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262 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 374900 31-Aug-2010 14:43
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Telecom have a google cache so youtube video's load pretty much instantly with 0 buffering

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Uber Geek
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  Reply # 374901 31-Aug-2010 14:45
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Orcon have one too...




rm *


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  Reply # 374906 31-Aug-2010 14:52
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@samgab: Thanks for the email copy and pasting.
I have taken a screenshot for future reference (just incase it gets deleted) and the email's are certinally eyebrow raising to say the least. Gives me some of my own ammo to raise hell with them when I get home tonight.

The first email from Michael is clearly a form copy and paste, while the second and third seem to be more genuine.

The funny thing is - I actually KNOW Michael Ciuchini. He told me on Friday that he got a job at Orcon (I don't know how long he has been there)

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Master Geek
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  Reply # 374907 31-Aug-2010 14:52
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Detruire: Orcon have one too...


Orcon's one doesn't appear to be working... Although just to prove me wrong, when I checked earlier today, youtube was actually going fine without buffer freezes, first time since I changed to UBS that it's gone like that. 

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Master Geek
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  Reply # 374911 31-Aug-2010 14:55
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For all you guys changing to telecom, please let us know how it performs compared to Orcon. I'm interested in switching as well. Orcon has been abysmal for me for a few months now. I really would like to know what has happened with them. They used to be great.

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Master Geek
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  Reply # 374913 31-Aug-2010 14:56
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nzkiwiman: ...The funny thing is - I actually KNOW Michael Ciuchini. He told me on Friday that he got a job at Orcon (I don't know how long he has been there)


Oh snap! No offense intended to Michael whatsoever, but he just might need a little more training on Orcon's traffic shaping policies. 
And yes, I have no complaints about the customer services from Clare Zwaan, she was very helpful, and she isn't the one who sets the processes and policies in place: I appreciated her honesty/transparency. 

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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 374915 31-Aug-2010 14:59
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raab: Telecom have a google cache so youtube video's load pretty much instantly with 0 buffering 


Orcon has one too and it works fine as long as the video you happen to be viewing is cached. In that case it usually comes in at full line speed (which could indeed be bottle-necked if you happen to be on a Telecom Wholesale connection). From observation they only seem to cache the most popular videos. Unfourtently the sort of videos I look at aren't usually popular! The issue, for me, is mainly with videos that are not cached.

The speed different is very notable on Orcon (either LLU or Wholesale) vs Telecom for uncached videos. Not to mention the cache is only for YouTube, there are some other video sites I use also which works fine on Telecom (despite no caching at all for non-YouTube videos) but has buffering issues on Orcon.

plas: 6 weeks to resolve the handover issue, yeah right. Its been how many months now.


I presume Orcon is referring to the handover link between Telecom and Orcon. This raises the question of why I see video buffering issue on Orcon+ connection where Orcon doesn't have to worry about ADSL handover links to other providers.

As far as I know my Orcon+ connection consists of a 14mbits ADSL2+ line to the exchange and Vector fibre optic from exchange to Orcon's switching centre which means the bottle neck must be somewhere beyond!

- James

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  Reply # 374916 31-Aug-2010 15:00
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samgab:
nzkiwiman: ...The funny thing is - I actually KNOW Michael Ciuchini. He told me on Friday that he got a job at Orcon (I don't know how long he has been there)


Oh snap! No offense intended to Michael whatsoever, but he just might need a little more training on Orcon's traffic shaping policies. 
And yes, I have no complaints about the customer services from Clare Zwaan, she was very helpful, and she isn't the one who sets the processes and policies in place: I appreciated her honesty/transparency. 


As I said, highly suspect that it is a form email
He has been told to reply to the emails, and here and the accepted email templates to use (even if those templates LIE to your customers)

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Master Geek
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  Reply # 374927 31-Aug-2010 15:11
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nzkiwiman: As I said, highly suspect that it is a form email
He has been told to reply to the emails, and here and the accepted email templates to use (even if those templates LIE to your customers)


Yeah, I reckon my emails got escalated after that, maybe Clare is higher up the chain and is allowed to use her own wording...

As far as what kiwisurfer was saying about speed on LLU, when we were on Orcon + LLU prior to the cabinet, we didn't have any issues with Youtube, sometimes I could even load them in nearly HD quality in real time... We're >3Kms from the exchange though, so we had about 5Mbps max down at the time, and very high noise, so the sync would drop periodically.
Now that we're on UBS, we have a much higher line rate, but having international traffic issues that we didn't have before.

To be honest, it's not a MAJOR problem, I don't spend THAT much time watching youtube vids, although from this thread it must seem that way, I just get annoyed when I do go to watch one and it spends more time freezing than actually playing.

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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 374940 31-Aug-2010 15:34
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As far as what kiwisurfer was saying about speed on LLU, when we were on Orcon + LLU prior to the cabinet, we didn't have any issues with Youtube, [b]sometimes[/b] I could even load them in nearly HD quality in real time... We're >3Kms from the exchange though, so we had about 5Mbps max down at the time, and very high noise, so the sync would drop periodically.
Now that we're on UBS, we have a much higher line rate, but having international traffic issues that we didn't have before..


Fair enough, but I have to pick on your choice of the word 'sometimes'. My observation is that Telecom connections don't have an issue with 99% of the youtube videos I view -- HD or not. I expect the same from Orcon regardless of whether or not my connection is LLU or not.

You have an interesting data point though, wonder if Orcon is shaping LLU traffic differently from non-LLU...

- James 

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Master Geek
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  Reply # 374994 31-Aug-2010 16:21
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KiwiSurfer:
As far as what kiwisurfer was saying about speed on LLU, when we were on Orcon + LLU prior to the cabinet, we didn't have any issues with Youtube, [b]sometimes[/b] I could even load them in nearly HD quality in real time... We're >3Kms from the exchange though, so we had about 5Mbps max down at the time, and very high noise, so the sync would drop periodically.
Now that we're on UBS, we have a much higher line rate, but having international traffic issues that we didn't have before..


Fair enough, but I have to pick on your choice of the word 'sometimes'. My observation is that Telecom connections don't have an issue with 99% of the youtube videos I view -- HD or not. I expect the same from Orcon regardless of whether or not my connection is LLU or not.

You have an interesting data point though, wonder if Orcon is shaping LLU traffic differently from non-LLU...

- James 


Well, according to Orcon's own admission they are shaping LLU traffic at a higher priority to UBS/UBA.
See this Orcon posting: http://bit.ly/ctIJbl

it says, in part: "...Our retail UCLL services are dimensioned roughly 3 times higher than UBA services..."
Also see the second chart on that posting. All the LLU traffic is a tier higher than UBA/UBS.
Someone please correct me if I'm mis-interpreting that posting, but it does correlate to my own experience with both services. 

143 posts

Master Geek


  Reply # 375123 31-Aug-2010 22:32
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hey sounddude heres my stats I goto a site named battlecam.com and its laggy as hell for me right now and in the daytime of late. I just spoke to my mate in whangaporoa who is on telstra and getting 10mbs dwn and said the battlecam.com site is running smoothly for him as we speak 10.30pm. can one of your help desk people goto the site if i call them at like 8pm or something and tell me if it laggy for them too? cheers

 



Status:
Cable connected


Line mode:
ADSL2+


Maximum line rate:
20208 kbps (downstream) / 1364 kbps (upstream)


Noise margin:
4.9 dB (downstream) / 18.3 dB (upstream)


Line attenuation:
21.2 dB (downstream) / 12.3 dB (upstream)


Output power:
19.9 dBm (downstream) / 11.3 dBm (upstream)




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  Reply # 375134 1-Sep-2010 00:39
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samgab: 

Well, according to Orcon's own admission they are shaping LLU traffic at a higher priority to UBS/UBA.
See this Orcon posting: http://bit.ly/ctIJbl

it says, in part: "...Our retail UCLL services are dimensioned roughly 3 times higher than UBA services..."
Also see the second chart on that posting. All the LLU traffic is a tier higher than UBA/UBS.
Someone please correct me if I'm mis-interpreting that posting, but it does correlate to my own experience with both services. 


Your Line > ADSL Port in Cabinet/Exchange > Backhaul to ISP Handover > Handover links > ISP's network 

With a UBA/UBS connection all the above before the ISP network are Telecom wholesale services.  Orcon have little control over the backhaul and handover link dimensioning.

The handover links are provisioned by Telecom to the ISP at something like:

-- 32kbps x (number of current subscribers plus forecast growth for 6 months) , recalculated every 3 months.

It might actually be 48kbps now, haven't kept up.

One theory is that Orcon don't have enough low usage mom and pop type users to balance out the heavy active users (Telstra and Telecom never seem to have handover link issues for example).

If I recall correctly for their LLU equipment Orcon mostly use Vector fibre for the backhaul provisioned with a CIR of ~100kbps per user.


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  Reply # 375280 1-Sep-2010 13:10
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Well, come 1st October I shall be Orcon free after more than 5 years with them.
Yet to decide who I will actually move my Internet to though

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  Reply # 375496 1-Sep-2010 21:06
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Daylo: Telecom Broadband Pro plan ordered.

I really do hope you work your shizzle out Orcon. 


Cool



moved to telecom today, damn I am happy with the new speed at peak time(now)!

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