presented on ethernet0?


I'm currently waiting for mine to be provisioned, but am bringing my own device at this stage (a ZyXEL)

Snap are charging $50 extra / month for VDSL, not bad IMO.      


Hint: Chorus try and charge a $400 wiring fee if DSL has never been activated on the line you are getting connected. Get your ISP to do a Naked ADSL connection first, for which there is no wiring fee if you already have a line coming in, then upgrade it to VDSL.         


http://www.snap.net.nz/support/content/3/47/en/what-is-vdsl.html

I'm on way to getting Snap VDSL now too, just ordered it. Should get good speeds hopefully (have attenuation of 2 down and 0.5 up) 

You do have to buy Snap's Fritz box for $349 also.

Can't wait to see if I can max out my line! 

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  Reply # 525907 26-Sep-2011 17:25
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LOL wtf why are they so expensive? $400 for wiring are you kidding me?





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  Reply # 525914 26-Sep-2011 17:38
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Yep, even if Chorus don't even have to walk outside of the exchange.

Our attenuation isn't great, might have to setup a wireless bridge to somewhere a bit closer to cabinet I fear

wjw



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  Reply # 526038 27-Sep-2011 06:29
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jnimmo: Anyone who has played with the Fritz!Box able to tell me whether the device can act in half bridge mode, or turn off NAT - so I can get a public IP address presented on ethernet0? 


It will run in bridge mode yes, just set it to run as a DSL modem:

 

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  Reply # 527471 29-Sep-2011 22:41
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I have just had VDSL install in Ashburton.  Line attenuation is 21db, am about 750m from the cabinet.
down speed about 16-17Mbps, up speed about 7Mbps.  

Snap is the ISP.  I see they have updated their T&C as well , their old info the other day said no contract if existing ADSL user, not they have changed it.

Installation charge seems excessive, given the installer does less than ADSL, think they are charging a premium just because they can.


 

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  Reply # 527504 30-Sep-2011 06:38
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Thanks wjw.
Dynamiccomputers that is encouraging to hear your speeds as I think we have a similar attenuation

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  Reply # 527506 30-Sep-2011 06:43
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dynamiccomputers: I have just had VDSL install in Ashburton.  Line attenuation is 21db, am about 750m from the cabinet.
down speed about 16-17Mbps, up speed about 7Mbps.  

Snap is the ISP.  I see they have updated their T&C as well , their old info the other day said no contract if existing ADSL user, not they have changed it.

Installation charge seems excessive, given the installer does less than ADSL, think they are charging a premium just because they can.


 


An install includes compulary installation of a VDSL2 filter.

I'm actually surprised your install was done, as once again that's excessive attenuation which has the potential to cause an impact on the network and speeds don't fall anywhere near Telecom wholesale targets.


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  Reply # 527534 30-Sep-2011 08:47
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i wish i knew how people are getting VDSL installed, i have tried twice with snap and both times have been turned down and my Line attenuation is between 15-17db and Snap has told me Telecom wont connect anyone over 12db yet i come here and find people worse than me getting it




Common sense is not as common as you think.


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  Reply # 527708 30-Sep-2011 14:26
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Anyone here in the VDSL behind the scenes arena?
I have failed the VDSL pre-qualification test on the 1st of our 2 naked ADSL lines.

Chorus noted that my attenuation rate did not meet their 10db target.

My "Snap" modem stats below say otherwise....


DSL Status:          Showtime
DSL Modulation Mode: ADSL2+

Downstream Rate:          20747 Kbps

Upstream Rate:                1240 Kbps

Downstream Noise Margin:        12.9db

Upstream Noise Margin:              12.3db

Downstream Line Attenuation: 2.0

Upstream Line Attenuation:       0.5

Downstream Transmit Power:   0.0

Upstream Transmit Power:         12.6
 

Snap are being awesome and are raising another manual test to be completed, but does anyone know if there are outside factors other than attenuation that would fail a connection? (bear in mind VDSL is available according to both Snap and the online Chorus Map)


My "Vodafone" adsl stats are similar also:
                           Downstream      Upstream

SNR Margin (dB):            12.3        12.6

Attenuation (dB):            3.0          0.6

Power (dBm):                 0.0          12.8

Attainable Rate (Kbps):   18148    1192

Rate (Kbps):                  17465    1177
 
 Cheers 

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  Reply # 527719 30-Sep-2011 14:49
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sbiddle:
maxzzz:
sbiddle:
VDSL2 is a totally different beast to ADSL2+ however, and there are good reasons to avoid "bad" connections as power levels and noise become critical for good performance.
  


Do you mean that if Chorus let too much people to connect to VDSL2 with attenuations such as 17db (using higher power levels) they will create more noise (and more crosstalks on the lines underground) and therefore may impact on the performance of the other people connected to the same, say, cabinet?


In a nustshell - yes. It's known as the near far phenomenon. Have a read up on upstream power back off (UPBO), this is a something that didn't exist with ADSL, however it's fundamental to get good performance from VDSL2.

Does this happen with ADSL2+ as well? i believe my connection was a tad faster a couple of years ago when the cabinet was first installed. 

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  Reply # 527738 30-Sep-2011 15:37
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What do they base line attenuation figure on?
e.g. before ADSL2+ I had dB of 12, now with ADSL2+ I have dB of 18

Seems this figure varies quite a lot depending on DSL mode, firmware, hardware etc.




Chorus has spent $1.4 billion on making their xDSL broadband network faster. If your still stuck on ADSL or VDSL, why not spend from $150 on a master filter install to make sure you are getting the most out of your connection?
I install - Naked DSL, DSL Master Splitters, VoIP, data cabling and general computer support for home and small business.
Rural Broadband RBI installer for Ultimate Broadband and Full Flavour

 

Need help in Auckland, Waikato or BoP? Click my email button, or email me direct: [my user name] at geekzonemail dot com


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  Reply # 528047 1-Oct-2011 17:08
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I have had 1 of these fritz boxes now for a about a month. only thing i must say is lacking is that it only has 2 lan ports
I have had it up non stop and not had to preform any restart







Anything I suggest or say is my own thoughts and not provided by anyone else unless stated

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