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Topic # 83006 8-May-2011 15:53
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Hi,

Back in the day National data was not counted towards you data usage, ISP's need to reintroduce this. Alot of complaining about poor speeds and being limited to what they can get from Southern cross cable, which is valid, but what about National traffic?

I know alot of my data usage would go down if national data wasn't counted.

NZ backup services
Streaming from tvnz
Good old Linux mirrors
SKY streaming
TIVO streaming

FX networks does all you can eat National but only to business :(

Slingshot can you make it happen?

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  Reply # 466785 8-May-2011 15:59
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National traffic is not free someone has to pay for it,

John

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  Reply # 466788 8-May-2011 16:08
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National traffic is still dependant on telecom wholesale for the most part. (from you to your ISP still has to go through telecom backhaul/handover (with ULL exceptions))

Plus it still costs money to provision national bandwidth and it's still quite expensive, AFAIK.

 
 
 
 


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  Reply # 466790 8-May-2011 16:08
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Hmmm now the start of the big 'peering' debate.

Do any of the big (non-peering) ISP's wish to comment? 

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  Reply # 466795 8-May-2011 16:22
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the only two of them i use are sky and TVNZ and both are free from my ISP , so im happy



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  Reply # 466799 8-May-2011 16:42
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Can the ISP's simply not use another backbone provider that has free national traffic (FX fiber network for example).

I have no affiliation to FX but if they can do free national traffic sad we are not seeing it in other ISPs

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  Reply # 466810 8-May-2011 17:12
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There is no such thing as free traffic any where


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  Reply # 466812 8-May-2011 17:18
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johnr: There is no such thing as free traffic any where



Well, there is. Although it's not really "free".
If you buy transit/bandwidth, you pay by the mbit/s and/or CIR/burstable rates/etc.
 

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  Reply # 466813 8-May-2011 17:18
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SX is only part of the issue. If every ISP offered "free" national data overniight all that would happen would be massive slowdowns as handover points, particularly DSL, ground to a halt with all the extra traffic.

Nothing is free in this world. Even interconnection of data at a local level still has an inherent cost.

The reality is there are plenty of options to get unlimited national data if you're willing to pay for it. You've made it clear you aren't.


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  Reply # 466822 8-May-2011 17:34
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I think the next big reason we all moved away from it was that it was very confusing to clients, I can't recall how many tickets I've seen in my time where users going to anything .nz thought it was free




Most problems are the result of previous solutions...

All comment's I make are my own personal opinion and do not in any way, shape or form reflect the views of current or former employers unless specifically stated 

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  Reply # 466831 8-May-2011 17:54
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"There is no such thing as free traffic any where "

Just like lunches!


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  Reply # 466878 8-May-2011 19:42
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darkevil011: Can the ISP's simply not use another backbone provider that has free national traffic (FX fiber network for example).

I have no affiliation to FX but if they can do free national traffic sad we are not seeing it in other ISPs


The problem is that all the other ISP's would have to build their network to interconnect with FX, and FX charges money to do that.
Then the other side is that telecom and telstra clear both also do the same thing FX does - provide national transit but all isps would need to interconnect and it would be too expensive to connect to all 3 or have everyone choose just one to connect to.

If you have the capacity to deliver unlimtied traffic to your customers from your office, then its fine, and if you have an upstream connection that gives you national traffic at a super low cost then that is also able to be done.

But if most of your customer tails are DSL through telecom wholesale, and they only allocate a dedicated 45kb/s to each customer then you have the problem that a few of your customers are going to saturate your tail backhaul capacity and slow everyone else down.




Ray Taylor
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There is no place like localhost
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  Reply # 466881 8-May-2011 19:50
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raytaylor:
darkevil011: Can the ISP's simply not use another backbone provider that has free national traffic (FX fiber network for example).

I have no affiliation to FX but if they can do free national traffic sad we are not seeing it in other ISPs


The problem is that all the other ISP's would have to build their network to interconnect with FX, and FX charges money to do that.


People tend to believe national traffic is free. It's not. This is just an example.

 




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  Reply # 466882 8-May-2011 19:51
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raytaylor: But if most of your customer tails are DSL through telecom wholesale, and they only allocate a dedicated 45kb/s to each customer then you have the problem that a few of your customers are going to saturate your tail backhaul capacity and slow everyone else down.


45kbps hasn't been the only option for a number of months now. There are a number of ISP's who have moved to much higher dimensioning of their handovers.

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  Reply # 466895 8-May-2011 20:15
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sbiddle:
raytaylor: But if most of your customer tails are DSL through telecom wholesale, and they only allocate a dedicated 45kb/s to each customer then you have the problem that a few of your customers are going to saturate your tail backhaul capacity and slow everyone else down.


45kbps hasn't been the only option for a number of months now. There are a number of ISP's who have moved to much higher dimensioning of their handovers.


Oh yes, you can now get 120kbit/s? or something like that. However it is still minor details that complicate the question at hand and still isnt enough to solve an issue that free national traffic would cause




Ray Taylor
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www.ruralkiwi.com

There is no place like localhost
For my general guide to extending your wireless network Click Here




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  Reply # 466896 8-May-2011 20:24
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raytaylor:
sbiddle:
raytaylor: But if most of your customer tails are DSL through telecom wholesale, and they only allocate a dedicated 45kb/s to each customer then you have the problem that a few of your customers are going to saturate your tail backhaul capacity and slow everyone else down.


45kbps hasn't been the only option for a number of months now. There are a number of ISP's who have moved to much higher dimensioning of their handovers.


Oh yes, you can now get 120kbit/s? or something like that. However it is still minor details that complicate the question at hand and still isnt enough to solve an issue that free national traffic would cause


Exactly. I'd pick 100kbps handovers with unlimited national traffic would immediately bog down the handovers like what happened with 32kbps and then 45kbps.

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