Help me choose a camera - Nikon D5300, Nikon D7100, Sony A77 II or something else

Forums › Digital Imaging › Help me choose a camera - Nikon D5300, Nikon D7100, Sony A77 II or something else

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#1225817 31-Jan-2015 12:10

joker97: or a really cheap D610 off trademe from someone who discovered dSLRs weren't their cup of tea after all :D

There's plenty of cheap and good cameras. There's even a second hand D3 at P&V in Chch for about $1400! OK it's got 300k shutter count but it will keep going for many more years yet.

Unfortunately the new Nikon distributor raised prices on taking over so Nikon new stuff is comparatively expensive again. A Df here now retails and more than a D810 - we are the only place in the world where that is the case, I believe.

I'm seriously considering changing to Canon just because Nikon is 20% more expensive every time I want something.

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#1225844 31-Jan-2015 12:36

I thought lacklands lowered the price over ta mac?

geekiegeek

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#1227570 2-Feb-2015 11:48

Well I ended up going with the D5300 for $899

Thanks for the input all, some good points.

dman

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#1230083 3-Feb-2015 01:27

Two big choices you need to make:

Point and shoot (or bridge cam) vs interchangeable lens camera.

Personally, I'm all for interchangeable lens cameras! But they're not for everybody, you have to be willing to spend a lot more (the cost of my camera bodies are rather minor compared to what I've spent on lenses) and carry the extra weight for the extra lenses. So if you're only going to use kit lenses, I wouldn't bother. I'd get a P&S/bridge camera instead.

Most (nearly all!) P&S or bridge cameras are pieces of sh*t IMHO.

However... in recent years, a few of them are quite decent and really nice!

The ones to check out (because they all have a 1" sensor, or even a bit bigger in the case of the LX100) are:

Sony RX100 series (mk1/mk2/mk3)
Sony RX10
Panasonic FZ1000
Panasonic LX100

Then, if you decide to get an interchangeable lens camera, you have to make the choice of:

Mirrorless vs DSLR.

From my perspective, mirrorless is very clearly the future. DSLR is only holding on barely in a few upper ends of various niches, and because of inertia (which is a BIG factor! But not so much for you, as you're starting from scratch).

Thus as a person starting out, I highly recommend mirrorless be at the top of the list.

So then to determine, what system?

Micro Four Thirds is the oldest mirrorless system and thus the most well established mirrorless system BY FAR, others are not even close (Micro Four Thirds is the only system with multiple manufacturers backing it. Most people don't realise, it is even more than just Panasonic and Olympus!).

Sony E mount is the next most well rounded system.

So I'd highly recommend just picking from one of those two, m4/3 or E mount.

Though Fujifilm is worthwhile considering too if you're a hipster and like that retro styling. Personally though, I find them lagging behind in areas vs Sony/Panasonic/Olympus. As for the others, don't even waste your time giving a second look at Canon/Nikon/Pentax's mirrorless offerings!

Currently, I reckon the specific models which are offering the most amazing bang for the buck are: Sony A5100 (or A6000 if you want the EVF) and Panasonic GX7 (or Olympus OM-D E-M5). Personally I am using the Sony A5100 as one of my main cameras, I picked it up for just US$320. Also, I used to have the Panasonic GX1 (picked that up for just US$199! Back in mid 2013, an amazing bargain for then).

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#1230918 4-Feb-2015 08:20

dman:
Mirrorless vs DSLR.

DSLR is only holding on barely in a few upper ends of various niches, and because of inertia (which is a BIG factor! But not so much for you, as you're starting from scratch).

MILC only has about 20% global market share, so DSLRs are certainly not confined to the upper end of various niches. To add to that, some MILC sales are supplemental / secondary systems for users owning larger DSLR systems.
As I've said before, the advantages and disadvantages of slr/milc systems are vastly overstated.
When Nikon and Canon enter the MILC market properly, if they do it right then they will eat the second/third tier maker's lunch, as they already enjoy about 80% market share in ILCs, in a declining market which is predicted to continue to decline.

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#1231215 4-Feb-2015 16:23

I'm referring to it from a performance / future prospects perspectives, rather than current sales.

They only reason they have a disproportionately large percentage of sales is due to inertia. (which as stated, is a *BIG* factor. But shouldn't be simply taken at face value for a person starting out)

> "When Nikon and Canon enter the MILC market properly...."

Maybe, maybe not. I'd be very sceptical about claims Canikon will dominate mirrorless in the future.

As it hinges on two big BIG assumptions:

a) they'll do it right (even though all indications so far are the exact *opposite* of that).

b) they'll effectively leverage off their existing lens base (which is a key reason why they're so far ahead with DSLR sales), I think it is rather unlikely this will happen is mirrorless will mean an entirely new mount which will thus render null their existing advantages they have of a massive lens catalogue they've been selling for decades.

The third bonus big assumption is some how these two big assumptions will be sufficient to overtake the large lead and experience their competitors are gaining already in the mirrorless market.

There is no way overnight that Canikon could replicate m4/3 existing range of lenses, or even Sony's or Fujifilm's. That takes time.

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#1231394 4-Feb-2015 21:56

Well somebody other than Sony had better release an FX format MILC, as there's no upgrade path to better image quality from 1/4 frame u4/3. While that small format may be adequate for many or even most people's needs, people tend to buy into systems with a view to what they *might* want to be doing down the track.
I'll stick with my opinion that Olympus will go bankrupt, Panasonic will remain in u4/3 - because they do things a bit differently - not try to linger on what they were in the past. And Sony are likely to ditch their loss-making camera division at any time, subject to a whim. Not to forget Fuji, Samsung, and Pentax. 6 Players sharing only about 20-25% of the market - a declining market.

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#1231433 4-Feb-2015 22:53

Fred99: Well somebody other than Sony had better release an FX format MILC, as there's no upgrade path to better image quality from 1/4 frame u4/3. While that small format may be adequate for many or even most people's needs, people tend to buy into systems with a view to what they *might* want to be doing down the track.
I'll stick with my opinion that Olympus will go bankrupt, Panasonic will remain in u4/3 - because they do things a bit differently - not try to linger on what they were in the past. And Sony are likely to ditch their loss-making camera division at any time, subject to a whim. Not to forget Fuji, Samsung, and Pentax. 6 Players sharing only about 20-25% of the market - a declining market.

Perhaps cameras but I can not imagine sony ditching their image sensors as that division seems to be doing alright.

Mirrorless is abit of a stagnant market at the moment.

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#1231444 4-Feb-2015 23:33

joker97: or a really cheap D610 off trademe from someone who discovered dSLRs weren't their cup of tea after all :D

What price would you consider cheap?

Geektastic

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#1232065 5-Feb-2015 23:49

Stan: I thought lacklands lowered the price over ta mac?

Apparently not. They also took over the Sandisk agency and promptly hiked the already way too high NZ prices for those too. This from a reliable source (but no names no pack drill!)

"Lacklands have streamlined the product range, and some big increases especially on some key lenses might have an effect.

Too early to tell , but definitely not as good as when Ken Newell was looking after us from Macaliters.."

dman

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#1233540 9-Feb-2015 16:08

Fred99, photographers have long since hit the "good enough" threshold in many areas.

I second photographed a wedding on Saturday, and both myself and the main shooter used Nikon DX.

I find it odd the full frame fanboys, if larger sensor is so great with no downsides.... why not get a medium format camera, or heck, go for large format!

Personally I am very happy with m4/3 + DX / APS-C, which I feel delivers the maximal balance of performance bang across the board. If I was to so called "step up", I'd much rather go medium format. (I did almost buy a A7s however, but certainly not because it is a full frame camera! Heck, I'd probably mostly use it in APS-C mode a lot of the time anyway. Hopefully the future A7000 will over the video features of the A7s I want but in an APS-C body)

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#1234315 10-Feb-2015 20:32

networkn:
joker97: or a really cheap D610 off trademe from someone who discovered dSLRs weren't their cup of tea after all :D

What price would you consider cheap?

saw one go for around just over $1000

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#1234364 10-Feb-2015 22:00

dman: Fred99, photographers have long since hit the "good enough" threshold in many areas.

I second photographed a wedding on Saturday, and both myself and the main shooter used Nikon DX.

I find it odd the full frame fanboys, if larger sensor is so great with no downsides.... why not get a medium format camera, or heck, go for large format!

Personally I am very happy with m4/3 + DX / APS-C, which I feel delivers the maximal balance of performance bang across the board. If I was to so called "step up", I'd much rather go medium format. (I did almost buy a A7s however, but certainly not because it is a full frame camera! Heck, I'd probably mostly use it in APS-C mode a lot of the time anyway. Hopefully the future A7000 will over the video features of the A7s I want but in an APS-C body)

A 36 mp FX is rather more portable than mf. Cheaper too. I had an email from CRK this very morning offering special deals on the Hasselblad H5-D50 for a mere $27,770 + GST.....

FX also makes more sense because it matches the true 35mm film.

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#1234370 10-Feb-2015 22:23

dman: Fred99, photographers have long since hit the "good enough" threshold in many areas.

I second photographed a wedding on Saturday, and both myself and the main shooter used Nikon DX.

I find it odd the full frame fanboys, if larger sensor is so great with no downsides.... why not get a medium format camera, or heck, go for large format! Personally I am very happy with m4/3 + DX / APS-C, which I feel delivers the maximal balance of performance bang across the board. If I was to so called "step up", I'd much rather go medium format. (I did almost buy a A7s however, but certainly not because it is a full frame camera! Heck, I'd probably mostly use it in APS-C mode a lot of the time anyway. Hopefully the future A7000 will over the video features of the A7s I want but in an APS-C body)

There's nothing new here. Many people have been happy to pay considerably more for the "extra stop" in lenses, same with sensor size. Full-frame has over a stop advantage over APS-c, two stops over 4/3.
Sure - an iPhone is "good enough" in many circumstances (hence phone cameras are killing the compact point and shoot digital camera market).
You might be disappointed with medium-format digital. For starters, unless you're very well-heeled indeed, most are "crop-sensor medium format". Next, you'll probably be dealing with a very basic AF system, perhaps only a single centre-point, and with no focus tracking ability. They are usually slow - maximum burst speed might be only 1 frame per second. Then, the lenses - priced to make your eyes bleed - might be a limiting factor - you won't get ultra-wide (especially with crop-sensor MF), a 4x telephoto zoom, and nor will you get fast (f1.2/1.4) normal primes.

There's nothing wrong with shooting a wedding using DX format, but most pros will use Fx - those I know use either Canon 5DII/III, or Nikon FX. I'm not going to write a thesis on why, but they have good reason and (with some exceptions) know what they're doing - their livelihood depends on it.

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#1234383 10-Feb-2015 22:54

Stan:

Perhaps cameras but I can not imagine sony ditching their image sensors as that division seems to be doing alright.

Indeed. Their latest financial statement forecasts sales for their camera sensor division to increase by 50%.
I have a sneaking suspicion that this may be to a customer who wants to keep this news under their hat for as long as possible.

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