Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.




15336 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4046

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

Topic # 79950 24-Mar-2011 15:33
Send private message

Hi There!

We are a reseller who has looked after a client for 2 years. We have done a good job by their own admission. We quoted for replacing their system for about 13K. They asked us to be more competitive and we tighented up the quote. They issued a purchase order for the gear. 3 days later after we had already ordered the gear, opened it and configured it, they asked to put the whole deal on hold pending another quote coming in through one of the external directors. I warned them that not completing the sale would incur a part of the labour charges and a restocking fee of 5% on opened or not returnable hardware/software plus bulk freight costs.

They have decided to move to this other provider and are refusing to pay us any costs.

Do I have a legal position I can take through small claims?

View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
 1 | 2
1917 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 110


  Reply # 451495 24-Mar-2011 15:39

If the 5% was noted on the order or in your terms of service, then yeah go ahead. And don't forget to add in a bill for your time.

There is always Baycorp and people hate having a bad credit rating esp businesses.

19282 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2600
Inactive user


  Reply # 451500 24-Mar-2011 15:47
Send private message

I would say Ball is in your court as you have the purchase order from the company

 
 
 
 


BDFL - Memuneh
59418 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 10626

Administrator
Trusted
Geekzone
Lifetime subscriber



15336 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4046

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 451538 24-Mar-2011 17:39
Send private message

Unfortunately there is nothing in my standard terms and conditions about a restocking fee, but I would consider it pretty much implied. In 15 years I have never seen anything like this, and I can't believe they would behave this way let alone dispute a restocking fee.

1163 posts

Uber Geek


  Reply # 451541 24-Mar-2011 17:48

If you don't note a restocking fee, I would think you wouldn't be able to charge on. However if they signed a contract, they could have to stick to that contract and pay the full price. It would however depend on your contract.

1216 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 142


  Reply # 451551 24-Mar-2011 18:33
Send private message

Interesting dillema.

IANAL, but, I'd be of the mind that the PO is binding, and that they should be forced to go through with the purchase.

My reasoning, is, house sale and purchase agreements are effectively a purchase order, right, and we all know that you can't just "walk away" from one of those (your reason for walking away needs to be part of the agreement).

 I would suggest that taking them to the disputes tribunal over any out-of-pocket expense you have after returning everything you can is the best course of action, I imagine, there'd be a good chance of success.

 




---
James Sleeman
I sell lots of stuff for electronic enthusiasts...


3594 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 79

Trusted
WorldxChange

  Reply # 451555 24-Mar-2011 18:42
Send private message

Really we are only guessing here as we don't know what is contained in the PO, your best bet is to seek legal advice




Yes I am a employee of WxC (My Profile) ... but I do have my own opinions as well Wink

             

https://www.facebook.com/wxccommunications

1586 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 496

Subscriber

  Reply # 451557 24-Mar-2011 18:54
Send private message

Depends on your T&Cs. IANAL but if they make the PO a binding contract then you are within your rights to fulfil the contract and demand payment. If they want to cancel without consideration then you can sue them for damages.

This is why companies (including the one I work for) have draconian T&Cs that threaten death and destruction on failure to pay/complete contractual obligations.

On first glance if you have incured costs that are more significant than those involved in the disputes tribunal, and I had the time, then I'd be having a go.

If I had to go to the disputes tribunal I wouldn't just be going for a restocking fee if you can't return the hardware/software, I'd be going for the full cost. I'd also be seeking my margin on the entire job as part of the damages. If you have a contract that doesn't allow them to cancel (especially given that this is business to business) then they need to complete the contract.

269 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 5


  Reply # 451583 24-Mar-2011 20:26
Send private message

I am going to propose another approach.

Can you just swallow and move on. Sounds like you are in the right but do you want to spend the time chasing this down, and engaging lawyers. The customer bad mouthing you potentially.

I would write them a letter expressing your concern and disappointment when you had their PO and see of you can get something from them.

I wouldn't let this eat you up and just move on and do you day job instead of sorting this out.

My 5c.




Mark Ascroft
Wellington


gzt

9267 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1320


  Reply # 451622 24-Mar-2011 23:03
Send private message

Don't know about the legal position. Relationship questions aside, if you have not sent an invoice yet, there is nothing to stop you invoicing them. After thinking about it, who knows, they may decide to pay.

If not, then later again, after getting a warning notice from you, they may decide to pay. If not, then is the time to decide. It is possible during the process they may consult legal advice, and that advice will be to pay.

IMHO it is a bit difficult to invoice for a restocking fee if that is not in your T&C, but the labour seems justified.

+1 to the approach proposed above (ascroft) as well : ).

1163 posts

Uber Geek


  Reply # 451637 24-Mar-2011 23:30

ascroft: I am going to propose another approach.

Can you just swallow and move on. Sounds like you are in the right but do you want to spend the time chasing this down, and engaging lawyers. The customer bad mouthing you potentially.

I would write them a letter expressing your concern and disappointment when you had their PO and see of you can get something from them.

I wouldn't let this eat you up and just move on and do you day job instead of sorting this out.

My 5c.


The relativly small amount being claimed would be for the disputes tribunal, which is an easy process, and doesn't involve lawyers. If nothing else, it is a learning experience and worth doing. I think it is reasonable that the OP isn't left out of pocket.

8020 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 386

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 451653 25-Mar-2011 02:10
Send private message

It might worth trying to contact someone in the company a level or more above whoever you were dealing with for the order.  People get super defensive when they make mistakes trying to cover their ***, you can often get better results going above or around them.

Otherwise for 13k+ it's probably worth booking half and hour with a decent lawyer who's a specialist in the area so you have a better idea of whether your quote and their PO stand up as a contract.

Assuming it's a binding contract a formal legal letter along with the invoice will get their attention, otherwise you will have go with the legal options to recover your costs.

When it comes to getting paid I'm not a fan of the act like a doormat and get walked all over softly approach to non payment.





291 posts

Ultimate Geek

Trusted

  Reply # 451770 25-Mar-2011 12:59
Send private message

Be firm.
Did you provide them a written quote that they then accepted by sending you a written PO?
(emails count as "written".)
Does your quote include explicitly, or by a link, your standard Terms and Conditions?

Follow to the letter your written and standard terms and conditions.
Invoice them ASAP.
Highlight to them, in writing, politely (not threateningly) any payment and/or penalty terms in your quote / terms and conditions.

Offer them an out, but not at your expense.
Something like: "Since you have now told us that you would rather not receive the goods and services you have ordered from us, we will now endeavour to return or resell the hardware components. We do however require payment in full from you first, but we will credit you the value of any monies we are subsequently able to retrieve on disposal of the hardware, less handling costs. Charges for services already performed are payable in full.
This offer is only valid if you do pay our invoices to you in full by the due dates."


Something like that.

Good luck :)




kind regards Andrew TD



15336 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4046

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 451771 25-Mar-2011 13:03
Send private message

I think the issue will come down to the fact I don't have specific terms and conditions listed, we just assume the default ones will cover us.

The issue I see, is that no restocking fee's are specifically mentioned, and that if I claim the entire payment it's too big to go through small claims and I don't want to go to court over it.

I probably need to look at doing something a little more enforceable with my T&C's but in 15 years I've never been in a situation like this before. It's incredibly disappointing.

188 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 9

Subscriber

  Reply # 451796 25-Mar-2011 14:33
Send private message

Disputes Tribunal limit is $15k now or $20k if both parties agree.

 1 | 2
View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic



Twitter »

Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:





News »

New Zealand hits peak broadband data
Posted 18-Jan-2018 12:21


Amazon Echo devices coming to New Zealand early February 2018
Posted 18-Jan-2018 10:53


$3.74 million for new electric vehicles in New Zealand
Posted 17-Jan-2018 11:27


Nova 2i: Value, not excitement from Huawei
Posted 17-Jan-2018 09:02


Less news in Facebook News Feed revamp
Posted 15-Jan-2018 13:15


Australian Government contract awarded to Datacom Connect
Posted 11-Jan-2018 08:37


Why New Zealand needs a chief technology officer
Posted 6-Jan-2018 13:59


Amazon release Silk Browser and Firefox for Fire TV
Posted 21-Dec-2017 13:42


New Chief Technology Officer role created
Posted 19-Dec-2017 22:18


All I want for Christmas is a new EV
Posted 19-Dec-2017 19:54


How clever is this: AI will create 2.3 million jobs by 2020
Posted 19-Dec-2017 19:52


NOW to deploy SD-WAN to regional councils
Posted 19-Dec-2017 19:46


Mobile market competition issues ComCom should watch
Posted 18-Dec-2017 10:52


New Zealand government to create digital advisory group
Posted 16-Dec-2017 08:47


Australia datum changes means whole country moving 1.8 metres north-east
Posted 16-Dec-2017 08:39



Geekzone Live »

Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.



Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.