OpenGL support in Windows Vista

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643 posts

Ultimate Geek

# 56655 31-Dec-2006 13:22

Microsoft could learn from Linux - OpenGL works fine with beryl/compiz but Aero uses the video card's texture memory which breaks OpenGL's use of memory. until it is implemented as a compatability layer between application and DirectX(?)

Nice job Microsoft - you botched the world's most proven graphics API.. But I'm sure the investment in DirectX had noooothing to do with that :-P

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juha

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# 56656 31-Dec-2006 13:25

barf: Microsoft could learn from Linux - OpenGL works fine with beryl but Aero uses the video card's texture memory which breaks OpenGL.. until it is implemented as a compatibility layer between application and DirectX.

Nice job Microsoft - you botched the world's most proven graphics API.. But I'm sure the investment in DirectX had noooothing to do with that.

TOO_LAZY_TO_GOOGLE="true"

Barf, do you have a link for the above with more detail?

Juha

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Ultimate Geek

# 56657 31-Dec-2006 13:30

ALSO_TOO_LAZY_TO_GOOGLE="true"

I think the requirement of a certain amount of video RAM infers that it uses texture memory.. But I read it on some website too.

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weblordpepe

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# 56666 31-Dec-2006 19:15

CRC CHECKSUM ERROR: WTF_AXE 0x4235345666

weblordpepe_OS> geekzone -query microsoft < forum.

Its amazing really. Okay who can be the first one to post an origional product thought up, designed and shipped by Microsoft?

Criteria - it has to be something which didn't exist before Microsoft thought it up. Not something they bought from another company.
Also, the blue-screen doesnt count. I know you were thinking of posting that.

freitasm

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# 56669 31-Dec-2006 19:33

Oh, let me think, but not in Microsoft terms... Operating System: can't possibly think of Mac OS because that's an evolution of an Unix OS. Can't think of Linux because, clearly "Operating System" is something that was created 40 years ago, so Linux is not an original product.

Or isn't this what you are talking about?

C'mon... Clearly things evolve. If everyone would think like you are proposing the only place selling on-line would be Amazon. The only auction site in the entire world would be eBay. Hey, isn't Trademe a copy of eBay?

Everything move ahead and evolve on top of previous iterations.

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# 56672 31-Dec-2006 19:50

freitasm:Operating System: can't possibly think of Mac OS because that's an evolution of an Unix OS.

Wasn't the 'unix evolution' only from OS 10 upwards (included darwin) ?

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barf

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Ultimate Geek

# 56674 31-Dec-2006 20:18

I make no apology for thinking that beryl on Linux is a better, faster 3D GUI than Aero. Please understand that I don't think Aero (or Vista) is terribly bad either. It's just that I would like to see OpenGL support in Vista because lots of games wont work without it, sorry if I dont explain myself enough.

have a happy new year guys :-)

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weblordpepe

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# 56717 2-Jan-2007 09:46

Freitasm does have a good point. Things do evolve & change. Companies do buy other companies & then market their newly bought product as their own. That's not unique to Microsoft.

Really I guess at the end of the day it's difficult to pin-point any real single 'invention' when it comes to software. However it would be nice if Microsoft would admit that there was never any point to Direct3D. And you could tell that right from the beginning. If there is one thing to be said for MS it's that they've wrapped up most of the consumer market & put them all onto the same platform. Unfortunately throughout the years it's been a platform made of rubber bands & half-working modules. Here's hoping that the new OS will be much better.

Although you can tell that alot of the technologies in MS products are there for marketing and business reasons and not for any technical reason. I see OpenGL dying as a API and going to the API afterlife. Probably some giant recycle bin in the sky. And for no good reason.

Methesda

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Geek

# 56834 4-Jan-2007 10:45

Should I use forwardslash or backslash for pathnames?

LOL! That made me laugh.

I have an Uncle that works in Cape Town, providing mobile communications solutions to shanty/ghetto environments... call them what you will. They basically work on providing deployable public communications in areas that spring up and disappear very quickly, to allow emergency service call outs, and government support lines access:drugs advice etc.

He and his company work with different languages and IDE's, but The Eclipse Project is a favorite. They ended up writing their own C plugin rather than using the 'official' C plugin (i think its called CDT??? can't remember), since their impression of the error parsing wasn't too hot.

Uncle Chris gave me a funny example of the slightly-less-than-magic behind the plugin when he told me that the automatic OS detection was actually the plugin detecting if pathnames had a foward or a backward slash in them. bless open source software!

weblordpepe

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# 56837 4-Jan-2007 11:29

BAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaahahaha!!

It really boggles the mind. Since MS allow forward slash for network and UNC names whatever they are. Like NETBIOSNAME/fileshare/weblordpepe_nude.jpg

Yet we have to go c:\directory\oops\i\mean\folder\weblordpepe_nude.jpg for local paths.

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# 56839 4-Jan-2007 11:54

Please refrain your conversation deterring from the original topic. If this path is once again swayed away from the original topic, this discussion will be locked.

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weblordpepe

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# 56889 4-Jan-2007 16:46

Woops sorry. OpenGL OpenGL OpenGL.

Although at the end of the day - does having a 3D interface really matter in Windows? If having the Aero fancy pants moving windows in Vista is the cause of lack of OpenGL support then thats pretty sad.

Surely that could be coded better. Personally I don't see any reason for OpenGL and Direct3D to not co-exist. Personally I reckon Direct3D should have just been a Microsoft-spawned OpenGL implimentation.

It reminds me of how in XP/2003/2K/NT/ME/98/95 when you try to access a CD in the drive half of the operating system just stops untill the CD is read. A broken CD/DVD - It's the best way to take down half of the OS for a while. I really dont understand why that's neccecary and why it's still an issue in 2007.

Here's hoping we dont have a similar issue with OpenGL/Direct3D if Aero is really that akward.

bradstewart

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# 56913 4-Jan-2007 20:50

Give one reason Microsoft should support OpenGL. They have Direct3D which is a very good thing. Game studios have had a choice for a long time to decide which would become dominant, they went down the D3D route. Which according to many people is much better than OpenGL, except the trollish Slashfud readers.

juha

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# 56922 4-Jan-2007 21:33

Umm.... CAD?

Juha

weblordpepe

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# 56924 4-Jan-2007 21:41

bradstewart:
Give one reason Microsoft should support OpenGL. They have Direct3D which is a very good thing. Game studios have had a choice for a long time to decide which would become dominant, they went down the D3D route. Which according to many people is much better than OpenGL, except the trollish Slashfud readers.

Because it's been around for donkey's years as a stable, robust, scalable, open, and most of all - easily programmable platform. Direct3D exists only because of marketing and business and is a Microsoft-only platform. They'll just get sued again if they drop support for OpenGL.

Game developers don't like being stuck with an API that isn't supported; they dont have control of the market like MS does. It's why games are developed for Windows in the first place. Piggybacking off Microsoft.

At the end of the day, this is another example of MS 'forcing' people to adopt a new standard using their marketing strength, whether it is superior or not. The same with the Zune....Windows NT....MSDOS/IBM PC.....Internet Explorer's version of HTML....Active Directory...the list goes on..and on....and on. It drives me mad just trying to count. Why on earth would you buy a new computer just to keep up to date with software? Blows the mind.

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