868Mhz seems to be right on the boarderline between SRD's which you can use with a GURL and Land mobile radio simplex which requires radio licensing regime

evilengineer:

 

So what was wrong with NZ adopting the same 868Mhz band that the EU uses for z-wave?

 

EU doesnt have the same 800MHz cell networks that we have here, sitting on the US cell allocations. AU and NZ are basically the only places that have both 800 and 900 cellular bands in operation. Even that didnt work out too well between them, remember when the XT started up one of the 900MHz telcos had a hissyfit because their gear was getting overloaded with the adjacent base station transmissions.

richms:remember when the XT started up one of the 900MHz telcos had a hissyfit because their gear was getting overloaded with the adjacent base station transmissions.

I forgot all about that! Delayed the launch by two weeks, I think.

evilengineer:

So what was wrong with NZ adopting the same 868Mhz band that the EU uses for z-wave?

Does anyone know what kind of range the RF on Zwave or Insteon is? How far does it extend outside of your house?

Insteon in the US is 915.00MHz. What does this interfere with in NZ?

delroynitz:

 

Insteon in the US is 915.00MHz. What does this interfere with in NZ?

 

Its the edge of a Vodafone cellphone band - It runs from 899.8 MHz - 915.0 MHz

delroynitz:

 

Does anyone know what kind of range the RF on Zwave or Insteon is? How far does it extend outside of your house?

 

The range can be very significant. Even with very low power devices you can get several hundred metres + even with a small antenna.

The main issue is the uplink cell frequencies have super sensitive masthead amps to pick up the weak TX signals from a phone. This is why the US DECT phones caused issues - a DECT phone may only cover a hundred metres or so but these amps will easily pick that up.

neb:

evilengineer:

 

So what was wrong with NZ adopting the same 868Mhz band that the EU uses for z-wave?

 

NZ does use 868Mhz. Problem is that with most of the tech being created in the US, or manufactured for US specs by places like China, you end up with things that either cost 5x what they normally do when they've been reworked for 868Mhz, or simply aren't available.

So does that mean it's okay to use European 868Mhz z-wave in NZ?

The range/price won't be as good as the American stuff but still likely to be better than AUS/NZ.

And at least the EU/UK gear will have been made with 240V in mind.

evilengineer:

 

So does that mean it's okay to use European 868Mhz z-wave in NZ?

 

The range/price won't be as good as the American stuff but still likely to be better than AUS/NZ.

 

And at least the EU/UK gear will have been made with 240V in mind.

 

The SRD GURL contains the information for the New Zealand rules. I don't have the European rules to hand but it should be a relatively simple job to compare the two. New Zealand allows up to 6dBW (just under 4 watts EIRP) from 864 - 868 MHz if you employ frequency hoping within the band. Otherwise 1 watt is allowed on a static frequency.  

Edit: image issues

Thanks for this.

I'm running a US ST hub at home, buy currently only have Zigbee devices (wemo bulbs & ST motion / temp sensors)

I'll have to go and turn off the z-wave transmitter. 

DarthKermit:

 

^^^ Do you think that's a case of "too bad if the rest of the world don't like our standards."?

 

It can cut the other way at times - for instance the USA trailed the rest of the world in GSM phone technology. Europe and Asia were busy making GSM phones for the 900MHz and 1800MHz market (approx. 3 billion people) and the USA (approx. 250 million) got left behind - this is why Telecom/XT/Spark was so late to the party with a decent network and decent hand sets - they used USA/American frequencies which had a smaller market for phones.

Also, our terrestrial digital TV uses a later standard than many other countries which is much more efficient and easily and simply carries full HD.

Us and the Australian are way ahead of the USA with regard UHF CB channels - we had more channels much earlier.

SumnerBoy:

 

That is very interesting to hear that the RSM actually tracked someone down and knocked on their door. I always assumed it was a bit of a hollow threat. It must mean there was noticeable interference with something they monitor. 

 

We had some people gibber-jabbering in a foreign language on our work RT frequency for weeks on end. RSM did their best to track them down and eventually issued us with a new frequency to resolve the problem.

tripper1000:

 

SumnerBoy:

 

That is very interesting to hear that the RSM actually tracked someone down and knocked on their door. I always assumed it was a bit of a hollow threat. It must mean there was noticeable interference with something they monitor. 

 

 

We had some people gibber-jabbering in a foreign language on our work RT frequency for weeks on end. RSM did their best to track them down and eventually issued us with a new frequency to resolve the problem.

 

i find it very interesting that they could not locating the source of gibber-jabbering, but were able to locate what i'd expect is far less powerful zwave equipment in a house!

Ironic that I had only read this thread a couple of days ago and today, as I was driving through sleepy Featherston (of all places!) there was a white ute bristling like a porcupine with antennae, parked on a side street with "RSM" written on the side of it. Man inside, in customary HI-VIZ, was intently staring at a device in front of him. I wonder if there were some bad people using the wrong freq to turn their lounge lights on?

hio77:

 

 

 

i find it very interesting that they could not locating the source of gibber-jabbering, but were able to locate what i'd expect is far less powerful zwave equipment in a house!

 

you would be quiet suprised at how small a signal you can pickup with the right equipment