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ajw

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  Reply # 314557 4-Apr-2010 08:22
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Geektastic: This is interesting.

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/telecoms/article7078798.ece




This is a better article on the same subject.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/02/technology/02rates.html 



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  Reply # 314559 4-Apr-2010 08:30
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I wonder what those fees are here and whether anyone will regulate them?





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  Reply # 314560 4-Apr-2010 08:42
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Geektastic: I wonder what those fees are here and whether anyone will regulate them?


You obviously haven't been following the MTAS regulation saga that's been very public and had a lot of media attention over the past 12 months.


ajw

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  Reply # 314562 4-Apr-2010 08:45
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Geektastic: I wonder what those fees are here and whether anyone will regulate them?



Currently 15 cents per minute to terminate a mobile to mobile voice call. In regards regulation the Minister Stephen Joyce is currently looking at whether vdone and telecoms undertakings be accepted or to regulate or to return to the Commerce Commission for more investigation.



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  Reply # 314563 4-Apr-2010 08:46
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Not really - on the face of it it does not seem to be about exactly the same aspect though:

"The Commission's investigation did not look at the prices that consumers directly pay for mobile services."  

I just never get the impression that regulation here is really aimed at telling the companies what they can charge us! 





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  Reply # 314565 4-Apr-2010 08:49
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Some telcos say these "fees" don't influence their prices. In effect what they are saying is "it doesn't matter how much our costs are, we charge whatever we feel customers will pay without churning too much".




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  Reply # 314566 4-Apr-2010 08:50
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Geektastic: Not really - on the face of it it does not seem to be about exactly the same aspect though:

"The Commission's investigation did not look at the prices that consumers directly pay for mobile services."  

I just never get the impression that regulation here is really aimed at telling the companies what they can charge us! 


It's not. And it would be very, very scary if the Commerce Commission was going around regulating retail prices of products. This would in effect be making price fixing legal and would be anti competitive.

ajw

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  Reply # 314568 4-Apr-2010 08:52
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freitasm: Some telcos say these "fees" don't influence their prices. In effect what they are saying is "it doesn't matter how much our costs are, we charge whatever we feel customers will pay without churning too much".



Especially roaming charges check out the link.

http://tvnz.co.nz/business-news/ringing-up-global-roaming-charges-3446479/video




aw



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  Reply # 314575 4-Apr-2010 09:06
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sbiddle:
Geektastic: Not really - on the face of it it does not seem to be about exactly the same aspect though:

"The Commission's investigation did not look at the prices that consumers directly pay for mobile services."  

I just never get the impression that regulation here is really aimed at telling the companies what they can charge us! 


It's not. And it would be very, very scary if the Commerce Commission was going around regulating retail prices of products. This would in effect be making price fixing legal and would be anti competitive.


And yet the European Union does that all the time.

As do Ofwat, Ofgen, Ofgas, Oftel etc in the UK.

It isn't anti competitive unless you are giving the advantage to only one person.

If you are protecting the consumer and making ALL the companies charge a reasonable rate that has been justified in written submissions, I would not consider that anti-competitive. 







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  Reply # 314576 4-Apr-2010 09:10
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ajw:
freitasm: Some telcos say these "fees" don't influence their prices. In effect what they are saying is "it doesn't matter how much our costs are, we charge whatever we feel customers will pay without churning too much".



Especially roaming charges check out the link.

http://tvnz.co.nz/business-news/ringing-up-global-roaming-charges-3446479/video


OMG!!

That's outrageous. The excuses offered by the telcos were weak and feeble to say the least. 





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  Reply # 314582 4-Apr-2010 09:23
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There are plenty of warning to people roaming. It's probably that people don't believe the prices are that high. It's not a new story - roaming rates have been high for years, have not come down at all or not quick enough.

It's unbelivable in the case of mobile roaming that a company can offer 100MB for $10 for their local users, but the data automagically changes prices if servicing a visiting tourist or business person.




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  Reply # 314583 4-Apr-2010 09:23
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Geektastic:
ajw:
freitasm: Some telcos say these "fees" don't influence their prices. In effect what they are saying is "it doesn't matter how much our costs are, we charge whatever we feel customers will pay without churning too much".



Especially roaming charges check out the link.

http://tvnz.co.nz/business-news/ringing-up-global-roaming-charges-3446479/video


OMG!!

That's outrageous. The excuses offered by the telcos were weak and feeble to say the least. 


Why? What is wrong with the current system? Surely it comes down to personal responbility of an end user to be aware of the costs of a product or service before they use it? All networks send you a SMS advising of pricing when your phone roams to a foreign networks and yet not a week goes by when somebody ignores this, uses their phone and then complains about the pricing.

Are you suggesting that the NZ government force companies in other countries to regulate their prices? You've got to be joking.

Global roaming prices are not high because Vodafone, Telecom or 2degrees are ripping us off. They are high because foreign networks set wholesale prices. The prices we pay for voice calling while roaming are not excessive by global standards, particularly if you're on VF's regular roaming plan which works out significantly cheaper than Telecom or Vodafone Traveller if you make national calls while roaming.

Our data pricing could be a little sharper as it's now possible to buy data roaming bundles on many networks incl Vodafone UK which work out at around NZ$2 per MB when you're roaming on other VF networks but the problem is the wholesale cost of data on many other networks is excessive (ie NZ$5 + wholesale).

ajw

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  Reply # 314587 4-Apr-2010 09:33
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sbiddle:
Geektastic:
ajw:
freitasm: Some telcos say these "fees" don't influence their prices. In effect what they are saying is "it doesn't matter how much our costs are, we charge whatever we feel customers will pay without churning too much".



Especially roaming charges check out the link.

http://tvnz.co.nz/business-news/ringing-up-global-roaming-charges-3446479/video


OMG!!

That's outrageous. The excuses offered by the telcos were weak and feeble to say the least. 


Why? What is wrong with the current system? Surely it comes down to personal responbility of an end user to be aware of the costs of a product or service before they use it? All networks send you a SMS advising of pricing when your phone roams to a foreign networks and yet not a week goes by when somebody ignores this, uses their phone and then complains about the pricing.

Are you suggesting that the NZ government force companies in other countries to regulate their prices? You've got to be joking.

Global roaming prices are not high because Vodafone, Telecom or 2degrees are ripping us off. They are high because foreign networks set wholesale prices. The prices we pay for voice calling while roaming are not excessive by global standards, particularly if you're on VF's regular roaming plan which works out significantly cheaper than Telecom or Vodafone Traveller if you make national calls while roaming.

Our data pricing could be a little sharper as it's now possible to buy data roaming bundles on many networks incl Vodafone UK which work out at around NZ$2 per MB when you're roaming on other VF networks but the problem is the wholesale cost of data on many other networks is excessive (ie NZ$5 + wholesale).


I note roaming prices are regulated throughout Europe check out the link.

http://ec.europa.eu/information_society/newsroom/cf/itemlongdetail.cfm?item_id=5097




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  Reply # 314589 4-Apr-2010 09:36
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Geektastic:
sbiddle:
Geektastic: Not really - on the face of it it does not seem to be about exactly the same aspect though:

"The Commission's investigation did not look at the prices that consumers directly pay for mobile services."  

I just never get the impression that regulation here is really aimed at telling the companies what they can charge us! 


It's not. And it would be very, very scary if the Commerce Commission was going around regulating retail prices of products. This would in effect be making price fixing legal and would be anti competitive.


And yet the European Union does that all the time.

As do Ofwat, Ofgen, Ofgas, Oftel etc in the UK.

It isn't anti competitive unless you are giving the advantage to only one person.

If you are protecting the consumer and making ALL the companies charge a reasonable rate that has been justified in written submissions, I would not consider that anti-competitive. 


The EU did not set retail rates. It set maximum wholesale rates, and maximum retail rates.

We only have one clear example of the Commerce Cmmission setting retail pricing on a telecommunications product in New Zealand, and that's the TSO which legally lets Telecom increase line rental prices yearly in line with the CPI. I'd hate that to be extended to other areas of the market!


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  Reply # 314669 4-Apr-2010 13:38

Global roaming prices are not high because Vodafone, Telecom or 2degrees are ripping us off. They are high because foreign networks set wholesale prices.


The one (wholesale rort) does not exclude the other (retail rort).

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