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340 posts

Ultimate Geek
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Topic # 89975 12-Sep-2011 21:12
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I am currently in the process of planning rewiring of an old house with Cat5e for networking and phones to most rooms and back to a central cupboard where i will either have a patch panel and 16/24 port switch or maybe just the switch.

1. Where should i get the cable, wallplates and inserts from? / Can i get a price catalogue for this stuff from an electrical wholesaler (ideal / ja russell etc) so i can accurately price up the job? I have noticed that ebay seems to be the cheapest place for this kind of stuff but obviously takes a fair while to get here. Have looked at www.cablesdirect.co.nz as well. ($4.58 for an amdex rj45 insert) is this reasonable?

2. Presumably amdex / dynamix / pdl 600 is mostly a personal preference on looks etc, they are all good enough quality.

3. The phone line has a central splitter installed at the demark point then a dedicated adsl jack next to the cupboard i will be using for the wiring. All the phone jacks are daisy chained from each other in a crazy fashion with splices and rubbish joins all over the show. How should i go about fixing this up.

4. I am planning on flush mount wall plates with mounting boxes behind, I have access to most of the house underfloor so will be running the cables under there and then coming up from the floorplates behind the gib into the rooms. Any problems with this approach?

Thanks

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  Reply # 520176 12-Sep-2011 21:21
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The TCF has good guidelines for home premises wiring 
http://www.tcf.org.nz/premwiring

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  Reply # 520195 12-Sep-2011 21:42
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Electrical Direct are awesome. http://www.electricaldirectltd.co.nz/

They have also ordered stuff for me that they don't normally stock. I got all my tools, eg punchdown's, crimp tools etc as well as my patch panel.

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  Reply # 520380 13-Sep-2011 12:05
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cat5e? cat 6 these days mate.
Best bet for good quality product would be your local electrical whole saler (stewarts, radcliffe, ja russell, corys electrical and some mastertrade shops, ideal electrical etc.)

PDL is probably the easiest and your house probably already has pdl electrical fittings so its always nice to keep it the same.
Amdex = the sh!ttiest jacks i have ever used. They only fit clipsal faceplates and even in those they arent a perfect fit.
dynamix jacks would be a good option as they are cheap. Look for keystone modules and they will click in to PDL 600 series 619M clips.
PDL gives great flexibility as well in terms of single, dual, quad, five, six way outlets.
The way i see it its just as easy to run two cables as it is to run one so why not?
In terms of your phone wiring, rip it out. You are doing structured cabling so run your phones on that.
I work for a cabling company and do this all day every day and personally the TCF can bugger off. We are also chorus contractors and the kind of 'guidelines' they set are just stupid.
In my house I have dual outlets everywhere except behind the AV equipment as I needed data for xbox, phone for sky and then there is two spare. One i use with a HDMI over cat 6 extender which is awesome as I have put the media PC in a cupboard miles away but can still have direct HDMI to the stereo.
How many outlets were you looking at? Dynamix do a neat little 12-port mini panel that could be a good option for fit-off in a cupboard. But 12 can be limiting. I have 22 cables in my place and its only a 3 bedroom house lol.
Oh and underfloor it is a great idea to keep the cables off the ground as plumbers arent the most careful lol. I have suspended a catenary wire but thats really a bit over the top. Running the cables between the floor and the joists should keep them up and then a few cable ties keeps everything tidy. Pick a main route and branch off that. Dont go for the 'star' look. You will use a little bit more cable but it is worth it for a tidy job. I can take some photos of my cabling if you like?

Wow that was a bit of an essay... my bad. Hope it helps though.

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  Reply # 520419 13-Sep-2011 12:53
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@ chevrolux: Just curious- What don't you like about the TCF guidelines?



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  Reply # 520500 13-Sep-2011 15:13
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Thanks Chevrolux

Don't think i will be using Cat6, it is only for gigabit ethernet which is comfortably handled with cat5e and cat6 is more expensive for cable and jacks.
Cablesdirect have faceplates for their amdex jacks which should presumably fit together perfectly. Not worried about using PDL 600 to match as this is an old house I've spotted at least 4 different style switches and jackpoints around.

Planning on doing 2 cat5 cables to each bedroom, 2 to the lounge and 4 to the study, so roughly 12 runs. Might have to get an 8 port gigabit switch to start with as the price differencial to a 16 port one is pretty big.

For redoing telephone wiring:
- Currently there is a master splitter installed on outside demarc point and then a line coming into the adsl jack
- What telco distribution box should i get to run 4 or so telephone jacks from that point in a star configuration
- was planning on using cat5e for the jack points and maybe still use standard RJ45 wallplates as well so they can be changed to data, is this OK? how do you go about it? What cable do you use from the RJ45 jack to the phone?

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  Reply # 520534 13-Sep-2011 16:21
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hazza87: Thanks Chevrolux 

For redoing telephone wiring:
- Currently there is a master splitter installed on outside demarc point and then a line coming into the adsl jack
- What telco distribution box should i get to run 4 or so telephone jacks from that point in a star configuration
- was planning on using cat5e for the jack points and maybe still use standard RJ45 wallplates as well so they can be changed to data, is this OK? how do you go about it? What cable do you use from the RJ45 jack to the phone?


Can you run new cable from the master splitter to your central point?  If so, run some cat5 from the splitter to your central point and use the orange pair for ADSL and the blue pair for Phone and then loop the phone pair through has many ports as your need on the patch panel. 

To get from a RJ45 wallplate to the phone you just need one of these. 

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  Reply # 520552 13-Sep-2011 16:54
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One of these for phones should suit. Radcliffe usually have them in stock.

- One input for phone and 6 RJ45's out.
- One input for DSL with one RJ45 out.


 

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  Reply # 520573 13-Sep-2011 17:44
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The TCF say you should be running two cat5 and two rg6 which is just a serious overkill of cable. For most people 2 cat 5 is overkill as they will only ever run a phone out of the bedroom jack. There is nothing really WRONG with what they say it is just way overkill and NZers dont want to spend money on stuff in the walls. In america they sell homes as 'ethernet ready' or fibre ready' which is a mind set we need to get in to with this UFB plan.

Phone wiring-
Is your splitter external? ie in the telecom etp? Run a new cable to that while you are at it like 'cldr76' said. And terminate it on that little unit above. And to the phones in to the RJ45 you can just use the normal line cords with RJ11 connectors on each end (the small square one that looks like rj45). They are obviously a different size but still click in perfectly and saves buying a whole bunch of rj45-bt adapters.

If you are running twelve then a 12-port dynamix mini panel will be perfect. Quite tight behind them when they are full but give a nice little concise patch panel.

Amdex jacks need to be terminated with a krone tool and not the usual 110. You will find the 110 tool pushes it down but quite often the wire will just loop over the idc connector and not actually terminate properly.



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  Reply # 520585 13-Sep-2011 18:21
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Yes splitter is external at telecom etp, so i will run a cat5e from there to the central location.
Looks like i will use the dynamix faceplates then, cablesdirect only have 1 and 2 port ones though.

Will one of these work for the telco distribution?

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  Reply # 520613 13-Sep-2011 19:25
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hazza87: Yes splitter is external at telecom etp, so i will run a cat5e from there to the central location.
Looks like i will use the dynamix faceplates then, cablesdirect only have 1 and 2 port ones though.

Will one of these work for the telco distribution?


No as you will be wanting to run the phone through the patch panel to the rooms the one illict posted is much better as you then just patch to the port you need there is an adapter for the other end so you can plug your POTS gear into RJ45. http://www.cablesdirect.co.nz/catalog/entry?entry=175&page_number=1

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  Reply # 520620 13-Sep-2011 19:47
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that one is when you have dedicated phone jacks. Because you want flexiblity you need to use the one illicit posted.

Dont go buying any adapter for your phones. Standard RJ11-RJ11 line cords will plug in to your RJ45 jacks.



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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 520636 13-Sep-2011 20:12
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Anyone know the price of one of the ones illicit posted? Anywhere online sell them, havent found anywhere yet.
got some quotes from ideal electrical today, most stuff was about 4x more expensive than cablesdirect.

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  Reply # 520648 13-Sep-2011 20:25
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Where abouts are you located? You will be quoted at retail price. I could get a whole sale price for you if you want? I go to Stewarts every morning so it's no trouble.
Will get a quote for PDL plates and 3M cat5e rj45 jacks - a great combination we use on cheap jobs. The 3M jacks are only about $8 each and are great quality.
So is it 1 quad face plate and 4 duals?
1x 12port mini panel
1xPhone distribution panel
12 3M jacks

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  Reply # 520653 13-Sep-2011 20:28
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chevrolux:

Dont go buying any adapter for your phones. Standard RJ11-RJ11 line cords will plug in to your RJ45 jacks.

They will fit, but supposedly damage the other pins in the RJ45 socket. So your best to buy premade RJ11-RJ45 leads or make your own up (easy enough with a crimper). I do agree that those adapters are pointless



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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 520654 13-Sep-2011 20:32
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Auckland - eastern suburbs
Yep that is exactly what i have planned right now

1 quad, 4 duals
12 jacks
1xPhone distribution panel
not fully decided on patch panel, may be worth getting a 16 port one for upgradability??
100M/305M cat5e box depending on prices.

Thanks chevrolux

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