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727 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 578286 7-Feb-2012 16:22
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heyhey:
xarqi: "A pup"? 
 
The problems ran much, much deeper, involving the design, manufacturing, and testing of the model prior to release to the market, and the abusive and utterly unprofessional conduct of the retailer that emerged when it became clear that I couldn't be fobbed off with the standard "I've sold hundreds of these and nobody else has complained" line.  However, no amount of bravado could prevent him being non-plussed when he found that 3 of 4 units in his stock wouldn't power up properly! 



pup = dud, whatever you would like to call it.

Oh I understood the term, but it didn't apply in my case.  It wasn't a one-off manufacturing problem or similar, but appeared to involve the model itself, not just the specific unit I first received.

You seem to have intimate contact with the manufaturer if you're familar with the design, manufactruing and testing of these receivers.

No "intimate contact" is required.  Flaws in design or manufacturing (and testing) were apparent to me from the 75% failure rate for one presumably hardware fault alone.  Testing faults were also obvious to me from the numerous and egregious blunders that I observed, particularly on the firmware side, indicating to me inadequate development prior to release.  I could not see any of these being fixed under warranty, whether it be 1 year, 2 years, or 20 years duration.  It was not that something had broken, it was that it seemed to me that it had never worked properly in the first place!

 Is it possible if we make suggestions you can pass them on?

Well, no, sorry, I can't as I've never had much contact with the importer, and none with the manufacturer(s) [see below *].  When I asked the retailer to forward the very very detailed list of faults I'd painstakingly documented up the chain for comment and action he seemed to take it as a personal affront and there is no evidence that he ever did.   Nor was I really very happy about spending hundreds of hours doing unpaid product development work.

Maybe the retailer is who you have your beef with. 

There's no doubt about that at all. It's a shame really; until things started to go off the rails, the retailer was extremely pleasant, helpful, courteous and professional. When problems arose, there was a dramatic change. He seemed to take it very personally and I triggered a massive defensive response from him resulting in very unwelcome and repeated torrents of nonsense and abuse.  Unfortunately, under the CGA, my recourse is with the retailer in the first instance, so I had to cope with it as best I could. 

None of that absolves the importer from responsibility for releasing a buggy product though.  Had I found no such issues, the difficulties with the retailer would never have arisen.

[*]As for the manufacturer, well,  who is that?  For some models I believe it's Fortis, in Korea, in others it's never been revealed as far as I know.

It seems to me that "Ultraplus" is essentially a badge or brand-name applied by a local importer to units they source from, well, who knows where, much like the "house brands" that are seen at The Warehouse, JB HiFi, Dick Smiths, whatever.  That's not to say that such products cannot be cheap and reliable, but I found Ultraplus to be neither, and would have done so even without the profound unpleasantness I encountered on the way to discovering this.

Still, time has moved on.  It could be hoped that the current crop of Ultraplus offerings are all that they claim to be and maybe more.  I won't be taking the chance though, nor advising anyone else to do so.

At the end of the day, it's caveat emptor and have a firm grasp of your rights under the CGA.




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Wannabe Geek


  Reply # 578404 7-Feb-2012 20:14
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Wow I wasn't expecting a reply but obviouly you've been scared! I've done a bit more googling etc and there are great places for support on the net and I see people aren't experincing unsurmountable problems.
I'm sure if you were to look at such a receiver now, in time you would come to enjoy it as I am enjoying mine.
Take care,
Hey.

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  Reply # 578413 7-Feb-2012 20:35
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My experience has overall been positive with the ultraplus that after just over 2 years I bought another one.  No make or model of anything is perfect
 My first was the Ultraplus F-9000HD.  When I bought it I found it worked fine except when I wanted to copy from internal to external drive, in which case it locked up and I had to power off and on. Future firmware updates fixed that.  Then a later firmware update introduced a file deletion problem where you couldnt delete any files. That has also been fixed.  

I now have bought the Ultraplus x-9200 as I liked the Ultraplus F-9000.    The only thing I miss with them is there is no series record with them.

With the x-9200 I also like the freetv on it and also I can view any youtube videos as well

On my experience I would recommend them.





HTPC Intel Pentium G3258 cpu, Gigabyte H97n-wifi motherboard, , 8GB DDR3 ram, onboard  graphics. Hauppuage HVR 5500 tuner,  Silverstone LC16M case, Windows 10 pro 64 bit using Nextpvr and Kodi


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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 578450 7-Feb-2012 21:40
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Gilco2: When I bought it I found it worked fine except when I wanted to copy from internal to external drive, in which case it locked up and I had to power off and on. Future firmware updates fixed that.  Then a later firmware update introduced a file deletion problem where you couldnt delete any files. That has also been fixed.


And that's a basis for a recommendation???

Imagine it was a car:

"Hey, I bought a HyperMegaUltraGreat car, and it was wonderful!  Mind you, for some reason it refused to turn left, but there was an easy work-around - we just had to go around the block the other way instead.  Still they soon fixed that.  Unfortunately, when it came back, the headlights couldn't be turned off and the horn went whenever I pressed the accelerator, but they fixed that too, so I'm REALLY happy with the brand and the quality of service."

Laughable.




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  Reply # 578482 7-Feb-2012 22:45
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xarqi:
Gilco2: When I bought it I found it worked fine except when I wanted to copy from internal to external drive, in which case it locked up and I had to power off and on. Future firmware updates fixed that.  Then a later firmware update introduced a file deletion problem where you couldnt delete any files. That has also been fixed.


And that's a basis for a recommendation???

Imagine it was a car:

"Hey, I bought a HyperMegaUltraGreat car, and it was wonderful!  Mind you, for some reason it refused to turn left, but there was an easy work-around - we just had to go around the block the other way instead.  Still they soon fixed that.  Unfortunately, when it came back, the headlights couldn't be turned off and the horn went whenever I pressed the accelerator, but they fixed that too, so I'm REALLY happy with the brand and the quality of service."

Laughable.



I am sorry you feel so negative. I really dont want to argue.  You really cant blame all Ultraplus for 1 bad model you had.  My ones are working perfect and they are well supported.   You will be looking forever and never finding if you expect to find something man made that is perfect.  The best you can do is find a product that does what it says and if a fault shows up that it is addressed and I have found that in Ultraplus.  The only thing not working is there is no series record. They dont advertise there is one so I cant fault them.
 




HTPC Intel Pentium G3258 cpu, Gigabyte H97n-wifi motherboard, , 8GB DDR3 ram, onboard  graphics. Hauppuage HVR 5500 tuner,  Silverstone LC16M case, Windows 10 pro 64 bit using Nextpvr and Kodi


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  Reply # 579242 9-Feb-2012 12:49
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I have an Openbox S9 which is HD and has some pretty good features for the price, but the recording interface is pretty clunky, at least with the current firmware, and it's not really suitable for those who just want to point and click. I would describe it as more of a hacker box, with lots of potential flexibility for those who have the interest and ability, also usable for the non-technical but probably not the handiest.




I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


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  Reply # 579257 9-Feb-2012 13:02
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Gilco2:  You really cant blame all Ultraplus for 1 bad model you had.   


Xarqi actually described some very relevant points (in previous posts) that were a consequence of poor design rather than a '1 bad model' situation.  Ultraplus (and several other companies) have been guilty of releasing products earlier than they really should have been, especially with regards to pre testing/commissioning of the interface.  Typically the hardware is all pretty good, it's just the amount of time, thought and care that has gone into the interface, and how it achieves what it's aiming to.  The S9 comment above is very typical, in that yes it can technically record, but in practise it's not as simple as it could be.

So in short, whilst your experience with Ultraplus has been great, that is not the case with everyone.  Everyone is right about their experiences though, and I think it's important everyone gets to hear every side.

Actually this came up today with someone at work.  Since freeview kicked off they have been let down to some degree by the hardware that has been available.  We've already been through some units that have come and gone and now have no support.  Zinwell and JC Matthews for instance come to mind.  And then there are approved units vs compatible, where we see great units such as the Magic TV which has been severely handicapped in order to be approved, vs TIVO who openly make extra money selling you a code to directly copy the content off the device.  As has been mentioned, to some degree you just have to pick one and go for it.



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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 579275 9-Feb-2012 13:42
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Yup, I'll be recomending the DishTV box for them, it suits their needs best.

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  Reply # 579537 10-Feb-2012 08:06
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Jaxson:
Gilco2:  You really cant blame all Ultraplus for 1 bad model you had.   


Xarqi actually described some very relevant points (in previous posts) that were a consequence of poor design rather than a '1 bad model' situation.  Ultraplus (and several other companies) have been guilty of releasing products earlier than they really should have been, especially with regards to pre testing/commissioning of the interface.  Typically the hardware is all pretty good, it's just the amount of time, thought and care that has gone into the interface, and how it achieves what it's aiming to.  The S9 comment above is very typical, in that yes it can technically record, but in practise it's not as simple as it could be.

So in short, whilst your experience with Ultraplus has been great, that is not the case with everyone.  Everyone is right about their experiences though, and I think it's important everyone gets to hear every side.

Actually this came up today with someone at work.  Since freeview kicked off they have been let down to some degree by the hardware that has been available.  We've already been through some units that have come and gone and now have no support.  Zinwell and JC Matthews for instance come to mind.  And then there are approved units vs compatible, where we see great units such as the Magic TV which has been severely handicapped in order to be approved, vs TIVO who openly make extra money selling you a code to directly copy the content off the device.  As has been mentioned, to some degree you just have to pick one and go for it.


Yeah I know he had valid points, but you dont condem all of the brand because of a bad model.  Like Holden a few years back had a few models that had design fault that caused cambelts to break quickly.  You dont condem all Holdens because of a few that had design fault.  Every manufacturer WILL have faulty models. Over time they usually but not always rectify the problem.

That what I am trying to say. There always will be faulty models sometimes with major desin flaws. Its just life and no point condeming the whole brand.  

I guess I have trouble trying to explain clearly and really dont mean to offend anyone.




HTPC Intel Pentium G3258 cpu, Gigabyte H97n-wifi motherboard, , 8GB DDR3 ram, onboard  graphics. Hauppuage HVR 5500 tuner,  Silverstone LC16M case, Windows 10 pro 64 bit using Nextpvr and Kodi


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  Reply # 579538 10-Feb-2012 08:11
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CutCutCut: Yup, I'll be recomending the DishTV box for them, it suits their needs best.
Hi if you get the DishTV s7090pvr like I also have one, you wont be sorry.  However if as mine it comes with firmware v1.30, I would recommend to upgrade to v1.35.  Mine had a few minor faults mainly with playing files usb drive and those were fixed with the firmware upgrade.  The machine is working well and never missed a recording using series link.  My Panasonic BM880 recorder always missed recordings and recorded only sometimes.




HTPC Intel Pentium G3258 cpu, Gigabyte H97n-wifi motherboard, , 8GB DDR3 ram, onboard  graphics. Hauppuage HVR 5500 tuner,  Silverstone LC16M case, Windows 10 pro 64 bit using Nextpvr and Kodi




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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 579555 10-Feb-2012 09:00
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Gilco2:
CutCutCut: Yup, I'll be recomending the DishTV box for them, it suits their needs best.
Hi if you get the DishTV s7090pvr like I also have one, you wont be sorry.  However if as mine it comes with firmware v1.30, I would recommend to upgrade to v1.35.  Mine had a few minor faults mainly with playing files usb drive and those were fixed with the firmware upgrade.  The machine is working well and never missed a recording using series link.  My Panasonic BM880 recorder always missed recordings and recorded only sometimes.


Do the firmware updates come down via the dish or do you need to do them manually with a usb?

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  Reply # 579694 10-Feb-2012 12:42
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CutCutCut:
Gilco2:
CutCutCut: Yup, I'll be recomending the DishTV box for them, it suits their needs best.
Hi if you get the DishTV s7090pvr like I also have one, you wont be sorry.  However if as mine it comes with firmware v1.30, I would recommend to upgrade to v1.35.  Mine had a few minor faults mainly with playing files usb drive and those were fixed with the firmware upgrade.  The machine is working well and never missed a recording using series link.  My Panasonic BM880 recorder always missed recordings and recorded only sometimes.


Do the firmware updates come down via the dish or do you need to do them manually with a usb?
There is a setting for over the air update but I didnt try it.  I just downloaded the firmware from their site onto a usb stick and followed the instructions on their site and all went well. Easy to do.




HTPC Intel Pentium G3258 cpu, Gigabyte H97n-wifi motherboard, , 8GB DDR3 ram, onboard  graphics. Hauppuage HVR 5500 tuner,  Silverstone LC16M case, Windows 10 pro 64 bit using Nextpvr and Kodi




868 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 579803 10-Feb-2012 14:47
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Gilco2:
CutCutCut:
Gilco2:
CutCutCut: Yup, I'll be recomending the DishTV box for them, it suits their needs best.
Hi if you get the DishTV s7090pvr like I also have one, you wont be sorry.  However if as mine it comes with firmware v1.30, I would recommend to upgrade to v1.35.  Mine had a few minor faults mainly with playing files usb drive and those were fixed with the firmware upgrade.  The machine is working well and never missed a recording using series link.  My Panasonic BM880 recorder always missed recordings and recorded only sometimes.


Do the firmware updates come down via the dish or do you need to do them manually with a usb?
There is a setting for over the air update but I didnt try it.  I just downloaded the firmware from their site onto a usb stick and followed the instructions on their site and all went well. Easy to do.


Ahh ok, thanks for that.

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Wannabe Geek


  Reply # 583842 20-Feb-2012 12:45
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Hi I purchased the S7090pvr unit and am now on my second replacement.

I seem to have picked the only two units in NZ that have the same fault, lucky me!.

There has got to be others out there who are having the same problems..

The Tech at Dish asked me to send details of what happens:
 Exact steps taken:I record a number of programs, some are sequential on the same channel say around 7.30pm to 9.30pm using the epg system.The next night I will be recording at around the same time but will decide to watch a prerecorded program from the night before.I will start to watch the program and fast forward at speed (5) to get to the beginning of the program and sometimes I go past the start and have to wind back a little at speed (5 or 4) and may even miss the beginning again and have to go forward again at speed (1 or 2) to get the exact start of the program.I start to watch and after about 30 seconds or so the picture will slip and the sound makes a skidding noise (picture goes pixelated), only for a split second but it causes you to miss out on what is being said. I then rewind just forward of the slip and play it again and the scene plays without a problem but it will then slip a little later on.This happens every time I use the search forward or back mode to miss out adds etc.If I dare to edit recorded programs to save it without adds the slipping is worse.
The units also locks up at times during playback and the picture sits on screen for around 30 seconds and then play ok again.
I am waiting for Dish TV to send some sort of fix.
The unit does all I want and is simple to use but this niggling fault is doing my head in and I can see me taking this unit back to the shop also.

Good luck finding the perfect unit.

MikeFrown

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