RUCs to apply to all vehicles (incl EVs), replacing road user tax on petrol

Forums › Transport (cars, bikes and boats) › RUCs to apply to all vehicles (incl EVs), replacing road user tax on petrol

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Ultimate Geek
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#3126830 13-Sep-2023 08:36

Qazzy03:

Yes, they currently do struggle to put fuel in the tank, often it is only $20-$30 per week and they stop using the vehicle when the fuel is red lining until the next pay cycle.

The RUC change *could* mean they are able to put more in the tank, it will last longer or go further. This 'extra' savings with petrol tax gone will not be put into A/P bank accounts and any physical cash will easily go.

As other users pointed out $76 isn't a lot of budget for

If someone can only afford $20 or $30 in fuel a week, $76 is three weeks worth of fuel in one shot. Granted without fuel excise, $20 will mean closer to 20L of fuel, rather than 6L now.

When you’re living pay to pay, you can’t save up $76. Being able to pay the distance when you fuel up at the same time at smaller amount than 1000km would help.

Qazzy03

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Ultimate Geek
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#3126832 13-Sep-2023 08:42

empacher48:

When you’re living pay to pay, you can’t save up $76. Being able to pay the distance when you fuel up at the same time at smaller amount than 1000km would help.

I think that would be the best way to both have high compliance and resolve my concern.

The next question will be how to implement that easily, I don't think fuel stations will want that hassle. Digital would be best but a lot of the country hated the COVID-19 App that MoE put out, and that was just scanning some QR codes. Also the admin fees a bit insane if someone was compiling and just doing smaller amounts. I do agree, their tank will have more fuel.

smac

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Ultimate Geek
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#3126833 13-Sep-2023 08:49

This thread has already wandered into misinformation/understanding.

There is no (current) proposal to apply RUC to all vehicles. (i.e. petrol cars)

What will happen is that the current exemption for electrics will lapse, so they need to start buying RUC. This isn't something National have proposed, it's been in the legislation for years, and was something Labour would have done anyway. They're just posturing over timing.

No impact on the impoverished as they don't own BEV's or PHEV's (yes a generalization, but I think fair).

The move to scrapping FED and everybody paying RUC is years away still (but will happen eventually).

GV27

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#3126834 13-Sep-2023 08:50

smac:

This thread has already wandered into misinformation/understanding.

There is no (current) proposal to apply RUC to all vehicles. (i.e. petrol cars)

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/132900566/all-vehicles-to-move-to-road-user-charges-under-national-including-evs

smac

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Ultimate Geek
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#3126836 13-Sep-2023 08:54

GV27:

smac:

This thread has already wandered into misinformation/understanding.

There is no (current) proposal to apply RUC to all vehicles. (i.e. petrol cars)

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/132900566/all-vehicles-to-move-to-road-user-charges-under-national-including-evs

Ya I know. But as I said it's not current policy, and National are fecking dreaming (or at least not thinking it through) if they think they can do that inside the next two terms. They're dressing it as a new idea, but it's not, it's been in discussion documents for decades.

Qazzy03

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Ultimate Geek
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#3126837 13-Sep-2023 08:55

smac:

This thread has already wandered into misinformation/understanding.

There is no (current) proposal to apply RUC to all vehicles. (i.e. petrol cars)

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/election-2023-national-to-phase-out-fuel-excise-tax-and-make-evs-subject-to-road-user-charges/F54JNN5NHJCKXHN5YZ7ZOMCVA4/

Road user charges will soon apply to all vehicles, including electric vehicles, according to a new plan by the National Party, provided they win the next election.

Brown said the plan will take time to roll out, but setting up a plan is a priority for the party’s theoretical first term.

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SirHumphreyAppleby

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#3126839 13-Sep-2023 08:57

smac:

National are fecking dreaming (or at least not thinking it through) if they think they can do that inside the next two terms.

You think something this trivial can't be done in six years?

Labour has really set expectations for achievement quite low, everywhere.

alasta

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#3126841 13-Sep-2023 09:01

While I was walking home from work last night I was glancing at registration tickets on parked cars and I'd say about 10% of them were expired, a couple of them by about a year. I couldn't easily see the WOF stickers as they were on the opposite side, but many of the cars I passed didn't look particularly roadworthy. I think RUC enforcement could be an absolute nightmare.

I wonder how feasible it would be for fuelling stations to have a facility where people can key in their registration number and current odometer reading and have the RUC added to their fuel charge. Obviously the fuel companies would need grants and ongoing admin revenue to make this work, but it might reduce compliance costs?

smac

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Ultimate Geek
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#3126846 13-Sep-2023 09:04

SirHumphreyAppleby:

smac:

National are fecking dreaming (or at least not thinking it through) if they think they can do that inside the next two terms.

You think something this trivial can't be done in six years?

Labour has really set expectations for achievement quite low, everywhere.

Yes, that is what I think. The implications are massive, across multiple industries.

Don't get me wrong, I think it's the way to go, it should have been at least started YEARS ago. But it's perhaps naïve to call it trivial.

Talkiet

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#3126873 13-Sep-2023 09:28

It's a great idea. Road maintenance needs to be funded and pushing that cost onto a decreasing proportion of users was always going to reach a breaking point.

Cheers - N

Please note all comments are from my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.

tdgeek

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#3126877 13-Sep-2023 09:32

Qazzy03:

As someone that does work in public service and with people that are low to even middle income, I personally do not think it will play out this way,

However I want to be respectful and not go off on a tangent from the purposed RUC policy change. It is interesting that the responses are mostly postive, so maybe I am out of touch.

All I have been hearing is cost of living impacts and to me a once or twice a year RUC bill will hurt Kiwi's as I don't think budgeting is as easy as tdgeek indicates.

I don't want to go down on lower income people, but "broadly", money is reduced every fill up and paid later. All of us pay utility bills, some may pay them when the bill arrives, others may set up weekly or fortnightly A/P's to spread the load. It would not be wise for some to take the excise savings each week then be faced with a bill once or twice a year if budgeting is an issue

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tdgeek

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#3126881 13-Sep-2023 09:41

shrub:

As a Diesel user who pays RUC its just something you get used to. Do it online not as instore is a punishing process.

Low income people that put $20 petrol in at a time will be the ones that struggle to fork out for 5-10000km RUC. That will be around $35-$700 if you were to be doing it every 1000km $75 then you get punished even more with the cost of admin and postage slapped on to each transaction.

The only way I can see its going to work is if there was a more convenient way of purchasing like every Z BP Caltex could sell and print a label quickly from a kiosk.

Yep. Remember phone cards? Buy a $20 RUC card or better yet, scan the RUC app and add $20, $10, $35 etc. Card they add the licence plate to it, app, has the licence plate built in. This stuff has been going on for years and years, Im sure it can be made pretty easy. Me, I'd setup a small A/P online and pay fortnightly, check every once in a while to see if Im behind or ahead. If I was behind, but had a history of very regular payments, the Police can ignore it for now, no penalty.

trig42

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#3126885 13-Sep-2023 09:47

I just hope they bring in a lighter vehicle rate. Up to 3500kg is a lot of vehicle. A lower rate for <2000kg (or even 1500kg) may encourage more fuel efficient vehicles.

tdgeek

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#3126887 13-Sep-2023 09:48

alasta:

I wonder how feasible it would be for fuelling stations to have a facility where people can key in their registration number and current odometer reading and have the RUC added to their fuel charge. Obviously the fuel companies would need grants and ongoing admin revenue to make this work, but it might reduce compliance costs?

Great idea. No need to give fuel companies funding for a few keypresses on their payment terminal

MikeB4

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#3126890 13-Sep-2023 09:54

Surely the easiest and fairest way would be to cancel all RUCs and include this in general taxation by an increase in PAYE etc or an increase in GST. If the later food should become exempt from GST

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

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