Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.




4723 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 872

Trusted
Subscriber

Topic # 55740 8-Jan-2010 14:16
Send private message

Anyone know when 2degrees is rolling out their 3G network? I heard they are going to be using UMTS 2100. That's a shorter-range, high capacity frequency in keeping with their urban-based infrastructure. It also works with both Telecom XT and Vodafone phones.....in the cities. 


Timing? 




____________________________________________________
I'm on a high fibre diet. 

 

High fibre diet


View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
 1 | 2
25576 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 5357

Moderator
Trusted
Biddle Corp
Subscriber

  Reply # 288135 8-Jan-2010 14:30
Send private message

It's been live in the Wellington CBD since mid December. I've forgotten to take a 2degrees SIM with me the last couple of times I've been in the City to test and see if they accept connections yet.

The frequency of a 3G network makes no difference to it's capacity - a 5MHz WCDMA network at 850, 900 or 2100 network will still have the same capacity.

ajw

1343 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 119


  Reply # 288248 8-Jan-2010 18:14
Send private message

sbiddle: It's been live in the Wellington CBD since mid December. I've forgotten to take a 2degrees SIM with me the last couple of times I've been in the City to test and see if they accept connections yet.

The frequency of a 3G network makes no difference to it's capacity - a 5MHz WCDMA network at 850, 900 or 2100 network will still have the same capacity.


It is going to cost a fortune if 2D decides to use this frequency band to rollout 3G to the rest of the country.
Wouldn't surprise me if they used some of their 900 MHZ spectrum as Vfone has done for UMTS application.

 
 
 
 


25576 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 5357

Moderator
Trusted
Biddle Corp
Subscriber

  Reply # 288252 8-Jan-2010 18:50
Send private message

Nationwide 2100 3G would never happen, it simply doesn't stack up.

900 is a possibility if they own enough spectrum, I'm not sure how many MHz they actually own now. They did swap their 800 spectrum for 900 this time last year.

5049 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2082

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 288263 8-Jan-2010 19:37
Send private message

If they are smart, then rolling out 3G 900 for their out of main centres would be way to go. Leaving 2G + 3G 2100 for main centres only. Sure they may miss the odd bit of revenue, but I think is still a better long term option, even if they still keep up a 2G roam deal with Vodafone




Chorus has spent $1.4 billion on making their xDSL broadband network faster. If your still stuck on ADSL or VDSL, why not spend from $150 on a master filter install to make sure you are getting the most out of your connection?
I install - Naked DSL, DSL Master Splitters, VoIP, data cabling and general computer support for home and small business.
Rural Broadband RBI installer for Ultimate Broadband and Full Flavour

 

Need help in Auckland, Waikato or BoP? Click my email button, or email me direct: [my user name] at geekzonemail dot com


283 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 2


  Reply # 288268 8-Jan-2010 19:50
Send private message

2degrees in CHCH is started showing 3G in the manual operator selection screen before christmas on my Nokia, still even with it set to Dual Mode, it still only connects in 2G mode. 


637 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 2

Trusted

  Reply # 288279 8-Jan-2010 20:25
Send private message

I've been able to use 3G on 2degrees in Auckland since before Christmas, as an inbound roamer.



4723 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 872

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 288296 8-Jan-2010 21:43
Send private message

Ii'm no expert. Wikipedia says UMTS 850 / 900 are used for low-density, broad coverage & 1900 / 2100 are used for unfilled where more capacity is needed. They explicitly say 2100 offers more frequencies, Is that not true?




____________________________________________________
I'm on a high fibre diet. 

 

High fibre diet


2483 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4

Trusted

  Reply # 288301 8-Jan-2010 21:50
Send private message

2100 3G at Auckland Airport, unavailable to local 2degrees customers at the moment.

I'm hoping we'll see some 3G action from them soon - I want to try them out (but not for too long at the current data rates)


They have a 3G roaming agreement also with Vodafone (outside of main centres) that covers 2100 and 900MHz right? That way it shouldn't be too hard to get off the ground with most of the country covered if that happens.




Find me on Twitter!

I posted 1, 2 x 10^3 times!

25576 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 5357

Moderator
Trusted
Biddle Corp
Subscriber

  Reply # 288302 8-Jan-2010 21:56
Send private message

Linuxluver: Ii'm no expert. Wikipedia says UMTS 850 / 900 are used for low-density, broad coverage & 1900 / 2100 are used for unfilled where more capacity is needed. They explicitly say 2100 offers more frequencies, Is that not true?


Where does it say that?

UMTS doesn't use "frequencies" because it's a wideband network - it uses a block of spectrum, typically a 5Mhz pair. Vodafone New Zealand for example have 2 x 15Mhz blocks of 2100MHz spectrum.

The number of calls a UMTS network can carry in that 2 x 5MHz pair of spectrum makes no difference whether it's at 850Mhz or 2100Mhz.

875 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 25

Subscriber

  Reply # 288307 8-Jan-2010 22:17
Send private message

sbiddle: Nationwide 2100 3G would never happen, it simply doesn't stack up.

900 is a possibility if they own enough spectrum, I'm not sure how many MHz they actually own now. They did swap their 800 spectrum for 900 this time last year.



They do have GSM 1800 as well. Could they use 1800 for extra capacity freeing up 900 for WCDMA?
Do they have to apply to the government body to use there own (900) spectrum for WCDMA as well as GSM?








4723 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 872

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 288381 9-Jan-2010 10:53
Send private message

sbiddle: This article contains the statement: "The 850 MHz and 900 MHz bands provide greater coverage compared to equivalent 1700/1900/2100 MHz networks, and are best suited to regional areas where greater distances separate subscriber and base station."

It would explain why Vodafone uses 900 for national coverage and Telecom XT uses 850....and neither use 2100 for covering large areas.


Reading elsewhere indicated the frequencies concerned have differing capabilities with respect to building penetration in built-up areas and this also makes the longer wavelengths better suited to more open, less built-up situations. Perhaps this is where the idea of capability / capacity crept in to some of the stuff I have been reading.  They may have the same number of frequencies in each group, but the groups differ in terms of their observed 'behaviour' or attributes in the physical world. 


Like I said, I'm no expert. These explanations were plausible to me in so far as they aligned perfectly with how these networks have actually been rolled out in NZ: 850 / 900 for wide coverage and 2100 for infill / urban areas.


If you can shed any light on this, I'd be grateful. I always prefer to be corrected than to be left to talk crap. :-)  




____________________________________________________
I'm on a high fibre diet. 

 

High fibre diet


880 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 45

Trusted

  Reply # 289891 14-Jan-2010 09:14
Send private message

Linuxluver: 
Reading elsewhere indicated the frequencies concerned have differing capabilities with respect to building penetration in built-up areas and this also makes the longer wavelengths better suited to more open, less built-up situations. Perhaps this is where the idea of capability / capacity crept in to some of the stuff I have been reading.  They may have the same number of frequencies in each group, but the groups differ in terms of their observed 'behaviour' or attributes in the physical world. 


Like I said, I'm no expert. These explanations were plausible to me in so far as they aligned perfectly with how these networks have actually been rolled out in NZ: 850 / 900 for wide coverage and 2100 for infill / urban areas.



If you can shed any light on this, I'd be grateful. I always prefer to be corrected than to be left to talk crap. :-)  


 

The 850/900 bands were allocated in the analogue/2G days and were intended for voice mobile systems - there are about 2x20MHz in each band.

The 2100MHz band is the original 3G band which is intended for higher levels of traffic (i.e. data as well as voice). There is 2x60MHz available here. This is what they mean by 'more frequencies'

For interest, the "IMT-2000 extension" band (2.5GHz) for 4G will have 190MHz total available to cope with even higher levels of traffic.




 

25576 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 5357

Moderator
Trusted
Biddle Corp
Subscriber

  Reply # 289895 14-Jan-2010 09:30
Send private message

Linuxluver:
Like I said, I'm no expert. These explanations were plausible to me in so far as they aligned perfectly with how these networks have actually been rolled out in NZ: 850 / 900 for wide coverage and 2100 for infill / urban areas.




XT is a 850Mhz nationwide. 2100 is only used for infill and to provide additional capacity, it's not used to actually provide primary coverage to urban areas on XT.

Likewise Vodafone will eventually rollout 900Mhz WCDMA across their entire network since it offers far better inbuilding coverage in urban areas and also increases the capacity of the WCDMA network. 2100 is their primary 3G network in urban areas simply because 900 WCDMA wasn't around when the network was built.




2670 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 522


  Reply # 289905 14-Jan-2010 10:03
Send private message

andrewcnz:
Do they have to apply to the government body to use there own (900) spectrum for WCDMA as well as GSM?


Other then having to ensure they don't interfere with neighbouring frequency users, I am fairly sure they can do what ever they want with the spectrum they have rights to.

25576 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 5357

Moderator
Trusted
Biddle Corp
Subscriber

  Reply # 289907 14-Jan-2010 10:15
Send private message

wellygary:
andrewcnz:
Do they have to apply to the government body to use there own (900) spectrum for WCDMA as well as GSM?


Other then having to ensure they don't interfere with neighbouring frequency users, I am fairly sure they can do what ever they want with the spectrum they have rights to.


Yip.. Things are different in the EU however. Frequency blocks were sold with only certain technologies permitted. The delay in 900 UMTS in many European Countries has been caused by rules diciating that GSM was the only technology allowed to be used in this band.




 1 | 2
View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic



Twitter »

Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:





News »

UFB killer app: Speed
Posted 17-Nov-2017 17:01


The case for RSS — MacSparky
Posted 13-Nov-2017 14:35


WordPress and Indieweb: Take control of your online presence — 6:30 GridAKL Nov 30
Posted 11-Nov-2017 13:43


Chorus reveals technology upgrade for schools, students
Posted 10-Nov-2017 10:28


Vodafone says Internet of Things (IoT) crucial for digital transformation
Posted 10-Nov-2017 10:06


Police and Facebook launch AMBER Alerts system in NZ
Posted 9-Nov-2017 10:49


Amazon debuts Fire TV Stick Basic Edition in over 100 new countries
Posted 8-Nov-2017 05:34


Vodafone VoIP transition to start this month
Posted 7-Nov-2017 12:33


Spark enhances IoT network capability
Posted 7-Nov-2017 11:33


Vocus NZ sale and broadband competition
Posted 6-Nov-2017 14:36


Hawaiki reaches key milestone in landmark deep-sea fibre project
Posted 4-Nov-2017 13:53


Countdown launches new proximity online shopping app
Posted 4-Nov-2017 13:50


Nokia 3310 to be available through Spark New Zealand
Posted 4-Nov-2017 13:31


Nest launches in New Zealand
Posted 4-Nov-2017 12:31


Active wholesale as Chorus tackles wireless challenge
Posted 3-Nov-2017 10:55



Geekzone Live »

Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.



Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.