Police Secure Radio Network.......

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tritex

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Topic # 39676 17-Aug-2009 20:21
Does anyone know what form of encryption the NZ Police use on the new radio network in Wellington, Wairarapa? (If any at all)

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Reply # 247898 17-Aug-2009 20:36
APCO 25

johnr

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Reply # 247899 17-Aug-2009 20:40
Someone called into police coms and asked why their scanner had stopped working Bet sales from tricky dicky have slowed down John Systems Engineer Vodafone NZ http://forum.vodafone.co.nz

sbiddle

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Reply # 247902 17-Aug-2009 20:42
kiwitrc: APCO 25 It's an APCO P25 network - this is the digital radio network technology. P25 networks don't have any encryption by default, they are merely digital. The NZ Police however (as is the case with most P25 deployments) have chosen to add a layer of encryption on top of this. I believe the NZ Police opted for 256 bit AES for their deployment. P25 itself supports 56 bit DES or 256 bit AES. If you're even thinking about a way to listen in you can forget it.. *Need help configuring your Linksys ATA or IP Phones for New Zealand? Check my blog post

johnr

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Reply # 247907 17-Aug-2009 20:51
sbiddle: kiwitrc: APCO 25 It's an APCO P25 network - this is the digital radio network technology. P25 networks don't have any encryption by default, they are merely digital. The NZ Police however (as is the case with most P25 deployments) have chosen to add a layer of encryption on top of this. I believe the NZ Police opted for 256 bit AES for their deployment. P25 itself supports 56 bit DES or 256 bit AES. If you're even thinking about a way to listen in you can forget it.. bet my $125 scanner from dick smith with a $3 mod chip will tune in and play copied play station games as well Systems Engineer Vodafone NZ http://forum.vodafone.co.nz

kingjj

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Reply # 247909 17-Aug-2009 20:52
sbiddle: kiwitrc: APCO 25 It's an APCO P25 network - this is the digital radio network technology. P25 networks don't have any encryption by default, they are merely digital. The NZ Police however (as is the case with most P25 deployments) have chosen to add a layer of encryption on top of this. I believe the NZ Police opted for 256 bit AES for their deployment. P25 itself supports 56 bit DES or 256 bit AES. If you're even thinking about a way to listen in you can forget it.. I know several people that have acquirped scanners this year, one of them even claimed that his would be able to tune into the new secure network (it can't), I do love an opportunity to say "I told you so" I'm glad the Police took this step, a lot of personal/sensitive information is broadcast accross the Police radio (it's quite common in ChCh for Private Security to listen in, not for much longer though).

tritex

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Reply # 247912 17-Aug-2009 20:54
Never say never :) Thanks for answering the question though.

johnr

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Reply # 247913 17-Aug-2009 20:58
tritex: Never say never :) Thanks for answering the question though. Trust me save your time and quit while your ahead Systems Engineer Vodafone NZ http://forum.vodafone.co.nz

coffeebaron

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Reply # 247916 17-Aug-2009 21:01
kingjj:I know several people that have acquirped scanners this year, one of them even claimed that his would be able to tune into the new secure network (it can't), I do love an opportunity to say "I told you so" I'm glad the Police took this step, a lot of personal/sensitive information is broadcast accross the Police radio (it's quite common in ChCh for Private Security to listen in, not for much longer though). Oh, I'm sure it probably can, the problem will just be the interpretation :) Chorus has spent $1.4 billion on making their ADSL broadband network faster. Why not spend a couple of hundred to make sure you are getting the most out of your connection? Geekzone special price: $150* for master splitter install, normally $200+ through your ISP. Auckland and Waikato areas. *Travel charges may apply. Additional costs may apply for complex installs. I install - Naked DSL, DSL Master Splitters, VoIP, RBI Rural Broadband. Also a dealer for WorldxChange. Need help in Auckland or Waikato? Click my email button, or email me direct: [my user name] at geekzonemail dot com

sbiddle

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Reply # 247919 17-Aug-2009 21:04
There are plenty of scanners that do APCO P25. They just can't handle encryption! *Need help configuring your Linksys ATA or IP Phones for New Zealand? Check my blog post

kingjj

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Reply # 247926 17-Aug-2009 21:16
coffeebaron: kingjj:I know several people that have acquirped scanners this year, one of them even claimed that his would be able to tune into the new secure network (it can't), I do love an opportunity to say "I told you so" I'm glad the Police took this step, a lot of personal/sensitive information is broadcast accross the Police radio (it's quite common in ChCh for Private Security to listen in, not for much longer though). Oh, I'm sure it probably can, the problem will just be the interpretation :) I know the model he got, its not capable. But unfortunately it proboably won't be long until it works As a side note, havn't St John's and the Fire Service had encrypted communications for quite some time now?

tritex

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Reply # 247937 17-Aug-2009 21:31
Ambo & Fire, no i'm not aware of any part of NZ where they are even Digital let alone encrypted......

sbiddle

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Reply # 247942 17-Aug-2009 21:38
kingjj: I know the model he got, its not capable. But unfortunately it proboably won't be long until it works It will never work. End of story. Move along.. *Need help configuring your Linksys ATA or IP Phones for New Zealand? Check my blog post

xpd

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Reply # 248017 18-Aug-2009 09:16
I think down South the ambo's switched to digital quite some time ago but not sure about if it was encrypted or not. Just thankful I sold my $120 Uniden scanner for $200 a couple years back when everyone wanted radio scanners ;) Only sold it cause of the location I moved to didnt get any radio coverage :) XPD / @DemiseNZ / Gavin Website CPU : Intel E5300 GFX: Geforce 9800GTX/+ RAM: 3GB DDR2 A+ - MCDST - MCTS CCNA Arriving soon.

Filterer

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Reply # 248125 18-Aug-2009 13:06
AES256 will be brute forceable in at some point in the future. Just like md5 is now just barely bruteforceable. If you get captures now, you should be able to decrypt them in 50-100 years - the info might be a little out of date by then though pɐǝɥ sıɥ uo ƃuıpuɐʇs

theyetti

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Reply # 248778 19-Aug-2009 20:22
kingjj: coffeebaron: kingjj:I know several people that have acquirped scanners this year, one of them even claimed that his would be able to tune into the new secure network (it can't), I do love an opportunity to say "I told you so" I'm glad the Police took this step, a lot of personal/sensitive information is broadcast accross the Police radio (it's quite common in ChCh for Private Security to listen in, not for much longer though). Oh, I'm sure it probably can, the problem will just be the interpretation :) I know the model he got, its not capable. But unfortunately it proboably won't be long until it works As a side note, havn't St John's and the Fire Service had encrypted communications for quite some time now? The NZ fire service have no digital networks curently. They have only agreed to go to p-25 digital radio in time. Probbly when they next overhaul there radio system. At the moment they use vhf frequncies for dispatching (uhf in Auckland) and seperate simplex vhf channels for there "incident ground channels" which they use on scene to communicate with each other. As for ambulance, due to the increase in threats and assualts against paramedics , the 4 main ambulance services that cover nz have shown increased support for a new radio network in the future. and have also agreed to move to P-25 but again no word yet on when they want to change over.

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