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  Reply # 1611870 15-Aug-2016 12:13
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sen8or:

 

I can sort of understand 2Degrees point of view, the customer is wanting to terminate "early", they have incurred costs so are rightly enforcing that loss, the issue comes as to value of the loss. If they allow customers to terminate 1 month early with no penalty, what about the customers terminating 2 months early, where is the line drawn as to when and how much to charge? They are taking the stance that the line is drawn at the contract date and for the amount stipulated in the terms of the contract, as pointed out by others, this appears oppressive.

 

I think this is where the banks / finance companies actually have it pretty much right in regards to calculating loss for early termination. There they can charge the difference between the contract rate and the current rate for the same term, across the term remaining under contract (so breaking a 3 year fixed rate of say 5% after 2 years, leaves 1 year to go. Current lending on 1 year money is 4%, so the bank can charge the equivalent of 1 year at 1% on the amount being repaid as that is effectively their loss).

 

at 23 months into a 24 month contract, surely the loss would only be 1/24th of the ETC ($ 290/24 x 1 = $ 12.08)?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

She is not terminating 1 month early. She paying her last month, thus 24 of 24 months paid in full. Due to overseas travel and 2 Degrees unable to service her needs abroad she needs a new provider 2 WEEKS early than the exact termination date. There is NO actual financial loss to 2 Degrees.





Mike
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The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

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  Reply # 1611871 15-Aug-2016 12:14
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dejadeadnz:

 

2Degrees isn't even in the right in law. Obviously, until a court conclusively rules their approach to ETC to be unlawful, they are entitled (albeit this will be stupid) to pursue the issue and potentially force MikeB4's wife to take them to the Disputes Tribunal to get a definitive ruling that $290 for an early termination of 2 weeks in an unenforceable penalty. But I would say that any informed and reasonable person can see based on the law referenced here that 2Degrees' position in that regard is weak.

 

But that is not the worst of it. 2Degrees is, based on what we are told here, taking the nonsensical and downright unethical view that even if MikeB4's wife paid up to the end of her contract but chooses to move her phone off their network before the expiry date, the $290 remains payable. Sorry but that is just wrong in law and morals.

 

2Degrees, it's time you quite whilst you are only a couple of marathon laps behind. It might surprise some that quite a lot of people with relevant professional education/standing in matters to do with legal compliance are reading this thread. Some of this has to do with me pointing it out; for others, it's simply the reality that this is a popular site. The damage you are doing to yourself far exceeds the measly $290 that you are wanting to rip out of someone.

 

What a joke -- on principle I won't ever touch your company's products and services again.

 

 

 

 

pretty sure it's stated that the ETC is to cover the cost of the modem which is provided free of charge if you take a term plan. A new modem can easily cost $290 and it's not a cost that goes away just because you've paid for 24 months of service or whatever.

 

 




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  Reply # 1611874 15-Aug-2016 12:16
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sorceror:

 

dejadeadnz:

 

2Degrees isn't even in the right in law. Obviously, until a court conclusively rules their approach to ETC to be unlawful, they are entitled (albeit this will be stupid) to pursue the issue and potentially force MikeB4's wife to take them to the Disputes Tribunal to get a definitive ruling that $290 for an early termination of 2 weeks in an unenforceable penalty. But I would say that any informed and reasonable person can see based on the law referenced here that 2Degrees' position in that regard is weak.

 

But that is not the worst of it. 2Degrees is, based on what we are told here, taking the nonsensical and downright unethical view that even if MikeB4's wife paid up to the end of her contract but chooses to move her phone off their network before the expiry date, the $290 remains payable. Sorry but that is just wrong in law and morals.

 

2Degrees, it's time you quite whilst you are only a couple of marathon laps behind. It might surprise some that quite a lot of people with relevant professional education/standing in matters to do with legal compliance are reading this thread. Some of this has to do with me pointing it out; for others, it's simply the reality that this is a popular site. The damage you are doing to yourself far exceeds the measly $290 that you are wanting to rip out of someone.

 

What a joke -- on principle I won't ever touch your company's products and services again.

 

 

 

 

pretty sure it's stated that the ETC is to cover the cost of the modem which is provided free of charge if you take a term plan. A new modem can easily cost $290 and it's not a cost that goes away just because you've paid for 24 months of service or whatever.

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's a mobile account





Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 Mac user, Windows curser, Chrome OS desired.

 

The great divide is the lies from both sides.

 

 


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  Reply # 1611877 15-Aug-2016 12:29
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sorceror:

 

 

 

pretty sure it's stated that the ETC is to cover the cost of the modem which is provided free of charge if you take a term plan. A new modem can easily cost $290 and it's not a cost that goes away just because you've paid for 24 months of service or whatever.

 

 

 

You need to read some of the earlier posts.

 

 

 

 


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  Reply # 1611887 15-Aug-2016 12:51
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MikeB4:

 

sorceror:

 

dejadeadnz:

 

2Degrees isn't even in the right in law. Obviously, until a court conclusively rules their approach to ETC to be unlawful, they are entitled (albeit this will be stupid) to pursue the issue and potentially force MikeB4's wife to take them to the Disputes Tribunal to get a definitive ruling that $290 for an early termination of 2 weeks in an unenforceable penalty. But I would say that any informed and reasonable person can see based on the law referenced here that 2Degrees' position in that regard is weak.

 

But that is not the worst of it. 2Degrees is, based on what we are told here, taking the nonsensical and downright unethical view that even if MikeB4's wife paid up to the end of her contract but chooses to move her phone off their network before the expiry date, the $290 remains payable. Sorry but that is just wrong in law and morals.

 

2Degrees, it's time you quite whilst you are only a couple of marathon laps behind. It might surprise some that quite a lot of people with relevant professional education/standing in matters to do with legal compliance are reading this thread. Some of this has to do with me pointing it out; for others, it's simply the reality that this is a popular site. The damage you are doing to yourself far exceeds the measly $290 that you are wanting to rip out of someone.

 

What a joke -- on principle I won't ever touch your company's products and services again.

 

 

 

 

pretty sure it's stated that the ETC is to cover the cost of the modem which is provided free of charge if you take a term plan. A new modem can easily cost $290 and it's not a cost that goes away just because you've paid for 24 months of service or whatever.

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's a mobile account

 

 

But, in any case the 24 month term of the contract was satisfied by way of payment of 24 months fees. 

 

Its clear that very few would do what you wife has done, and the SOP that the reps go by is for standard ETF for early termination. But surely its a case of "oh, you've paid it all, Ill talk to manager and sort it (as that scenario isn't in the SOP)

 

Its about two words, C.S.


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  Reply # 1611898 15-Aug-2016 13:17
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MikeB4:

 

She just got off the phone with a "team leader" who advised now that the account has to be active up to and including the last day even if the 24 months of a 24 month contract has been paid. If it was terminated the day before it would incur  the $290 termination fee.

 

This is no way moral, legal, good business practice. If 24 months of a 24 month contract has been paid there is no financial loss to 2 Degrees, this stand by them is illogical and as it stands now is putting in jeopardy a lot of future business.

 

 

Port the number out and request a new number for the remainder of the contract term.

 

 

 

 





Chorus has spent $1.4 billion on making their xDSL broadband network faster. If your still stuck on ADSL or VDSL, why not spend from $150 on a master filter install to make sure you are getting the most out of your connection?
I install - Naked DSL, DSL Master Splitters, VoIP, data cabling and general computer support for home and small business.
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  Reply # 1611911 15-Aug-2016 13:40
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coffeebaron:

 

MikeB4:

 

She just got off the phone with a "team leader" who advised now that the account has to be active up to and including the last day even if the 24 months of a 24 month contract has been paid. If it was terminated the day before it would incur  the $290 termination fee.

 

This is no way moral, legal, good business practice. If 24 months of a 24 month contract has been paid there is no financial loss to 2 Degrees, this stand by them is illogical and as it stands now is putting in jeopardy a lot of future business.

 

 

Port the number out and request a new number for the remainder of the contract term.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

yeah she asked that on the phone call to their CC and was told this could not be done.





Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 Mac user, Windows curser, Chrome OS desired.

 

The great divide is the lies from both sides.

 

 


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  Reply # 1611919 15-Aug-2016 13:51
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MikeB4:

 

coffeebaron:

 

MikeB4:

 

She just got off the phone with a "team leader" who advised now that the account has to be active up to and including the last day even if the 24 months of a 24 month contract has been paid. If it was terminated the day before it would incur  the $290 termination fee.

 

This is no way moral, legal, good business practice. If 24 months of a 24 month contract has been paid there is no financial loss to 2 Degrees, this stand by them is illogical and as it stands now is putting in jeopardy a lot of future business.

 

 

Port the number out and request a new number for the remainder of the contract term.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

yeah she asked that on the phone call to their CC and was told this could not be done.

 

 

Well this would be up to 2degrees to fix themselves. Number porting is not necessarily a request to disconnect. No reason they can't put a new number in to replace once ported. Its the service that is under contract, not the phone number.

 

"If you terminate this Agreement or end your fixed term Services before the end of the fixed term you may have to pay early termination charges". So tell them to apply a new phone number once it's ported, if they can't then they have failed to keep your service going according to their agreement.

 

 





Chorus has spent $1.4 billion on making their xDSL broadband network faster. If your still stuck on ADSL or VDSL, why not spend from $150 on a master filter install to make sure you are getting the most out of your connection?
I install - Naked DSL, DSL Master Splitters, VoIP, data cabling and general computer support for home and small business.
Rural Broadband RBI installer for Ultimate Broadband and Full Flavour

 

Need help in Auckland, Waikato or BoP? Click my email button, or email me direct: [my user name] at geekzonemail dot com


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  Reply # 1611927 15-Aug-2016 14:07
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This is just nothing short of amateur hour on the part of 2Degrees. The way MikeB4's wife has been treated is nothing short of disgusting.

 

 

 

 


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  Reply # 1611945 15-Aug-2016 14:27
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I wonder how much this episode is costing them in terms of lost business, damage to image, and general PR catastrophe. Talk about going out of your ham-fisted way to destroy trust and drive away potential customers. Maybe they should hire Donald Trump to smooth things over.

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


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  Reply # 1611947 15-Aug-2016 14:28
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coffeebaron:

 

Well this would be up to 2degrees to fix themselves. Number porting is not necessarily a request to disconnect. No reason they can't put a new number in to replace once ported. Its the service that is under contract, not the phone number.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Exactly this.  Its like number hostage holding.  She is paying out her contract, porting has nothing to do with them.  Its kind of like the gym holding your gym shoes at the gym until your contract period is up, irrespective of the fact you are still paying your subs..


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  Reply # 1612108 15-Aug-2016 18:19
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MikeB4:

 

She just got off the phone with a "team leader" who advised now that the account has to be active up to and including the last day even if the 24 months of a 24 month contract has been paid. If it was terminated the day before it would incur  the $290 termination fee.

 

This is no way moral, legal, good business practice. If 24 months of a 24 month contract has been paid there is no financial loss to 2 Degrees, this stand by them is illogical and as it stands now is putting in jeopardy a lot of future business.

 

 

She she get a free phone when signing the contract?

 

 




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  Reply # 1612119 15-Aug-2016 18:45
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sbiddle:

 

MikeB4:

 

She just got off the phone with a "team leader" who advised now that the account has to be active up to and including the last day even if the 24 months of a 24 month contract has been paid. If it was terminated the day before it would incur  the $290 termination fee.

 

This is no way moral, legal, good business practice. If 24 months of a 24 month contract has been paid there is no financial loss to 2 Degrees, this stand by them is illogical and as it stands now is putting in jeopardy a lot of future business.

 

 

She she get a free phone when signing the contract?

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think there may have been but because the 24 monthly payments  of the 24 month contract have been made that is not an issue





Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 Mac user, Windows curser, Chrome OS desired.

 

The great divide is the lies from both sides.

 

 


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  Reply # 1612120 15-Aug-2016 18:54
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A contract has a start date and an end date this is not rocket science

Fees are clear if contract is broken before the end date of the contract

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  Reply # 1612121 15-Aug-2016 18:56
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thecatsgoolies: A contract has a start date and an end date this is not rocket science

 

 

 

It's not rocket science but contracts are also subject to common law presumptions and other relevant statutes of Parliament. You don't have a problem with a company demanding an extra $290 after getting every single dollar that they would have been entitled to get under the contract (hint: next time read the whole thread carefully before commenting with sarcastic one-liners)? If that's so, good for you.

 

 

 

 


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