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  Reply # 778915 13-Mar-2013 08:31
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mjb: How about telling us what the domain is, so we can have a better idea of your position?


+1, tell us the domain names it will make things a little easier.



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  Reply # 779912 13-Mar-2013 09:05
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Klipspringer:
mjb: How about telling us what the domain is, so we can have a better idea of your position?


+1, tell us the domain names it will make things a little easier.


Hi I would like to but given the proceedings from DNC and some of the comments on this thread there appears to be little compassion and a lack of understanding of the situation from my perspective if I gave more details chances are it would not work in my favour.

The process of mediation and resolution with the DNC looks like it is fairly straightforward and very interesting.

If there is anyone out there like the poster who had a situation with Trade Me or indeed any genuine cybersquatters it would be interesting to hear their story.

AB

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  Reply # 779913 13-Mar-2013 09:07
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AnfieldBoy: Hi I would like to but given the proceedings from DNC and some of the comments on this thread there appears to be little compassion and a lack of understanding of the situation from my perspective if I gave more details chances are it would not work in my favour.


Exactly why you should give people a full picture and perhaps change their opinions. The way it is is not about "compassion". It's business as usual.





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  Reply # 780947 13-Mar-2013 10:16
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ptinson: You say it could be sorted over a cup of tea, yet the first post says you "they are a commercial entity so I put a commercial worth on the sites". 
Doesn't sound like a cup of tea :)

Perhaps they took offense at your initial offer and bit back with a lawyer?


Yeah, I too wonder about how much he asked for.  Maybe he saw a big company and thought they would pay lots of $$$'s.

Related story that happened several years ago:

I have a domain name for my business that is very similar to another domain that someone else has, just one letter different, and we're both in the same line of business (I was working full time and the other guy was retired and only doing it as a hobby).  I knew that some potential clients had gone to the other website instead of mine so I offered to buy the other domain name.  I was going to offer a few hundred dollars but the other guy came back and asked for $25,000.  When I baulked at that he said he thought that was a fair price since I was obviously a large company (he based that on the fact that I had a nice professional looking website, in reality I have a two person business that works from home).

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  Reply # 780954 13-Mar-2013 10:23
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It sounds like the key question is did you buy it for a good reason unrelated to the commercial interest, or did you buy it because of the name and you're just making some token use so you can get more money out of them.

That may sound harsh, I don't mean it to. If you're legitimately using it that's one big thing in your favour.




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  Reply # 780958 13-Mar-2013 10:26
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AB - Mostly what I read from this thread is hope and indignation - but not much reality.
Divorce all of that emotion from the equation and look at the cold hard facts.

If you don't have a trademark or even a registered business in the name of your domains, there is a high probability that the domains will be taken from your control.

Let me put a few devils advocates questions to you.

Let's say that you bought coke.kiwi.nz
Or you bought vodafone.kiwi.nz
  (And people have done this They don't appear to be company-related. At best they've wasted $20. More if they get pursued.)
Would you be upset if that put you in your current situation?
Would you consider them bullies if they came asking for their I.P?

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  Reply # 780977 13-Mar-2013 10:44
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If you buy vodafone.kiwi.nz and run a website critic of Vodafone because of some bad deals, I agree it's a valid use.

If you buy vodafone.kiwi.nz and run a website selling telecommunications services I say it's a trademark infringement.

There's no indignation really - people are just saying that since you are not giving all the information a valid opinion can not be formed. There seems to be more to this story we're not being told, as it happens with all half-stories that surface here now and then.

A few posts back you were happy with the replies. Now you think they're not so supportive anymore.

When people start asking for more information things start getting hot.






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  Reply # 780978 13-Mar-2013 10:44
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P.S. Demanding a much higher figure than you were offered does not equate to settling the matter "over a cup of tea"

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  Reply # 780980 13-Mar-2013 10:46
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freitasm:

There's no indignation really - people are just saying that since you are not giving all the information a valid opinion can not be formed. There seems to be more to this story we're not being told, as it happens with all half-stories that surface here now and then.



Calling the company a bully is indignation.



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  Reply # 781013 13-Mar-2013 11:31
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timmmay: It sounds like the key question is did you buy it for a good reason unrelated to the commercial interest, or did you buy it because of the name and you're just making some token use so you can get more money out of them.

That may sound harsh, I don't mean it to. If you're legitimately using it that's one big thing in your favour.


Hi thank you for your comment.

If I discuss the details of the case here would that not potentially prejudice the DNC complaint against me?

My initial post was to ask had anyone been in a similar situation.

I never intended to become a 'cybersquatter' but that is evidently what has happend.

I took umbrage to the response from the organisation I felt the inital offering of $300 for both the .com and .co.nz domain name would cover my costs but not be a adequate reflection of my time nor initiative. When I was asked by the complaninant to give a commercial value, I did so. I believed the commercial value was approximatley $6000. To be honest I have no idea how to measure the worth of a website, I do have experience on the measure of worth of a business and I valued the potential for that business through sales and ad revenue to be approximatley $6800. I offered to sell the domains at $5000 given that the buyer wanted the domains for a commercial venture.

No negotiation was entered into, I then received a lawyers letter demanding that I release the domains as I was contravening the Fair Trading Act and offered $500 to meet my costs. The site has not made a single cent of revenue and exists purely as a informational site to which the complainant wants control over.

I tried on many occasions to enter into constructive dialogue to develop a relationship with the complainant, I realise now that was naive. Whilst the issue of me owing a part of what they considered to be their IP this could in reflection not happen.

My intentions initially where honourable, in retrospect I should have just given them the domains and developed a relationship which could have lead to something. However I took offence to the insinuations and allegations which where rightly or wrongly made of me, since then the situation now involves lawyers and mediation.

All of your comments have been helpful, I took someones IP and now they are using the powers at their disposal to take it back.

It is a fascinating process though and one I shall chalk up to experience.

AB



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  Reply # 781069 13-Mar-2013 12:49
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AnfieldBoy:

All of your comments have been helpful, I took someones IP and now they are using the powers at their disposal to take it back.

It is a fascinating process though and one I shall chalk up to experience.

AB




Good summary AB.  I hope you get a quick and clean resolution.

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  Reply # 781090 13-Mar-2013 13:50
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AnfieldBoy: To be honest I have no idea how to measure the worth of a website, I do have experience on the measure of worth of a business and I valued the potential for that business through sales and ad revenue to be approximatley $6800. 




I think you are getting confused about domain names and websites. From what you have said, they only want the domains. You can keep the website. You just change the website to another domain and it is business as usual so there is no loss there. Some domain companies do charge to change hte domain ownership. Saw one of the budget ones that charges $150 to change the ownership on a .nz domain, so that cost should also be taken into consideration.

The DNC will only cover .NZ domains, and not the .com domain you have.

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  Reply # 781331 13-Mar-2013 22:00
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It still hasnt been revealed if it is a genericish name like "bigshoes.co.nz" or something closer to "yellowpages" or "pepsicola" or similar.

1. If its the first and someone has a trademark in the area you are using the site for, then its clearly in their case and you will lose.

2. If you have something unrelated to their trademarks, and are actively using the domain name on a legitimate site then it is clearly in your case and you should win.

3. If you are just sitting on the site and running spam ad words pages and other crap to boost SEO on the name and keywords based on the business that is taking you to the DNC, then I wish many unpleasant things on you that I cant say due to the FUG ;)

As you call it a website and not a "website for my business" or "my hobby website" then I suspect that its option 1 or 3.




Richard rich.ms



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  Reply # 781684 14-Mar-2013 14:54
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richms: It still hasnt been revealed if it is a genericish name like "bigshoes.co.nz" or something closer to "yellowpages" or "pepsicola" or similar.

1. If its the first and someone has a trademark in the area you are using the site for, then its clearly in their case and you will lose.

2. If you have something unrelated to their trademarks, and are actively using the domain name on a legitimate site then it is clearly in your case and you should win.

3. If you are just sitting on the site and running spam ad words pages and other crap to boost SEO on the name and keywords based on the business that is taking you to the DNC, then I wish many unpleasant things on you that I cant say due to the FUG ;)

As you call it a website and not a "website for my business" or "my hobby website" then I suspect that its option 1 or 3.


Probably more akin to 1.

Certainly not 3 thank you.


gzt

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  Reply # 782605 16-Mar-2013 09:54
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Without the actual site names and knowing who is contesting it, it is hard to form an opinion. The people who may be insulting you don't really have enough information to know they are correct either. If it is a situation where you purchased the domain(s) for a legitimate use with no intent to infringe on a trademark and/or the infringement is legally marginal anyway there are a number of paths you could follow. It is hard to tell what the situation is from the information provided so far. IANAL and all that..

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