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762 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  # 2241586 20-May-2019 15:33
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Android just tweeted

"For Huawei users' questions regarding our steps to comply w/ the recent US government actions: We assure you while we are complying with all US gov't requirements, services like Google Play & security from Google Play Protect will keep functioning on your existing Huawei device."

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Ultimate Geek
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  # 2241587 20-May-2019 15:35
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geekiegeek:

So Google, who spy on users every move and don't even try to hide the fact, is being forced by a government to stop support for a phone manufacturers products as they "might" be used for spying. I find this quite ironic personally.



“it’s not spying if you know about it” - Alphabet inc

“Did you read the EULA?” - also Alphabet inc

Lol

 
 
 
 


'That VDSL Cat'
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  # 2241622 20-May-2019 16:07
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As a huawei device user the lack of security updates and possibility of say, the device suddenly being put into always fail safety net concerns me.


I've been doing system launches today, so Im not in the office at normal person times to have a discussion in any official stances.






#include <std_disclaimer>

 

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.


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  # 2241695 20-May-2019 16:46
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Election season madness starts very early.  Huawei, trade wars, Venezuela, Iran.   This time in 2021 a lot of these issues will have been quietly forgotten about.


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  # 2241720 20-May-2019 17:22
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billgates:

 

Technofreak:

 

To be fair to Microsoft though, they weren't starting from scratch. They effectively took over a market leading position and drove it into oblivion. Now that takes a special kind of skill! 😤

 

If PWA (Prgoressive web apps) become a thing of the future and I see some apps going this way then their a very good chance that Microsoft can make a comeback in mobile. They have a good mobile OS and ecosystem around it but they just never could the developers on board to make apps and also the change in direction so often. PWA would mean make app once and it runs on all mobile OS's.

 

I wish that would happen but given the 'must have an application' mindset that so many consumers have I am not hopeful that years of programming of people's minds can be undone so easily. That being said, the biggest mistake Microsoft made was over 30 years ago when they took a pristine OS and threw ideas against the wall only to find that an incoherent code orgy resulted in an maintainable mess that they've been trying to untangle for the last 15 years.





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  # 2241754 20-May-2019 18:08
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benokobi: Android just tweeted

"For Huawei users' questions regarding our steps to comply w/ the recent US government actions: We assure you while we are complying with all US gov't requirements, services like Google Play & security from Google Play Protect will keep functioning on your existing Huawei device."

 

I hope this is the case and things will be seamless.  I moved off Windows only 2/3 months ago to Huawei.  All that time putting it off!  Been really liking the Mate20 Pro.  My partner's phone needs replacing (Huawei).  Looks like it might be time for a Samsung...


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  # 2241759 20-May-2019 18:15
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LisaM77:

 

I hope this is the case and things will be seamless.  I moved off Windows only 2/3 months ago to Huawei.  All that time putting it off!  Been really liking the Mate20 Pro.  My partner's phone needs replacing (Huawei).  Looks like it might be time for a Samsung...

 

 

Well, this is the problem. Who's to say South Korea will always be the USA's friend.

 

It is a completely different situation however suddenly US policy means my mobile phone in New Zealand may end being without security updates. An insane situation where US companies are at the mercy of the whim of policy that affects global users. I wouldn't bet on any Android handset (apart from the Pixel) being safe from this carry on.

 

 

 

 





My views (except when I am looking out their windows) are not those of my employer.

 
 
 
 


BDFL - Memuneh
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  # 2241768 20-May-2019 18:27
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hairy1:

 

Well, this is the problem. Who's to say South Korea will always be the USA's friend.

 

It is a completely different situation however suddenly US policy means my mobile phone in New Zealand may end being without security updates. An insane situation where US companies are at the mercy of the whim of policy that affects global users. I wouldn't bet on any Android handset (apart from the Pixel) being safe from this carry on.

 

 

This is the world we live today - and the world we have been living for decades. I worked for Unisys from 1989 and every year I had to sign the Export Compliance document - even though I was in the consulting services team, not the hardware/software sales team. American companies take this very seriously because the penalties are really high for them. It is just that 30 years ago we didn't have smartphones but even back them computer exports were highly restricted.

 

I remember stories of trains being hijacked in Europe and computers/printer disappearing, only for someone to approach our French offices asking for replacement parts and the serial numbers matching the machines - which apparently had disappeared behind the Iron Curtain. Just search for Elbrus computers and their originally heavily influenced Burroughs design...





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Ultimate Geek
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  # 2241781 20-May-2019 18:56
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afe66:

 



Yes I can believe it does have security aspects.

 


The NSA and various us organisation probably have experience in hacking/manipulating routers and various infrastructure.

They probably fear China doing what they (USA) have been doing for years to other countries infrasture.

 

 

This is my personal view - the US knows itself what is and isn't vulnerable due to their own efforts and fears/know that the Chinese have similar abilities.

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  # 2241787 20-May-2019 19:18
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I've got about 6 vendors now who make me sign anti corruption and Iran/NK dealing forms every year. Hell strong encryption used to be an ITAR(?) item that couldn't leave the USA





Most problems are the result of previous solutions...

All comment's I make are my own personal opinion and do not in any way, shape or form reflect the views of current or former employers unless specifically stated 

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Ultimate Geek
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  # 2241822 20-May-2019 20:08
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Beccara:

 

Hell strong encryption used to be an ITAR(?) item that couldn't leave the USA

 

 

 

 

and GPS had 50 meters of error horizontally and 100 meters vertically to GPS signals, so you could not target USA military target using GPS.


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Ultimate Geek
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  # 2241864 20-May-2019 21:18
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Don't quite understand why people think there will be no security updates. I haven't see any source who sound like they understand what they are talking about who suggest this and as I mentioned in the P30 thread I don't see why this would occur. Huawei can still access the open source code including the security updates once they are released there. https://source.android.com/security/bulletin 

 

I don't see what's to stop Huawei simply updating their software using this code and this seems to be what most competent sources are suggesting. It does mean updates will likely be delayed since Huawei will theoretically need to wait until the public release to get access to the code (or find out about the vunerability) and then test it etc unlike now where as with other major partners, they get it before it's made public. i say theoretically because if Huawei really have as much industrial espionage behind them as the US suggests, I'm not sure Google refusing to provide it to Huawei means they won't get it but that's a little complicated.

 

The only risk is if there is any closed source code but Huawei has I think intentionally stayed away from relying on anything from US manufacturers that is essential or closed source. The other issue is security vulnerabilities unique to Huawei. I assume that even something like Project Zero could only publicly report the bug. They couldn't privately report it to Huawei and wait up to 90 days unless they convince the US government to give them a waiver. Still that just means it's even more on Huawei to ensure their code and components are up to scratch. 

 

The Play Store and other Google Services are a little more complicated. I feared for a few days now that it could be lost completely but it doesn't sound like it will be for existing devices. The one uncertainty in all this is future versions of Android. Starting to wonder if providing these on even existing Huawei devices for future versions of Android means Google has to provide a level of cooperation they don't feel they are allowed to. So Huawei could update via the open source code (again with the delays coming from not being a priority partner with cooperation and early access), but even if they do, still no Play or other Google services. 

 

Also, back to my earlier point, I guess there's also the question of what happens if Google finds a problem with Google Play or other services that only affects Huawei devices. It seems to me they may feel they can't fix it, especially if it's not a security vulnerability. 

 

 

 

I am surprised by Huawei's response to this. I appreciate these are only rumours unconfirmed by Google. However the security patch situation seemed fairly predictable, I mean I know very little about Android development but I was predicting when I read a CNN story on the effect of Huawei's listing about 2 days ago. The Play Store/Google services situation was a little harder to predict, still I assume easier for Huawei who have a legal team and other experts familiar with the details who can better guess what's going to happen.

 

I would have expected within a small number of hours of the first reports, some response like "Although we cannot comment on the accuracy of any media reports, we can confirm we will continue to provide security fixes for Huawei devices" or similar. Maybe even some comment on the Play Store. But AFAIK still nothing. 

 

 

 

On the trade war issue, I'm far from convinced China is going to risk their manufacturing business by directly harming those manufacturing in the US e.g. with export tariffs of bans. Sure it will be very bad short term but the risk for China is that companies will start to see China as too big a risk/cost and move elsewhere. I doubt manufacturing will return to the US much whatever Trump seems to think, and even if it does it will be mostly robots with limited human jobs. But head to India, Vietnam etc at a far greater speed than it is already doing? Sure. 

 

IMO it makes much more sense for them harm companies in a way which should be less risky to their economy. Limits on Apple and others selling in China? Sure. Making it harder for US companies to get rare earth elements? Maybe, I mean it may harm their manufacturing but it will affect all manufacturers in equal measure. And I'm not sure attempts by others to get rare earth elements without China will be harmful to China in the way directly discouraging manufacturing in China will. I'm sure those in charge in China have many other ideas. (I actually wonder if China may be more likely to start selling defence systems to Iran and other such countries than they will be to risk their manufacturing industry.) 

 

A final question is will the EU get involved in any way? They've already expressed concerns over Google's dominance. This case is complicated by the fact it's government action, but I wonder if there's a possibility the EU may still feel the situation is untenable and try to find ways to resolve it, without forcing Google to work with Huawei of course. With Iran it was difficult for them to do anything but this situation seems different and I imagine they also care much more about China than Iran. 


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Ultimate Geek
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  # 2241865 20-May-2019 21:19
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Ultimate Geek
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  # 2241872 20-May-2019 21:28
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maxeon: Huawei latest update here.

https://www.facebook.com/256532727727402/posts/2200783439968978/

 

Ah that's what I expected. But by like midday not over 12 hours after the first reports. (Yes I know it was early in the morning in China, but that's why you have a prepared response which only needs a few minor edits and the people ready to make the decision to release it quickly any time of the day. 


BDFL - Memuneh
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  # 2241873 20-May-2019 21:38
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This is the same statement I have just received via email:


Huawei has made substantial contributions to the development and growth of Android around the world. As one of Android’s key global partners, we have worked closely with their open-source platform to develop an ecosystem that has benefitted both users and the industry.

Huawei will continue to provide security updates and after sales services to all existing Huawei and Honor smartphone and tablet products covering those have been sold or still in stock globally.

We will continue to build a safe and sustainable software ecosystem, in order to provide the best experience for all users globally.




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