Stuff quits Facebook due to "ethical reasons"

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#2518321 7-Jul-2020 09:23

was interesting to see their share prices dropped a few days into the boycott then recovered to some of their highest levels within 5 days

networkn

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#2518323 7-Jul-2020 09:25

dt:

was interesting to see their share prices dropped a few days into the boycott then recovered to some of their highest levels within 5 days

It's pretty normal. Their share price won't likely tumble too hard unless their revenue reports show a significant drop... Once investors stop getting benefits.....

MurrayM

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#2518325 7-Jul-2020 09:31

Is it just me or has the new Stuff dropped their Technology section from the home page?

1101

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#2518359 7-Jul-2020 10:23

MurrayM:

Is it just me or has the new Stuff dropped their Technology section from the home page?

Its there , you have to navigate to it through their new menu (top of page)

For those wanting FB to self censor , where do we draw the line .
There is no middle ground once censoring starts. Almost any differing view can be deemed as hate, and thats what we are seeing lately.

Extremest groups use the 'hate speech' label to shut down opposing views . Reason and debate gets discarded .
Plenty of examples of this .

If we truly want FB to change its ways , then FB users need to en masse delete their a/c's and stop using it.
We all know thats not going to happen. So look at the FB users as the 'issue' . They have to power to force change .

nzbsgfan

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#2518445 7-Jul-2020 11:59

1101:

MurrayM:

Is it just me or has the new Stuff dropped their Technology section from the home page?

Its there , you have to navigate to it through their new menu (top of page)

For those wanting FB to self censor , where do we draw the line .
There is no middle ground once censoring starts. Almost any differing view can be deemed as hate, and thats what we are seeing lately.

Extremest groups use the 'hate speech' label to shut down opposing views . Reason and debate gets discarded .
Plenty of examples of this .

If we truly want FB to change its ways , then FB users need to en masse delete their a/c's and stop using it.
We all know thats not going to happen. So look at the FB users as the 'issue' . They have to power to force change .

One persons free speech is another persons hate speech.

If the litmus test for free speech simply becomes something that doesn't offend another person - then I'd be concerned.

Sunlight is the best disinfectant. And perhaps, in a few cases, effective moderation.

jonathan18

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#2518733 7-Jul-2020 19:47

panther2: No one will miss stuff

Putting aside that this reply is irrelevant to the thread, it's also clearly bollox. You're assuming your own likes and dislikes are representative of the wider population, however, given Stuff is the most popular news site in NZ and apparently the fifth most popular site overall (unsure how this is measured), clearly many people (including me) would miss Stuff!

As someone who's had no regrets quitting Facebook after the Chch mosques massacre, I'm totally ok with Stuff's decision to join the boycott, hope that more companies join it, and that it remains in place.

jonathan18

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#2518736 7-Jul-2020 19:56

1101:
There is no middle ground once censoring starts.

Do you really think it's that binary? And that simple?

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Handsomedan

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#2518968 8-Jul-2020 09:27

Was quite surprised to see that it was on the top of the Reddit News tab yesterday...

Handsome Dan Has Spoken.
Handsome Dan needs to stop adding three dots to every sentence...

Handsome Dan does not currently have a side hustle as the mascot for Yale

*Gladly accepting donations...

Rikkitic

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#2518985 8-Jul-2020 09:39

There will always be grey areas when it comes to 'free speech', but there are also vast areas that aren't grey at all. Anyone with the slightest vestige of common sense (and common decency) can draw a line around speech that is truly hateful and destructive. For example, rants that call for violence against minorities or other groups. Or beheading videos. Or child porn. Or public shootings. It isn't hard to get community agreement on these sorts of things. The grey areas can be debated about, but the debate should not prevent banning of the worst stuff. That is a false argument.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

ArcticSilver

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#2519004 8-Jul-2020 09:47

I'm personally concerned by this.

Where do we draw the line on censorship? The problem is its subjective and bound to be abused.

Just look at the media, they love to show misleading stories that get the views, a lot of them are factually incorrect.

Facebook is classed as a platform and hence has protections under US law protecting it from being responsible for what people say. I would argue this is only valid because they DON'T moderate content.

It might be a unpopular opinion but I don't believe they should be required to moderate content.

I'm not a fan of Facebook and I think it has many issues but for me this is not one of them.

Edit: To clarify I am talking about self moderation, this does not exempt them from complying with the law when requested to take a item down.

Scotdownunder

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#2519013 8-Jul-2020 10:05

Just maybe the corporations withdrawing their advertising will find lack of FB makes no difference other than saving them money. I cannot think of any ad on platforms like google or amazon etc that I was interested in and plenty that were annoying or misplaced.

Rikkitic

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#2519018 8-Jul-2020 10:11

Facebook and any other commercial organisation will always be torn between maintaining standards and protecting the bottom line. Facebook infamously censored that iconic photo of the naked girl running from napalm in Vietnam. They take it upon themselves to censor a lot of other stuff they think someone might get offended by. It is then a little precious that they cry free speech when it comes to censoring vile commentary.

Censorship cannot be left up to any outfit driven by commercial interests. It has to come from an independent authority of some kind.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

1101

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#2519052 8-Jul-2020 10:48

Most of the facebook groups I follow are moderated . Abusive posts get deleted . Posts that blatantly dont follow those FB groups rules are deleted
So whats the issue .

No one is forced to go to FB groups that may be seen as allowing hate speech.
No one is forced to go to FB .
Fake FB ad's etc, how is that different to the misleading ad's on radio & TV .
If FB known for allowing free speech, then whats the issue. Dont like whats on there, dont go there. Its really that simple .

Rikkitic

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#2519067 8-Jul-2020 11:00

Wannabe extremists find inspiration where they can get it, including Facebook. The Christchurch shooter used Facebook to inspire others. Facebook is not a neutral or innocent party. It allows anything it can get away with that attracts clicks. That is how it makes its money.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

GV27

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#2519069 8-Jul-2020 11:03

This article went up without a disclosure statement yesterday so IDK if Stuff's ethics are as all that top-knotch tbh:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/opinion-analysis/300050095/is-kiwisaver-punishing-the-poor

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