Orcon Genie White Router NF4V - Separate Network for Guest WIFI

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#1297644 4-May-2015 14:26

I logged a help-desk call.

Thank you for your email regarding your internet service.

From your email I understand you have some questions regarding the advance set up of your Netcomm modem.

At the moment, Orcon only support basic connectivity and troubleshooting for the Netcomm modem as they have their own technical support team. For questions or assistane with the advance configuration of your Netcomm modem, you may visit Netcomm's support site at link below.

http://www.netcommwireless.com/contact-forms/support.

I hope this information was helpful and if you have any other queries please do not hesitate to email me back or call me on the number below.

Seeing as they mentioned it ("I hope this information was helpful"), I have to say "No, that wasn't particularly helpful". I specifically referenced this thread in my call, and asked about the guide that FireEngine mentioned; nice to see my comments were more-or-less totally ignored. Sadly, there is a fairly good chance the the guide was never written, or that the information has been lost, due to turnover off particular staff members. Pity.

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Trade NZ and US shares and funds with Sharesies (affiliate link).

Jase2985

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#1297647 4-May-2015 14:31

pretty much the same for most other ISP's though, they can advise on basic trouble shooting and setting up the device to work but thats about it.

jamesrt

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#1297650 4-May-2015 14:39

Jase2985: pretty much the same for most other ISP's though, they can advise on basic trouble shooting and setting up the device to work but thats about it.

In this case, I disagree; comments in this thread indicated that about a year ago, the Orcon guys spent some time getting this working in a Lab, and apparently documented it. Now it appears they have either corporately forgotten this was done, and/or the documentation is now inaccessible (it could well have mostly been inside someone's head) or "lost".

I'm not trying to "diss" Orcon - I've had good experiences in the past with the Orcon staff taking quite some considerable time to help diagnose and resolve issues - but as with most organizations, it can take considerable effort, time, and patience (or a shortcut!) to get past the "Level 1" support team and to engage with someone who can actually solve the issue.

I'm still holding out hope that a lurking interested Orcon staffer will see this thread and see if the documentation still exists internally somewhere.....

WanaGo

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#1297771 4-May-2015 16:56

Agree 100%

My last few experiences with Orcon Level 1 support has been totally crap. Talk about teaching someone how to suck eggs, even if the information provided in the email to them indicated that one does not need to be taught such things, and really the information supplied is well beyond what they should even attempt to be replying to as a level 1 support. Its crap. Wasted so many days.

When I have been on Level 2 support, then the experience has been much better, but the effort required to get there is ridiculous.

As for this issue, I have tried many times to get the answers, and I got no were. So if you do manage to get some help about how to set this up, I would love to hear.

I did even contact the manufacturer directly and they also said it works in the lab fine, but I could not reproduce it no matter what I tried. They finally admitted that their firmware is not the same as what Orcon supplies, but they couldnt give it to me as it might break what Orcon has customised.

So I don't know where we are at.

Do keep this alive and us posted with how you get on.

Thanks

MadEngineer

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#1298644 5-May-2015 21:03

can you post what dhcp options you're being assigned on the guest network? (basic ipconfig is enough)

You're not on Atlantis anymore, Duncan Idaho.

WanaGo

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#1298672 5-May-2015 21:50

On main network:

IP: 10.1.1.17
Subnet: 255.255.255.0
Gateway: 10.1.1.1

disconnected and connected to Guest network:

IP: 10.1.1.17
Subnet: 255.255.255.0
Gateway: 10.1.1.1

Identical.
Did a forced renew and release etc, same.

So really they are the same network.

MadEngineer

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#1299293 6-May-2015 17:47

and while on the guest network can you ping the gateway?

You're not on Atlantis anymore, Duncan Idaho.

jamesrt

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#1299447 6-May-2015 20:58

Well now; this is interesting.

I've re-set the config on my NF4V in order to help answer MadEngineer's questions (I had WiFi turned off as I'm trying to diagnose a problem with NetFlix on Chromecast); and blow me down if it isn't actually working!!

I've setup two WiFi networks; created a new interface group; assigned the "wl0.1" interface to the 2nd group; setup a new subnet in the 2nd group, and can still access the internet from both WiFi SSIDs.

First SSID ("Primary") has subnet 192.168.20.x, with 192.168.20.1 (the NF4V) as the gateway; the 2nd SSID ("secondary") allocates addresses from 192.168.2.x, using 192.168.2.1 as the GW.

Here are a couple of traceroutes:

"Primary" SSID:
$ traceroute www.google.com
traceroute to www.google.com (74.125.237.208), 64 hops max, 52 byte packets
1 orcon (192.168.20.1) 77.785 ms 1.394 ms 0.943 ms
2 ufb.bng1.avl.orcon.net.nz (202.127.8.1) 6.935 ms 15.047 ms 120.418 ms
3 10.101.4.122 (10.101.4.122) 15.880 ms 130.342 ms 133.568 ms
4 ae1-0.cre2.nct.odyssey.net.nz (121.99.12.3) 15.847 ms 17.450 ms 15.447 ms
5 72.14.243.237 (72.14.243.237) 130.412 ms 44.433 ms 238.967 ms
6 72.14.243.236 (72.14.243.236) 38.199 ms 118.541 ms 43.195 ms
7 209.85.242.124 (209.85.242.124) 120.459 ms 48.301 ms 48.646 ms
8 72.14.236.181 (72.14.236.181) 39.402 ms 41.767 ms 44.245 ms
9 syd01s19-in-f16.1e100.net (74.125.237.208) 39.643 ms 40.215 ms 40.025 ms

"Secondary" SSID:
$ traceroute www.google.com
traceroute to www.google.com (74.125.237.208), 64 hops max, 52 byte packets
1 192.168.2.1 (192.168.2.1) 1.702 ms 1.023 ms 0.945 ms
2 ufb.bng1.avl.orcon.net.nz (202.127.8.1) 11.333 ms 8.063 ms 14.262 ms
3 10.101.4.122 (10.101.4.122) 17.685 ms 23.765 ms 17.521 ms
4 ae1-0.cre2.nct.odyssey.net.nz (121.99.12.3) 18.659 ms 16.032 ms 15.768 ms
5 72.14.243.237 (72.14.243.237) 67.250 ms 46.020 ms 56.331 ms
6 72.14.243.236 (72.14.243.236) 40.893 ms 42.637 ms 40.215 ms
7 209.85.242.124 (209.85.242.124) 49.079 ms 44.450 ms 45.499 ms
8 72.14.236.181 (72.14.236.181) 38.317 ms 46.397 ms 41.842 ms
9 syd01s19-in-f16.1e100.net (74.125.237.208) 44.477 ms 47.556 ms 46.394 ms

No idea why this is now working; when it didn't do before. I didn't do anything different this time, EXCEPT I changed the primary SSID name, as the rest of the household is using the Internet at the moment via my other AP, and I didn't want to annoy them all by dropping their connections; I'd struggle to see why the SSID name would make any difference to routing; but I've seen enough unpredictable behaviour in IT systems by now to not be entirely surprised either way!

OF course, to really be happy with this solution I'm going to have to relocate the Orcon router AGAIN as where it currently is sitting (by the ONT in the garage) is a little low on signal due to a large metal object (car!) being in the way! Can't have everything, sadly....

WanaGo

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#1299530 6-May-2015 22:37

Right I am going to try this right now!

What subnet mask did you allocate each group?

WanaGo

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#1299538 6-May-2015 22:46

Did not work for me.

Secondary SSID, allocates the new IP range and gateway fine, but no internet...

WanaGo

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#1299553 6-May-2015 23:22

This is like what you have?

WanaGo

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#1299557 6-May-2015 23:51

Think I got it going.
Referred to the old guide I got given.
Under NAT - Multi NAT, had to set up a Many to One, like this, where the scrubbed out bit is my external IP address - both rows use the same.
I now can resolve an external IP address on the 2nd SSID.

WanaGo

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#1299563 7-May-2015 00:06

Took it a step futher. Added a 3rd line to the Many to One configuration, in NAT - Multi NAT.
Made a 3rd SSID, with a 3rd IP range.

It works. It actually works.

Have connected 3 devices, on the 3 SSID's, all can access the internet, all cannot see each other on the WiFi/LAN due to network separation.
If I take off the Many to One setup, then all 3 SSID's still work in the sense they get network access, can see other things on their own network, but they CANNOT find a path out the hole to the www

So I am unsure how you managed to get your one working without this.
What Version of Firmware is in your router?

jamesrt

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#1299661 7-May-2015 09:09

WanaGo: So I am unsure how you managed to get your one working without this.

My "MultiNAT" section simply shows an empty table - perhaps the fact that you had a single entry in there prior to your initial testing prevented the 2nd network from working automatically? Although it doesn't explain why I couldn't initially get it to work either.

Frustrating when it suddenly works and you don't know why!

WanaGo: What Version of Firmware is in your router?

Build Timestamp: 201405271001
Software Version: GURNV5.OT132A-8-NC.Orcon-R5B029.EN

WanaGo

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#1299676 7-May-2015 09:21

"perhaps the fact that you had a single entry in there prior to your initial testing prevented the 2nd network from working automatically? "

I didn't have any entry in there prior, it was an empty table.

Manufacturer: NetComm Wireless
Product Class: NF4V
Build Timestamp: 201312161442
Software Version: GURNV5.OT132A-8-NC.Orcon-R5B019.EN
Bootloader (CFE) Version: 1.0.38-114.170
DSL PHY and Driver Version: A2pv6F039d.d24l
VDSL PROFILE: No profile
Wireless Driver Version: 6.30.163.23.cpe4.12L
Voice Service Version: V2.4

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