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834 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 1241876 18-Feb-2015 18:49
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vexxxboy:
Glassboy:
vexxxboy:

Basically, with the CGA , Warranties are worthless and so are extended warranties, the CGA replaces them . it's simple , to sell products in NZ companies have to abide by the CGA, it's the law, so stop arguing with them and just take it to the tribunal, you will win and they will get a slap on the wrist and the next person might get a better service.


That's not what the act or Consumer Affairs web site says if you bothered to read them.


i just out it into language the average person understands, with any expensive eletrical  items if it has a 12 month warranty it means bugger all because the CGA says that the item should last a lot longer, and yes i have read the whole act and i would say not many retailers have read it because i have been offered extended warranties and not once did the retailer mentioned that the CGA would also do the same thing which with the change to the act they have to do so or they can be prosecuted for breaking the law.


The CGA doesn't do the same thing, either practically or legally.  The CGA voids the shame warranties that places like DSE used to sell, but it's laughable to suggest it replaces things like [extended] mechanical warranties on cars.

The consumer affairs site also specifically says that parts of it have never been tested in the courts, until then it's actually a guess as to what the extent is.

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  Reply # 1241886 18-Feb-2015 19:02
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Glassboy:
richms: What happens if the disk ejects mid game?

Seems serious to me. I have never even had a disk in my PS4, Xbox one or the xbox 360 so have no idea what happens in that situation.


Sure but if all the other features of the device work and it's caused by a stuck eject button no tribunal is going to consider it a serious fault.   Especially as the fix appears to be tighten one screw that you can get to without removing the case.


So imagine if you're a 14y/o and your parents have no clue about tech. You're meant to know how to fix your game console that doesn't work?
And you think parents are going to let you near a $700 device with a screw-driver based on "something I found on the internet"?
But you can't play games without it. 

I know how to fix my 2y/o fridge when it only freezes and the fridge bit stops, but I don't expect my Mrs or children to do it without sending it back.
"Sure the freezer still works, so just use it as a freezer" NO! I want cold beer not frozen beer!

I also expect it to work as described. Much like a game console should play games.

And I expect the 14y/o would like to play games on a game console and not just stream music/watch netflix. 

If a game console won't play games, for whatever reason, after 15 months, would you have spent $700 on it? NO!
Just like the washing machine whose motor stopped.  It's a serious issue. 
Most people wouldn't say "oh, the motor burnt out, I'd better get that fixed". They'd say "my washing machine won't work, I want it fixed!"

I understand this is a geek forum, but that doesn't mean I should have to take a screwdriver to a $700 device and fix it myself.

Oh, and since it only appears that the screw is the problem, what happens if it's not, and it goes for repair under the CGA?
They say "this has been tampered with, we're going to charge you".



 
 
 
 


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  Reply # 1241890 18-Feb-2015 19:21
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Oh, one more quick thing... 

I'm pretty sure the DT, the retailer OR the Sony recommended repairer won't be asking the OP "By the way, did you check that screw under the HDD cover to make sure it wasn't that?"

:D

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  Reply # 1241979 18-Feb-2015 21:04
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blakamin:

So imagine if you're a 14y/o and your parents have no clue about tech. You're meant to know how to fix your game console that doesn't work?
And you think parents are going to let you near a $700 device with a screw-driver based on "something I found on the internet"?
But you can't play games without it. ........



Everything you say is irrelevant.  A stuck button doesn't become a serious fault just because the owner is a minor.  The Disputes Tribunal deals with points of law, and your attitude is entirely ingenious to the OP.

The Sony website has instructions on how to replace the HDD.  These are equally as serviceable for removing the cover and tightening the screw.  If the OP doesn't feel comfortable doing it, there maybe a geekzoner in his town who is happy to do it for him.

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  Reply # 1242045 19-Feb-2015 00:45
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Hey finch,



The thing I like about the court system is that you are able to quote similar cases that have occurred depending on whether the same piece of legislation was applied.



Here I have an article relating to the previous gen PS3 (basically considered a similar device)


http://we-fearless-ones.blogspot.co.nz/2009/05/playstation-3-durability-courts-ruling.html?m=1


I see the mention a case number also which would make a very strong case. It's not the fault that is important here, it is the time that NZ law stipulates that a 'computer' should be able to last.

Finch, if you want me to write up an letter for you to email to the warehouse stating your rights, obligations, and future action that may be required then u am willing to do so.


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  Reply # 1242069 19-Feb-2015 08:13
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Glassboy: 

The Sony website has instructions on how to replace the HDD.  These are equally as serviceable for removing the cover and tightening the screw.  If the OP doesn't feel comfortable doing it, there maybe a geekzoner in his town who is happy to do it for him.


There is no guarantee that tightening the screw fixes the problem, nor does the article offer it as a remedy for this disc ejection problem. In fact, this problem, while widely reported on various gaming forums, isn't mentioned on the Sony site at all. 

So far I have been lucky, but I still don't have 100% confidence that I has fixed the problem permanently. I have also attempted to address the problem by elevating my PS4 so the bottom doesn't rest directly on the surface of the entertainment unit where it sits. This may have also contributed to the problem not recurring for me recently.

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  Reply # 1242085 19-Feb-2015 08:32
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dclegg:
Glassboy: 

The Sony website has instructions on how to replace the HDD.  These are equally as serviceable for removing the cover and tightening the screw.  If the OP doesn't feel comfortable doing it, there maybe a geekzoner in his town who is happy to do it for him.


There is no guarantee that tightening the screw fixes the problem, nor does the article offer it as a remedy for this disc ejection problem. In fact, this problem, while widely reported on various gaming forums, isn't mentioned on the Sony site at all. 

So far I have been lucky, but I still don't have 100% confidence that I has fixed the problem permanently. I have also attempted to address the problem by elevating my PS4 so the bottom doesn't rest directly on the surface of the entertainment unit where it sits. This may have also contributed to the problem not recurring for me recently.


Raising the unit of the unit, tightening screws does not sound like a quality product. If the ejection issue is known and not being attended to then I would take it to the Tribunal, nothing to lose by doings anti may give Sony NZ a kick in the bum. The unit hints of sloppy QC and poor design.




Mike
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The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 Mac user, Windows curser, Chrome OS desired.

 

The great divide is the lies from both sides.

 

 


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  Reply # 1242104 19-Feb-2015 09:07
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KiwiNZ: 

Raising the unit of the unit, tightening screws does not sound like a quality product. If the ejection issue is known and not being attended to then I would take it to the Tribunal, nothing to lose by doings anti may give Sony NZ a kick in the bum. The unit hints of sloppy QC and poor design.


That's a long bow to draw.  You have no idea how people have treated their units.  If someone has failed to follow any instructions on how to set up their PS4 they have nullified their for for purpose guarantee under the CGA.  Let's be very clear about what that means, if they have placed it on an uneven surface, if they have left inadequate ventilation space, if they have place things on top of it, and if they have placed it on it's side without the correct vertical stand kit.

Which in reality is probably everyone.

I don't think the PS4 is poorly design or has bad QC, but I think every component in it is the cheapest that Sony could get away with, and no QC is going to cause the laws of physics to be suspended.  PS4s run with poor ventilation get very hot.  Amazingly hot, which is why I and all my friends open our entertainment cabinet doors when we have them on, and don't leave anything on top of them.  That sort of heat leads to thermal expansion in parts, which leads to screws and connectors becoming loose over time with the expansion and contraction.





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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 1242115 19-Feb-2015 09:21
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dclegg:

There is no guarantee that tightening the screw fixes the problem, nor does the article offer it as a remedy for this disc ejection problem. In fact, this problem, while widely reported on various gaming forums, isn't mentioned on the Sony site at all. 

So far I have been lucky, but I still don't have 100% confidence that I has fixed the problem permanently. I have also attempted to address the problem by elevating my PS4 so the bottom doesn't rest directly on the surface of the entertainment unit where it sits. This may have also contributed to the problem not recurring for me recently.


It may not fix the problem, that's not really my point.  My point is that a lot of the opinion here about the scope and the reach of the CGA is just plain wrong and the hysterical ranting and pipe dreams don't help the OP.  His PS4 is outside of it's 12 month warranty, if he sends it for repair he's going to have to pay the courier fee and parts.  The Warehouse aren't going to do anything because they are b a s t a r d s, and they have more resources to throw at a tribunal case than the OP.  If they imported the PS4s from a channel external to Sony NZ, Sony NZ won't be on the hook, and in any event Sony are a corporation made up of multiple companies and Sony NZ and SCEi are different companies.  Trying a simple fix first is in his best interest and helps demonstrate his reasonableness to the Tribunal.

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  Reply # 1242139 19-Feb-2015 10:15
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It should be covered by the CGA, and it never should have got that far.

TWL should have front footed it and got it sorted.

I was talking to a games guy at JB Hi-Fi about this post. He said he had heard of and seen the eject issue, and that in most cases (he said one of the head office guys had it happen to their launch console) tightening the screw fixes it, but he would not expect a customer to have to do it. He said that according to their 'Blue Book' which I linked earlier they would cover the warranty on a PS4 for 2 Years anyway - so it would never have been an issue.

I do not see why the Warehouse hasn't just sorted it. If another (albeit smaller in NZ) retailer is offering 2 years on a PS4, why aren't they?

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  Reply # 1242262 19-Feb-2015 12:45
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Glassboy:  A stuck button doesn't become a serious fault just because the owner is a minor.  The Disputes Tribunal deals with points of law, and your attitude is entirely ingenious to the OP.
.


*whooooosh*

The sound of the whole point going over your head.

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  Reply # 1242339 19-Feb-2015 14:25
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The thing that annoys about the CGA is that it is too subjective and variable about the length of time goods should last. I guess in 1993 things in NZ were a little more laid back after the economy was deregulated in the previous years, but the wording is far too vague. I can imagine the disputes tribunal gets hundreds of CGA cases to deal with each year.

I don't know the answer to this problem, maybe a sliding scale dependent on the price paid for the good that would stipulate how long the good is covered by the CGA, but the world has changed a lot in the 22 years since this legislation was introduced. Surely it's time for a spruce up. Would probably have saved Finch from a lot of hassle in getting his PS4 fixed.

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  Reply # 1242400 19-Feb-2015 15:08
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bigbadkiwi: The thing that annoys about the CGA is that it is too subjective and variable about the length of time goods should last. I guess in 1993 things in NZ were a little more laid back after the economy was deregulated in the previous years, but the wording is far too vague. I can imagine the disputes tribunal gets hundreds of CGA cases to deal with each year.

I don't know the answer to this problem, maybe a sliding scale dependent on the price paid for the good that would stipulate how long the good is covered by the CGA, but the world has changed a lot in the 22 years since this legislation was introduced. Surely it's time for a spruce up. Would probably have saved Finch from a lot of hassle in getting his PS4 fixed.


The wording is intentionally vague it's made to cover a broad range of scenarios, every item is different and the length of time it should last could easily differ from item to item. You can't really put a definitive scale based on price, what makes up a lot of the CGA is really common sense. 

In Finch's case the problem isn't with CGA being clear enough it's with both Sony/The Warehouse simply not following it, anyone who thinks 12 months is how long a console should last under normal use is an idiot.

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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 1242404 19-Feb-2015 15:12
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blakamin:
Glassboy:  A stuck button doesn't become a serious fault just because the owner is a minor.  The Disputes Tribunal deals with points of law, and your attitude is entirely ingenious to the OP.
.


*whooooosh*

The sound of the whole point going over your head.


As I stated, I didn't miss your point.  It's just totally irrelevant and unhelpful.

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  Reply # 1242406 19-Feb-2015 15:16
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trig42: It should be covered by the CGA, and it never should have got that far.

TWL should have front footed it and got it sorted.

I was talking to a games guy at JB Hi-Fi about this post. He said he had heard of and seen the eject issue, and that in most cases (he said one of the head office guys had it happen to their launch console) tightening the screw fixes it, but he would not expect a customer to have to do it. He said that according to their 'Blue Book' which I linked earlier they would cover the warranty on a PS4 for 2 Years anyway - so it would never have been an issue.

I do not see why the Warehouse hasn't just sorted it. If another (albeit smaller in NZ) retailer is offering 2 years on a PS4, why aren't they?


The answer is not to buy from stores like the Warehouse or DSE.  Buy from places that have good support and respect their customers.

I've been hassled for buying from JB HiFi because they're Australian but they replaced a defective CD I'd bought with no questions.  Try the same thing a the Warehouse and you get nowhere.



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