Frame rates - what are people getting with DVB-T

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Seasport

50 posts

Geek

#21016 13-Apr-2008 12:12

I'm interested to hear what framerates people are getting with DVB-T

I'm using DVBViewer. This is reporting 50 fps with TV3 (1080i) but only 37.5 fps with 720p channels, e.g. Freeview HD demo channel.

I can't figure out why it is only reporting 37.5 fps with the 50Hz 720p. This would be the case if it is dropping 1 frame out of every 4. However, DVBviewer is reporting no dropped frames (but jitter of 9ms per frame). Picture is good but a little jerky with transitions. CPU is at about 20%.

P4 3GHz, Win XP MCE
8500GT GPU with H.264 h/w acceleration running
Cyberlink H.264/AVC Decoder (Azurewave) (from Twinhan Digital TV package)
Using VMR 9 renderer

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50 posts

Geek

#123950 16-Apr-2008 10:47

Bit more of an insight into this.

I've been playing around with Graphedit and looking at the Directshow filter chain. Now using the PowerDVD 8 codecs. Still getting about 37fps with 720p but transitions seem pretty smooth now.

What I have found is that the reference clock for the filter chain is derived from the audio renderer (& thus from the sound chip). This is the way that Microsoft implemented Directshow. If I disable the clock in Graphedit, the framerate jumps up to just under 50fps and the transitions are really smooth. Jitter goes to zero. So the sync. with the reference clock is limiting the frame rate. The only problem is that the sound loses sync with the picture when I do this (which is understandable I guess).

This is a well recognised issue. There is a utility program called reclock which allows you to rejig the reference clock away from the audio renderer. I'll look into this.

Anyone else had experience with this?

No1Daemon

172 posts

Master Geek

#124168 16-Apr-2008 20:26

Can you explain a little more about your use of graphedit?

Have you used dplat to latency?

I am getting about 51 FPS in dvbviewer with no latency however it is jerky in panning as you and I discussed in another thread.
In mediaportal I get 21-31 and a lot of artifacts.

BarneyC

62 posts

Master Geek

#124594 18-Apr-2008 07:51

@seasport I can now confirm the same framerates - 37-38fps on TV2 and 50 on several others.

Wierd

What framerates should we get from TV2?

Seasport

50 posts

Geek

#124683 18-Apr-2008 10:58

This thing is driving me nuts.

Everything is working fine except I can't get smooth image transitions. The picture is jerky. This is particularly noticeable on the Freeview HD demo channel when the picture pans. I could maybe get used to this but I spent a bit of time in Dick Smith looking at their Freeview STB o/p and it definitely didn't have this issue (although there was the occasional jerk).

I now have the latest Cyberlink ultra codecs & the latest nvidia GPU drivers. H.264 decoding is done in the GPU. CPU is less than 20%. I'm using VRM9 the renderer.

DVBViewer is reporting a framerate of about 37fps on 720p channels and close to 50 on 1080i (TV3). It is not reporting any dropped frames but is reporting 9ms jitter on 720p channels and 3ms jitter on 1080i channels. TV3 definitely looks better than the demo channel.

There has been quite a lot of discussion around this problem on various boards, see:

http://www.dvbviewer.info/forum/index.php?showtopic=22815

The only other thing I can think of trying is to upgrade to Vista and EVR - but don't want to do this unless I'm confident it will improve things. Already thrown way too much $ at this!

Can anyone with Vista and EVR who is using GPU acceleration (DXVA2) confirm that they are getting good results?

mentalinc

3238 posts

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#124686 18-Apr-2008 11:15

What are you using to get the FPS?

CPU: AMD 5900x | RAM: GSKILL Trident Z Neo RGB F4-3600C16D-32GTZNC-32-GB | MB: Asus X570-E | GFX: EVGA FTW3 Ultra RTX 3080Ti| Monitor: LG 27GL850-B 2560x1440

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Seasport

50 posts

Geek

#124689 18-Apr-2008 11:22

mentalinc: What are you using to get the FPS?

I'm using the View -> VRM9 filter panel in DVBViewer.

mentalinc

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#124695 18-Apr-2008 11:40

TV2: 49.91 FPS after 10,000 frames CPU <10% no jitter etc everythigng else stayed at 0
TV3: 49.95 FPS after 10,000 frames CPU <10% no jitter etc everythigng else stayed at 0
freeview | HD: 49.91 FPS after 10,000 frames CPU <10% no jitter etc everythigng else stayed at 0

CPU: AMD 5900x | RAM: GSKILL Trident Z Neo RGB F4-3600C16D-32GTZNC-32-GB | MB: Asus X570-E | GFX: EVGA FTW3 Ultra RTX 3080Ti| Monitor: LG 27GL850-B 2560x1440

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Seasport

50 posts

Geek

#124703 18-Apr-2008 12:00

mentalinc: TV2: 49.91 FPS after 10,000 frames CPU <10% no jitter etc everythigng else stayed at 0
TV3: 49.95 FPS after 10,000 frames CPU <10% no jitter etc everythigng else stayed at 0
freeview | HD: 49.91 FPS after 10,000 frames CPU <10% no jitter etc everythigng else stayed at 0

Hmm. Interesting and I presume the picture is perfect? You're using EVR right?

So there is an obvious difference in our systems performance (6600 vs 3Ghz P4) but is it this that is causing the problem (my CPU is only running at less than 20%)? Or is it the Vista vs XP issue?

I know that Vista handles the hardware acceleration in the GPU differently than XP (DXVA vs DXVA2).

Maybe I need to upgrade to Vista.

Anyone else having this problem with XP?

mentalinc

3238 posts

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#124706 18-Apr-2008 12:16

Yes I am using EVR on vista with a quad core cpu

I am also using PowerDVD 8 while you are using the free one that came with Twinhan Digital TV package which could also be the source of teh problem (has anyone confirmed these are legit codecs?)

CPU: AMD 5900x | RAM: GSKILL Trident Z Neo RGB F4-3600C16D-32GTZNC-32-GB | MB: Asus X570-E | GFX: EVGA FTW3 Ultra RTX 3080Ti| Monitor: LG 27GL850-B 2560x1440

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Seasport

50 posts

Geek

#124743 18-Apr-2008 13:48

mentalinc: Yes I am using EVR on vista with a quad core cpu

I am also using PowerDVD 8 while you are using the free one that came with Twinhan Digital TV package which could also be the source of teh problem (has anyone confirmed these are legit codecs?)

Are you using DXVA2, i.e. h.264 on the nvidia GPU, or are you using your grunty PC? The problem may be related to the GPU engine. My CPU can't handle software only decode.

Actually, I am using the PowerDVD codecs. I bought PowerDVD 8 Ultra. However, results are the same as with the Twinhan Cyberlink codec.

I have copy of Vista for eval. I could try that but it is only the Business Edition. Will this work?

No1Daemon

172 posts

Master Geek

#124746 18-Apr-2008 13:51

I can confirm that the difference is remarkable with the cyberlink powerdvd 8 codecs.

I am now getting the same results as Mentalinc as far as frame rates. Also using evr though in vista.

DS248

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#124747 18-Apr-2008 13:56

Seasport: ... I have copy of Vista for eval. I could try that but it is only the Business Edition. Will this work?

No media center, but works OK. At least it does using PowerCinema. Have not tried other s/w yet.

Seasport

50 posts

Geek

#124750 18-Apr-2008 14:10

No1Daemon: I can confirm that the difference is remarkable with the cyberlink powerdvd 8 codecs.

I am now getting the same results as Mentalinc as far as frame rates. Also using evr though in vista.

Hey No1. Good news that you have got your problem sorted. Can you update me on your configuration please. Have you enabled GPU h/w H.264 decoding (DXVA2)? I think maybe this is an XP/DXVA issue.

No1Daemon

172 posts

Master Geek

#124756 18-Apr-2008 14:21

Seasport:
No1Daemon: I can confirm that the difference is remarkable with the cyberlink powerdvd 8 codecs.

I am now getting the same results as Mentalinc as far as frame rates. Also using evr though in vista.

Hey No1. Good news that you have got your problem sorted. Can you update me on your configuration please. Have you enabled GPU h/w H.264 decoding (DXVA2)? I think maybe this is an XP/DXVA issue.

Yes I have enabled hardware H.264 decoding but most of my problems related to the nvidia codecs etc. Using the sd cyberlink codecs for mpeg2 video and audio seems to have fixed the poor quality images I was getting. The hw encoding was already quite satisfactory.

Even though there should be no differences with the same settings, there are big differences between mediaportal and dvbviewer too in frame rates. If I knew more about graphedit I would investigate why for you.

I still have a few small issues to sort out. There is still that slight jerky look every so often when panning, even though the fps is stated as 49.95 with no jitter, it is still visible. I don't know how to describe it.

I also played with rivatuner to slightly overclock the 8600gt to try and get the best performance out of it that I could.
And enable fastwrites on it as wll, which helps.

mentalinc

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#124761 18-Apr-2008 14:35

Seasport: Are you using DXVA2, i.e. h.264 on the nvidia GPU, or are you using your grunty PC? The problem may be related to the GPU engine. My CPU can't handle software only decode.

I have copy of Vista for eval. I could try that but it is only the Business Edition. Will this work?

Yes i am using hardware accelleration (8800GT more powerful than yours also may have so effct :S)

As said Business edition will work fine they lack of MCE means nothing as that doesn't work here yet.

Install Vista to a spare partition and see if it solves your problems, if so looks like Vista will be required!

CPU: AMD 5900x | RAM: GSKILL Trident Z Neo RGB F4-3600C16D-32GTZNC-32-GB | MB: Asus X570-E | GFX: EVGA FTW3 Ultra RTX 3080Ti| Monitor: LG 27GL850-B 2560x1440

Quic: https://account.quic.nz/refer/473833 R473833EQKIBX

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