Nissan Leaf and EV Imports - any experience with them?

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1402 posts

Uber Geek

#1460415 2-Jan-2016 22:16

Be careful with second hand Leafs - reset of the ECU by some dealers will bring the battery meter up to "as new" and you'll discover few days later after few KMs when ECU recalibrate itself - that the battery on 2011/2012 Leaf is not quite 100% but much lower - could be 70 could be 80% or whatever...

dwl

371 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1460498 3-Jan-2016 09:15

RUKI: Be careful with second hand Leafs - reset of the ECU by some dealers will bring the battery meter up to "as new" and you'll discover few days later after few KMs when ECU recalibrate itself - that the battery on 2011/2012 Leaf is not quite 100% but much lower - could be 70 could be 80% or whatever...

Thanks for the caution. Is there any easy way to tell whether the ECU has been reset? Would tools like LeafSpy show?

The battery is a lottery for second hand. There seems widely varying stories about remaining capacities on the forums. It could be better to get higher km if well cycled rather than one with low km left sitting at high charge but getting that info may not be possible.

RUKI

1402 posts

Uber Geek

#1460746 3-Jan-2016 19:17

dwl:
RUKI: Be careful with second hand Leafs - reset of the ECU by some dealers will bring the battery meter up to "as new" and you'll discover few days later after few KMs when ECU recalibrate itself - that the battery on 2011/2012 Leaf is not quite 100% but much lower - could be 70 could be 80% or whatever...

Thanks for the caution. Is there any easy way to tell whether the ECU has been reset? Would tools like LeafSpy show?
.....

LeafSpy - Lite version is free. Try that, share your experience with us please. Do not tell the dealer :-)

dwl

371 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1460921 4-Jan-2016 09:37

RUKI:
dwl:
RUKI: Be careful with second hand Leafs - reset of the ECU by some dealers will bring the battery meter up to "as new" and you'll discover few days later after few KMs when ECU recalibrate itself - that the battery on 2011/2012 Leaf is not quite 100% but much lower - could be 70 could be 80% or whatever...

Thanks for the caution. Is there any easy way to tell whether the ECU has been reset? Would tools like LeafSpy show?
.....
LeafSpy - Lite version is free. Try that, share your experience with us please. Do not tell the dealer :-)

It seems LeafSpy needs to use codes which only some OBDII adapters support. Recommended is LELink Bluetooth 4.0 or Konnwei KW-902. Jaycar have a generic Chinese model but a lot of these won't work and Jaycar policy is once you buy their unit no returns even if it doesn't work for your app. Does anyone reading this know whether there are any OBDII adapters available here that work properly with recent versions of LeafSpy?

RUKI

1402 posts

Uber Geek

#1461311 5-Jan-2016 09:40

dwl: ....
... Does anyone reading this know whether there are any OBDII adapters available here that work properly with recent versions of LeafSpy?

LeafSpy Software Developer suggested that ELM V1.5 BT will work.
I do have one which pairs with LeafSpy on Android - you can borrow it from me in Auckland.

dwl

371 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1461899 5-Jan-2016 20:05

RUKI:
dwl: ....
... Does anyone reading this know whether there are any OBDII adapters available here that work properly with recent versions of LeafSpy?

LeafSpy Software Developer suggested that ELM V1.5 BT will work.
I do have one which pairs with LeafSpy on Android - you can borrow it from me in Auckland.

Many thanks for the offer. I am down in Wellington and needed quick answers so have got some help from local Leaf owners and now have LeafSpy summaries for four Gen2 cars (2013 and 2014 models) at dealers. Battery health was good on all with worst being 95% at 62.52AH up to best at 99% at 65.25AH and cells all looked balanced. All had quite a few quick charges which didn't seem to matter much.

I have the answers I need now but for any others looking to buy a Leaf there is a wealth of info out there:

forums at my Nissan Leaf
local videos and useful NZ focused guide at Electric Heaven
Facebook groups like NZ EV Owners

Battery condition is a big ticket item and seems without any traction battery warranty on the imports I would recommend using tools like LeafSpy. Hopefully we will see a significant increase in EV numbers with vehicles like the Leaf well suited to typical commuting distances.

GeekRay

134 posts

Master Geek

Trusted

#1461917 5-Jan-2016 20:48

Thanks for sharing your findings, matey. Just of curiosity, during your hunting have you come across any of those installed with NZ map?

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dwl

371 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1461940 5-Jan-2016 21:15

GeekRay: Thanks for sharing your findings, matey. Just of curiosity, during your hunting have you come across any of those installed with NZ map?

Every Leaf I have looked at (4 Gen2) have been the basic S spec which has minimal car functions on the radio/nav unit so the dealers swapped then out for NZ radio and GPS. Higher spec models need to keep the centre unit for car functions so for Japanese imports you are probably left with car functions in Japanese, FM band expander and no NZ GPS.

I am happy with reduced specs on the S to get the NZ conversion (which often includes reversing camera). I guess some S imports might have original radio/GPS so worth checking.

RUKI

1402 posts

Uber Geek

#1462279 6-Jan-2016 13:06

dwl: ....
Every Leaf I have looked at (4 Gen2) have been the basic S spec .....

One other thing to have a close look at - the charger. Dealers modify Japanese chargers which are designed for 100-200V AC.
100% those did not have NZ C-tick. I am sure. Prove me if I wrong...

I would be interested in seing schematics of that modification ;-( and what explanation dealer would provide of the electrical safety for the modified charger...

One Auckland second hand Leaf Dealer mentioned problems he had with that but did not want to go into details ...

I asked one dealer in Europe to look for Leafs at wrecks - specifically for chargers, but received no positive answer yet.

dwl

371 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1462370 6-Jan-2016 14:53

RUKI: One other thing to have a close look at - the charger. Dealers modify Japanese chargers which are designed for 100-200V AC.
100% those did not have NZ C-tick. I am sure. Prove me if I wrong...

I would be interested in seing schematics of that modification ;-( and what explanation dealer would provide of the electrical safety for the modified charger...

One Auckland second hand Leaf Dealer mentioned problems he had with that but did not want to go into details ...

I asked one dealer in Europe to look for Leafs at wrecks - specifically for chargers, but received no positive answer yet.

Getting into detail here but hey, it is Geekzone. I had the same question when I saw the EVSE rated at 200V.

Note that the charger is in the vehicle and the EVSE cable has limited smarts to signal capacity and the two functions get confused. From what I have been shown (by a very helpful Leaf owner) is that the charger is probably rated for 240V (look at sticker on side of charger) while the Nissan EVSE might fail with 240V.

I was directed to this helpful post - How to modify upgrade Repair Nissan Leaf Charging Cable - which suggests the later models might cope a bit better. Each of the dealers I have spoken with supply (maybe for extra cost) a NZ rated EVSE with NZ 3 pin plug although some may be limited to 8A. If you want full 15A either Nissan (maybe modified if worried about failure) or other new EVSE (e.g. Juice Point).

The Open EVSE project looks interesting but lack of certification is a concern - if it did catch fire could be insurance consequences?

RUKI

1402 posts

Uber Geek

#1464895 7-Jan-2016 09:32

dwl:
...Each of the dealers I have spoken with supply (maybe for extra cost) a NZ rated EVSE with NZ 3 pin plug ....

If one put 230V transformer inside that box and change the cable to NZ cable => that does not automatically mean that EVSE modded in that way meets NZ safety standards. That was my point. Although many techs with basic skills are capable of that simple modification - it does not mean that legally dealer can offer that product in New Zealand to the end user without that prduct being certified.

dwl

371 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1465027 7-Jan-2016 11:29

RUKI:
dwl:
...Each of the dealers I have spoken with supply (maybe for extra cost) a NZ rated EVSE with NZ 3 pin plug ....

If one put 230V transformer inside that box and change the cable to NZ cable => that does not automatically mean that EVSE modded in that way meets NZ safety standards. That was my point. Although many techs with basic skills are capable of that simple modification - it does not mean that legally dealer can offer that product in New Zealand to the end user without that prduct being certified.

Agreed. I think that is why the dealers I spoke with are offering certified 230V EVSE. If some are saying they are optional and extra cost and saying that the Nissan one is fine (with no or uncertified mods) that is more of an issue. Luckily the dealer I am working with is saying the 230V certified EVSE is included so I don't have that uncertainty.

However, looking at the photos in the Sri Lanka forum, the relays have a label of 250V so if the transformer is replaced and any other high voltage components are checked for rating, if the person doing the modifications is licensed then hopefully they can certify. What are the rules in NZ for appliances? Is the fact there is a 200V label on the outside push it into modified equipment with different rules?

These are quite expensive items with one dealer asking extra $1050 - this is probably reasonable value but an unwanted increase in the sticker price and maybe misleading if required to get a fully certified package.

RUKI

1402 posts

Uber Geek

#1465718 8-Jan-2016 10:58

dwl:
These are quite expensive items with one dealer asking extra $1050 - ....

If you opt to use non-modified from Japan then you probably can source step down transformer for cheap.
There was (not sure if still is) local transformer manufacturer in New Zealand.

Out of curiousity looked at what is on Trademe. New standalone made in China step down transformer 3KW 240 -> 120V is about $220 (overpriced IMO).
Pictures show c-tick for NZ compliance (very much doubtful it is genuine C-tick as they can put anything in China) and NZ plug:
http://www.trademe.co.nz/electronics-photography/other-electronics/adaptors-chargers/auction-1011773228.htm

dwl

371 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1465890 8-Jan-2016 13:27

RUKI: If you opt to use non-modified from Japan then you probably can source step down transformer for cheap.
There was (not sure if still is) local transformer manufacturer in New Zealand.

Thanks for the suggestion.

Using a 230/120V doesn't seem right to me as the EVSE is then only getting 120V and not 200V as it is rated for and the internal electronics will be running at lower than expected voltage.

The car charger has this sticker saying 100-240V:

While the Japanese EVSE seems intended for 200V:

I guess the proper answer is a 230/200V transformer but it will introduce more losses than going direct through EVSE at 230V and getting one with C-tick may not be worth it. If there is anyone out there who modifies the Nissan 200V version and is prepared to certify the modification I would be interested in costs as the dealer supplied JuicePoint is only charging at 7.2A.

RUKI

1402 posts

Uber Geek

#1468370 12-Jan-2016 12:27

Just looked at what is known about Leaf 2016. From the hearsay the battery has been redesigned (blocks inside re-groupped) to the extent that the 2016 battery is not interexchangable with, say 2013 model (BMS is definately different).
Need somebody to shed a light on whether the individual battery modules have the same size, voltage and poles design - i.e. assuming the possible opportunity to use 2016 modules in the older Leafs when the time comes to change/rebuild the pack.
If that will not be possible - then I would stay away from previous Leafs as you would be reliant on the Dealer only and no wrecked newer cars could be your donor for modules.

With Toyota hybrids it is easy - NP2 7.2V NiMH modules are the same in a wide range of models (Prius, Camry, Lexus) and production years... e.g. 2000 Estima Hybrid was fixed with the donor modules from 2013 Camry Hybrid..

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