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rjh



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Topic # 98765 6-Mar-2012 09:37
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I was probably NZ's highest residential data user for February. Remember, Kim Dotcom spent most of February in jail :-). I've had to contact Orcon several times about this, and the helpdesk/support person's reaction when I ask them to look at my account every time is - "HOLY CRAP!"

I'm a very long term customer of Orcon, having been with them for (I think) over 10 years. I've always been pretty happy with their service, accepting that glitches and problems eventually all get sorted out and things always improve, and I've always recommended them to others. I'm part way in to a 2 year contract on a Genius, 30GB plan. Although it has an annoying number of problems (like dropped calls, features randomly not working) and the hardware is appalling, the service is OK and I'm confident it will improve.

Last month, while my back was turned, Chrome downloaded $1,300+ of data. This was not video, internet radio, games or torrents; it was just Chrome having a seizure after spending some days with multiple tabs open. There was no obvious way to tell this was happening, and I was unaware of it until the invoice arrived, and by that time I was already in the hole for >52GB for the following month. This is not data that was deliberately downloaded or written to a hard drive. Multiple systems on the network, the likely culprit is Chrome running on Ubuntu.

That is the background, and in that context I'd like to hear (perhaps even from Orcon):

  • Orcon used to send warnings when data caps were approached (I have a mail inbox that contains several); why was this service silently dropped? Other than the obvious cynical reason, why don't Orcon help their customers by re-instating this, set at a threshold that is reasonably far above normal usage so that it is invisible? If the whole point of caps is to manage network resources, some indicators would also help to this goal. Surely?
  • My Orcon usage page is broken; I cannot see any data usage for the past 12 days, so I cannot definitively verify the problem is not continuing. How are users supposed to manage their data when the tools we need to do this have been either discontinued or are not working?
  • While this is in no way Orcon's problem, I had thought they might be more helpful in identifying the problem and preventing a recurrence. They claim they are unable to provide or identify the source(s) of this data usage; is this correct? I had thought that all activity was logged for monitoring by DIA etc. (They can, however, identify the type of traffic, which is slightly helpful, though they haven't done this yet).
  • In the absence of any help or tools from Orcon, how do I go about identifying the cause of this problem, because I really do not want this to happen again. I have been running EtherApe which shows Chrome chatters an awful lot (far more than Firefox) but nothing so far that would lead to such devastating data usage.
I'd also be interested to hear if this has happened to others, and how they dealt with the financial side, this is hurting quite a lot - at the moment, I'm an extremely unhappy Orcon customer. It really is true - you cannot really judge a company until things go wrong, and see how they handle it. Despite a discount, I really feel Orcon are being opportunistic here (as is their right, of course - but this doesn't make me a happy customer). In fact, I'm seriously thinking of walking. Orcon is a very different company to the one I signed up with all those years ago.

Thanks.

(tl;dr - too much data; Orcon: tough, your problem; other people's experiences?)

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  Reply # 591079 6-Mar-2012 10:03
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To cut a long story short, I am wondering how Chrome with multiple tabs open can cause your issue? 

Sure its not something else on the network that caused the problem?  I just don't see how you can say it probably was Ubuntu with Chrome running.  I have a Laptop here with Ubuntu and Chrome and I leave tabs open on it a lot, while doing something on my main computer and I have never had your issue.

 

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  Reply # 591081 6-Mar-2012 10:07
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You may wish to cut down on the pies.

tldr.




 
 
 
 


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  Reply # 591082 6-Mar-2012 10:07
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Yikes! How is the $1,300 of data made up?

Are you saying that 52GB overuse costs $1,300 on orcon?

Is that because you have gone into the 'casual' data charging at X per mb/GB or something?

You would hope that if this is the case and that is a one off 'odd' charge they could do something to write-off the majority of the charge. That data clearly doesnt cost Orcon that amount..

Cant quite think how chrome could do that to you - I know its inclined to be a memory hog with lots of tabs open - but why do you suspect it was chrome using so much data?

Sadly, I dont know though how you expect Orcon can identify the problem for you if it is coming from 'your end'. Your info is pretty much private in that respect - I doubt they would be allowed to analyse it. I have however seen people report that their connections have been attacked (hackers trying to access their connection etc/DoS attacks etc) and have racked up huge usage because of that sort of thing (you pay for incoming data as well as outgoing). Are you sure you havent had some kind of attack? I dont know if they could provide you with any information about that sort of thing.

What you are asking for - warnings etc and being able to check your balance all sounds reasonable - you are reasonable to expect them to be working.

Ideally maybe you need a hard data cap - I dont think orcon provide those plans though.




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  Reply # 591089 6-Mar-2012 10:19
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semigeek: To cut a long story short, I am wondering how Chrome with multiple tabs open can cause your issue? 

Sure its not something else on the network that caused the problem?  I just don't see how you can say it probably was Ubuntu with Chrome running.  I have a Laptop here with Ubuntu and Chrome and I leave tabs open on it a lot, while doing something on my main computer and I have never had your issue.

 


It is possible if chrome crashes leaving some process constantly looping and downloading data.

Not unheard of for programs to go into undesired looping. 

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  Reply # 591093 6-Mar-2012 10:24

I called up Orcon the other day and they told me that it was only $2 per GB over your plans data allowance... I know I just shot over by 5 GB... Hope this isn't true!

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  Reply # 591103 6-Mar-2012 10:39
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Leaving a browser open can continually download data - flash based banner adverts.


Once upon a time, you used to download an animated gif as a banner advert on a website and it would just roll over and over.


Now you get those fancy video based flash banners - that can also refresh themselves and change over time. Each refresh would download a new file.


If chrome had half crashed and still had the process running in the background, then i would not be surprised if this has been happening. 


           




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  Reply # 591105 6-Mar-2012 10:43
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Hi guys,
rjh - please drop me a line - quentin.reade@team.orcon.net.nz with your acct details, any ticket numbers - and we'll get to the bottom of it.
Overage on your plan (and most plans) is $2 per GB.
Thanks




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  Reply # 591108 6-Mar-2012 10:49
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raytaylor: Leaving a browser open can continually download data - flash based banner adverts.


Once upon a time, you used to download an animated gif as a banner advert on a website and it would just roll over and over.


Now you get those fancy video based flash banners - that can also refresh themselves and change over time. Each refresh would download a new file.


If chrome had half crashed and still had the process running in the background, then i would not be surprised if this has been happening. 


           


Yes , I recently tracked down unexplained overnight internet usage to chrome.   Chrome was happily chewing 3MB/hour unattended -- 2 pc's with chrome were eating 6mb / hour.   Not much for an hour, but, extrapolate across a month and it is not inconsiderable. 
 

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  Reply # 591111 6-Mar-2012 10:53
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rjh: 
  • While this is in no way Orcon's problem, I had thought they might be more helpful in identifying the problem and preventing a recurrence. They claim they are unable to provide or identify the source(s) of this data usage; is this correct? I had thought that all activity was logged for monitoring by DIA etc. (They can, however, identify the type of traffic, which is slightly helpful, though they haven't done this yet).


No, and if they are in fact logging in this level of detail then I will be cancelling my account within minutes of hearing it.  The DIA internet filter for those ISPs who subscribe (Orcon is not one of them anyway) is just a system whereby the DIA announces via BGP that they are the network route to IP addresses which are deemed to contain illicit material.  Only traffic that is destined for those IPs will pass near the DIA systems, and they don't receive any sort of info about where you go on the internet.  That's not how it works.

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  Reply # 591113 6-Mar-2012 10:53
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Wow chrome causing this sort of issue i have never heard of.

xpd

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  Reply # 591120 6-Mar-2012 11:08
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If the usage meter is not showing your usage, just reboot the router - Orcon are aware of the "glitch" ;)





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  Reply # 591130 6-Mar-2012 11:29
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52GB...pfft, that's 1/5 of my monthly cap :P

Bugger though, I bet that's a huge increase for you judging by the bill! 

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  Reply # 591134 6-Mar-2012 11:36
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I learned a lesson a few years ago - was in Melbourne and had opened a webpage on a Windows Mobile device just before going to a restaurant for dinner - the page displayed sports results and unfortunately was designed to autorefresh regularly - around the time I finished dinner I received a text from the mobile network to say that my balance was near exhausted and it had gone through >$200 prepay credit while I had been enjoying an excellent meal (which suddenly became very expensive). I realised it was my own fault and didn't call the mobile company but did learn an important lesson about leaving browser sessions open.

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  Reply # 591138 6-Mar-2012 11:45
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Kyanar:
rjh: 
  • While this is in no way Orcon's problem, I had thought they might be more helpful in identifying the problem and preventing a recurrence. They claim they are unable to provide or identify the source(s) of this data usage; is this correct? I had thought that all activity was logged for monitoring by DIA etc. (They can, however, identify the type of traffic, which is slightly helpful, though they haven't done this yet).


No, and if they are in fact logging in this level of detail then I will be cancelling my account within minutes of hearing it.  The DIA internet filter for those ISPs who subscribe (Orcon is not one of them anyway) is just a system whereby the DIA announces via BGP that they are the network route to IP addresses which are deemed to contain illicit material.  Only traffic that is destined for those IPs will pass near the DIA systems, and they don't receive any sort of info about where you go on the internet.  That's not how it works.


Correct, we do not know what you were surfing, however we may assume a classification for traffic based on things like port and traffic type, but we do not track sites or traffic content.

Paul




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  Reply # 591150 6-Mar-2012 11:53
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th3r3turn: Wow chrome causing this sort of issue i have never heard of.


Here are some stats i captured last night....(one pc on overnight with chrome active)...

Usage per hour...

 

Detailed usage by application....




It is a coincidence this thread came up the same time that I was looking into it.  

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