Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.


View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
1 | 2 
Linux Systems Admin
1097 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 212

Trusted
Integrity Tech Solutions
Subscriber

  # 2229914 3-May-2019 08:45
Send private message quote this post

sbiddle:

 

FTP cable is no good unless you're going to go have proper bonding and earthed equipment at both ends. It has the ability to introduce issues if not correctly earthed. Yes it can offer some increased noise immunity even if not correctly shielded, but an outdoor run is unlikely to expose the cable to EMF/RF sources that would cause issues.

 

 

This cable was only available in FTP, and I think STP, otherwise I would have bought UTP.

 

What if the foil shield is simply not used?





Integrity Tech Solutions @ Norsewood, New Zealand


6762 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 631

Trusted
Subscriber

  # 2229940 3-May-2019 09:08
One person supports this post
Send private message quote this post

MichaelNZ:

 

sbiddle:

 

FTP cable is no good unless you're going to go have proper bonding and earthed equipment at both ends. It has the ability to introduce issues if not correctly earthed. Yes it can offer some increased noise immunity even if not correctly shielded, but an outdoor run is unlikely to expose the cable to EMF/RF sources that would cause issues.

 

 

This cable was only available in FTP, and I think STP, otherwise I would have bought UTP.

 

What if the foil shield is simply not used?

 

 

It becomes a beverage antenna and can potentially couple all manner of sh!t in, dont use F/STP unless you know how to correctly single point earth it.

 

As for comments regarding buildings on different phases, this is not exactly correct, what is important is that its on a same/similar earth plane, if the buildings are fed from the same street transformer and from a common switchboard (even though the granny flat may have a sub board) then there should be little issues, the issue comes about when they are well spaced and there is a reliance on ground conductivity between buildings and no decent copper bond between them. In a typical NZ residential section this should not be too much of an issue.

 

Further, most IT gear is floating anyway, if the granny flat just has a isolated switch and/or WAP that is fed from a switchmode psu that is double insulated then in essence there is no earth loop potential of happening.

 

Cyril


 
 
 
 


961 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 197

Trusted

  # 2229963 3-May-2019 09:45
Send private message quote this post

backfiah: ... Also is cat6 strictly better than cat5e, or is it harder to work with? ...

 

Nobody commented on this yet.

 

Thx to Google, take your pick (in my order of preference)

 

     

  1. https://ob-one.com/2018/03/06/difference-cat5e-vs-cat6-cables-right/
  2. https://www.diffen.com/difference/Cat5e_vs_Cat6
  3. https://www.lifehacker.com.au/2013/04/ask-lh-whats-the-difference-between-cat5-cat5e-and-cat6-cables/
  4. https://www.bittree.com/blogs/get-connected/difference-between-cat5e-and-cat6

 

Taken from link 1, emphasis mine.

 

Which Is Right for You?
Looking at the technical specifications above, Cat6 is the clear victor. But in practice, it’s not that simple. Here’s our assessment:

Residential Properties
For residential users, Cat5e is often more than capable. Unless your home connection can provide ultrafast speeds, you’ll not notice a difference using a Cat6 cable. At least not right now…

Data Rates
You also need to consider that data rates double approximately every 1.5 years. If you’re concerned with planning for the future, Cat6 may be a safer bet and prevent the need for more changes, further down the line.

Commercial Properties
For office users, Cat6 cables are a solid choice. Just remember, you won’t notice a speed difference until the rest of your network is also gigabit rated.

You should also bear in mind the length of cables required. Exceed approx. 50 meters and you’ll miss out on the 10 Gigabit Ethernet speeds (or face extra cost). In which case, a Cat5e setup is more ideally suited.

 

 





Please keep this GZ community vibrant by contributing in a constructive & respectful manner.




114 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 27


  # 2230080 3-May-2019 12:14
Send private message quote this post

Thanks all for the generous offers to terminate cable for me. I'll see if the electrical wholesalers are reasonable, otherwise may take someone up on that :)

 

noroad:

 

Can I suggest you really should use fibre for this ? You can get a custom fibre patch lead made by http://fs.com pretty cheaply and basic switches with SFP cages are also real cheap. You are a lot less likely to have things go badly wrong due to earthing differences that way and the cost will be not much different.

 

 

That's an interesting idea. So I would want LC connectors and then they can just go straight into a supporting switch? Don't suppose you have a good resource for a basic fibre LAN?


1862 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 548


  # 2230091 3-May-2019 12:27
Send private message quote this post

cyril7:

 

MichaelNZ:

 

sbiddle:

 

FTP cable is no good unless you're going to go have proper bonding and earthed equipment at both ends. It has the ability to introduce issues if not correctly earthed. Yes it can offer some increased noise immunity even if not correctly shielded, but an outdoor run is unlikely to expose the cable to EMF/RF sources that would cause issues.

 

 

This cable was only available in FTP, and I think STP, otherwise I would have bought UTP.

 

What if the foil shield is simply not used?

 

 

It becomes a beverage antenna and can potentially couple all manner of sh!t in, dont use F/STP unless you know how to correctly single point earth it.

 

As for comments regarding buildings on different phases, this is not exactly correct, what is important is that its on a same/similar earth plane,

 

are you sure about that? myself and the previous commenter on this issue are both trained and qualified to be advising that you should not be running a conductor between two separate buildings without proper checks being done.  the fact that everything has a common ground is exactly the reason why you'll be risking a fatal 415 volt shock otherwise.


488 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 279

Trusted

  # 2230094 3-May-2019 12:33
3 people support this post
Send private message quote this post

backfiah:

 

That's an interesting idea. So I would want LC connectors and then they can just go straight into a supporting switch? Don't suppose you have a good resource for a basic fibre LAN?

 

 

 

 

LC/UPC would be what you need. You can have your choice of multi-mode or single-mode. So if you go here -

 

https://www.fs.com/products/20720.html

 

Select lc/upc each end, PVC and the length. 80M gives you 51.91+ 46.00 shipping USD for Ruggedized duplex single mode.

 

Then add a couple of 1G SFP's at $7USD each https://www.fs.com/products/12622.html

 

These can go into your favorite switch that has an SFP port, there are plenty of these around going cheap. Or media converters like this - https://www.fs.com/products/35333.html or https://www.fs.com/products/35334.html

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


1673 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 283

Subscriber

  # 2230118 3-May-2019 12:59
One person supports this post
Send private message quote this post

backfiah:

 

Thanks all for the generous offers to terminate cable for me. I'll see if the electrical wholesalers are reasonable, otherwise may take someone up on that :)

 

 

If you dont know someone with an account they will punish you on price.  Cat6 standard rate is approx $1.6/m + GST (that is not outdoor gel filled) which is an outrageous price.  I suspect Gel filled will cost significantly more a meter.  


 
 
 
 


6762 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 631

Trusted
Subscriber

  # 2230126 3-May-2019 13:16
Send private message quote this post

Hi, running telecom cables between buildings is assuming they are near by is common practice and to my knowledge not a problem, if it is someone better call Chorus and get them to shutdown the copper network real quick.

 

Running fibre does circumvent any galvanic related issues, however if the buildings are on the same grounding and in close proximity (say 15-20m) then there should be no issues. If the two are on different earthing "then" you risk a potential diff that could be problematic.

 

A few years back I was involved in the engineering support for the SNUP program, as expected buildings (or more correctly floor distributors) were connected by fibre, however it was allowable that buildings less that 15m apart could if for various reasons could be linked by copper (although fibre was the preferred solution), and more importantly two or more close by buildings could be fed from a common floor distributor (cabinet) with the copper outlet cabling installed via underground (or walkway ducts if available) to any of those associated buildings between the outlet and floor distributor, this is common practice and would have occurred on many hundreds of the 2500+ schools, and no rules or technical issues to my knowledge have arisen from this.

 

Cyril


6762 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 631

Trusted
Subscriber

  # 2230129 3-May-2019 13:23
Send private message quote this post

itxtme:

 

backfiah:

 

Thanks all for the generous offers to terminate cable for me. I'll see if the electrical wholesalers are reasonable, otherwise may take someone up on that :)

 

 

If you dont know someone with an account they will punish you on price.  Cat6 standard rate is approx $1.6/m + GST (that is not outdoor gel filled) which is an outrageous price.  I suspect Gel filled will cost significantly more a meter.  

 

 

Standard UTP indoor Cat6 trade is around $0.50/m although some brands are a little more, for underground gel flooded I think the last reel I got was around $0.70/m for cat5e, I see Cat6 gel flooded is about the same.

 

Cyril


What does this tag do
1014 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 218

Subscriber

  # 2230130 3-May-2019 13:26
Send private message quote this post

Of course, if you're just doing it to put a wireless access point in the flat, then you could use Power over Ethernet to power it from the main house and point becomes moot




114 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 27


  # 2230393 3-May-2019 18:02
Send private message quote this post

noroad:

 

backfiah:

 

That's an interesting idea. So I would want LC connectors and then they can just go straight into a supporting switch? Don't suppose you have a good resource for a basic fibre LAN?

 

 

 

 

LC/UPC would be what you need. You can have your choice of multi-mode or single-mode. So if you go here -

 

https://www.fs.com/products/20720.html

 

Select lc/upc each end, PVC and the length. 80M gives you 51.91+ 46.00 shipping USD for Ruggedized duplex single mode.

 

Then add a couple of 1G SFP's at $7USD each https://www.fs.com/products/12622.html

 

These can go into your favorite switch that has an SFP port, there are plenty of these around going cheap. Or media converters like this - https://www.fs.com/products/35333.html or https://www.fs.com/products/35334.html

 

 

 

 

Neat! That shipping is a bit of a killer though. My reading is that multi-mode is preferable unless v. high distance or bandwidth (10G+) is needed? So OM1 is perhaps best since will work with nearly any hardware? Non-ruggedised is a hell of a lot cheaper to ship ($13 NZ) --- is the ruggedised stuff needed if it's in conduit/internal the whole time? I assume water ingress is less troublesome in fibre vs copper.


488 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 279

Trusted

  # 2230667 4-May-2019 09:09
Send private message quote this post

backfiah:

 

Neat! That shipping is a bit of a killer though. My reading is that multi-mode is preferable unless v. high distance or bandwidth (10G+) is needed? So OM1 is perhaps best since will work with nearly any hardware? Non-ruggedised is a hell of a lot cheaper to ship ($13 NZ) --- is the ruggedised stuff needed if it's in conduit/internal the whole time? I assume water ingress is less troublesome in fibre vs copper.

 

 

 

 

Multimode is perfectly fine, and being in conduit you could certainly use a standard patch lead as opposed to ruggedised. Water on the fibre is no issue, UV and rough handling are your only worries so as long as you are not overly rough installing it you are good. Generally multimode is cheaper for short (500M) runs but with 1G optics its much of a muchness now. The only advantage to using single mode I can see in this case is if you ever wanted to extend an ONT to the remote site you can do this with single mode, but really its  more just personal preference.

 

 

 

 




114 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 27


  # 2230851 4-May-2019 14:53
Send private message quote this post

noroad:

 

backfiah:

 

Neat! That shipping is a bit of a killer though. My reading is that multi-mode is preferable unless v. high distance or bandwidth (10G+) is needed? So OM1 is perhaps best since will work with nearly any hardware? Non-ruggedised is a hell of a lot cheaper to ship ($13 NZ) --- is the ruggedised stuff needed if it's in conduit/internal the whole time? I assume water ingress is less troublesome in fibre vs copper.

 

 

 

 

Multimode is perfectly fine, and being in conduit you could certainly use a standard patch lead as opposed to ruggedised. Water on the fibre is no issue, UV and rough handling are your only worries so as long as you are not overly rough installing it you are good. Generally multimode is cheaper for short (500M) runs but with 1G optics its much of a muchness now. The only advantage to using single mode I can see in this case is if you ever wanted to extend an ONT to the remote site you can do this with single mode, but really its  more just personal preference.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks again. Turns out that single mode is actually cheaper anyway! 


191 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 78


  # 2231854 6-May-2019 18:22
Send private message quote this post

jnimmo:

 

Of course, if you're just doing it to put a wireless access point in the flat, then you could use Power over Ethernet to power it from the main house and point becomes moot

 

 

That's not correct. Think about brushing your fingers on the pins of the patch lead.. if they earth potential is significantly different to the building at the other end you're going to get a nasty surprise.


4079 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1768

Subscriber

  # 2231896 6-May-2019 19:32
3 people support this post
Send private message quote this post

For god's sake... going by some comments its amazing there is anyone left who has spent any time in a business premises with data cabling between buildings. We should have all been electrocuted apparently!!

Just grab some underground cat5/cat6 (gel filled, or dual wall, suit yourself). Run it properly, stick it in some conduit where you can. Dont do anything dumb like share a conduit with a power cable or something. Plug it in, win.

1 | 2 
View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic



Twitter and LinkedIn »



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:





News »

Dunedin selects Telensa to deliver smart street lighting for 15,000 LEDs
Posted 18-Jul-2019 10:21


Sprint announces a connected wallet card with built-in IoT support
Posted 18-Jul-2019 08:36


Educational tool developed at Otago makes international launch
Posted 17-Jul-2019 21:57


Symantec introduces cloud access security solution
Posted 17-Jul-2019 21:48


New Zealand government unveils new digital service to make business easier
Posted 16-Jul-2019 17:35


Scientists unveil image of quantum entanglement
Posted 13-Jul-2019 06:00


Hackers to be challenged at University of Waikato
Posted 12-Jul-2019 21:34


OPPO Reno Z now available in New Zealand
Posted 12-Jul-2019 21:28


Sony introduces WF-1000XM3 wireless headphones with noise cancellation
Posted 8-Jul-2019 16:56


Xero announces new smarter tools, push into the North American market
Posted 19-Jun-2019 17:20


New report by Unisys shows New Zealanders want action by social platform companies and police to monitor social media sites
Posted 19-Jun-2019 17:09


ASB adds Google Pay option to contactless payments
Posted 19-Jun-2019 17:05


New Zealand PC Market declines on the back of high channel inventory, IDC reports
Posted 18-Jun-2019 17:35


Air New Zealand uses drones to inspect aircraft
Posted 17-Jun-2019 15:39


TCL Electronics launches its first-ever 8K TV
Posted 17-Jun-2019 15:18



Geekzone Live »

Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.


Support Geekzone »

Our community of supporters help make Geekzone possible. Click the button below to join them.

Support Geezone on PressPatron



Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.