EVs not going to save the planet but please try not to rely on fossil fuels

Forums › Transport (cars, bikes and boats) › EVs not going to save the planet but please try not to rely on fossil fuels

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Smpl Mnmlst
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#3471837 19-Mar-2026 19:42

Great - but you didn’t specify what type of hybrid. And you said just ‘petrol’ - rather than, say, ‘total fuel cost’. So I guessed PHEV.

Sometimes I just sit and think. Other times I just sit.

eracode

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#3471850 19-Mar-2026 20:33

@batman Keen to hear why you regard CNN as a reliable authority and hold them up as the oracle on all this.

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RunningMan

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#3471851 19-Mar-2026 20:38

eracode:

@Rugrat Keen to hear why you regard CNN as a reliable authority and hold them up as the oracle on all this.

@eracode do you mean @batman ?

eracode

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#3471852 19-Mar-2026 20:39

RunningMan:

eracode:

@Rugrat Keen to hear why you regard CNN as a reliable authority and hold them up as the oracle on all this.

@eracode do you mean @batman ?

I did - my sincere apologies to @Rugrat - will fix it. Sorry.

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roobarb

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#3471869 19-Mar-2026 21:46

eracode:

That’s not particularly helpful - why don’t you just tell us why not.

The only sustainable era for the human race was really the stone-age/hunter-gatherer period, which ironically covers more than 99.99% of the time period of our existence.

gzt

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#3471873 19-Mar-2026 22:12

roobarb: The only sustainable era for the human race was really the stone-age/hunter-gatherer period, which ironically covers more than 99.99% of the time period of our existence.

The woolly mammoth would probably disagree with that assessment.

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Batman

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#3471883 19-Mar-2026 23:25

all i'm saying is the people over there are destroying the planet faster than you can drive your electric cars

but due to the nature of our electricity supply, we should electrify regardless of one's views on climate, so as to be less reliant on imported fuel which seems to be getting lit up by the tonnes at the moment

and yes i have owned 4 EVs, a 2013 which was sold, currently own a 2015, 2023, and a 2025 build EV. and no i'm not driving them to save the planet, every time i watch the news people are trying very hard to burn it to the ground but that's besides the point.

just go and electrify our country to somewhat reduce reliance on fickle oil supply!

paulgr

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#3471930 20-Mar-2026 10:00

In my humble opinion, oil is going nowhere.
Many people forget is that oil has far more uses than just producing fuels.
Just about anything we use now requires oil derivatives to make them with.
A large number of different types of oil derived products are used to build almost anything including building products, adhesives, sealants, detergents, all technology, fibre, cell phones, contact lenses, Paracetamol, Aspirin and many critical medications, Insecticides, Herbicides.

It's impossible to generate and distribute any kind of power without using some forms of oil derived plastic components.

As a lighter note, I also think that whales are happy we don't squeeze the oil out of them anymore to lubricate machinery and fill oil lamps.

MikeAqua

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#3471937 20-Mar-2026 10:24

gzt:
roobarb: The only sustainable era for the human race was really the stone-age/hunter-gatherer period, which ironically covers more than 99.99% of the time period of our existence.

The woolly mammoth would probably disagree with that assessment.

Generally, megafauna outside of Africa would disagree also. Everywhere humans spread to, the megafauna soon went extinct. But not in Africa, where it evolved alongside Hominids.

This includes NZ and Australia. The indigenous peoples of both places drove the megafauna to extinction. Admittedly in NZ, aside from the Moa and Haast Eagle, there wasn't any megafauna, yet. Some of the Aussie megafauna was really impressive. Giant kangaroos, echidnas, wombats and birds ...actually some seriously scary ground welling birds.

Most documentation of contemporary stone age societies also suggests life was pretty brutal with a lot of armed conflict and murder.

Mike

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#3471946 20-Mar-2026 11:23

paulgr:

In my humble opinion, oil is going nowhere.
Many people forget is that oil has far more uses than just producing fuels.
Just about anything we use now requires oil derivatives to make them with.
A large number of different types of oil derived products are used to build almost anything including building products, adhesives, sealants, detergents, all technology, fibre, cell phones, contact lenses, Paracetamol, Aspirin and many critical medications, Insecticides, Herbicides.

It's impossible to generate and distribute any kind of power without using some forms of oil derived plastic components.

As a lighter note, I also think that whales are happy we don't squeeze the oil out of them anymore to lubricate machinery and fill oil lamps.

Sure, but there's a lot more of it for that stuff if we stop burning it.

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BlakJak

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#3472066 20-Mar-2026 18:43

eracode:

Great - but you didn’t specify what type of hybrid. And you said just ‘petrol’ - rather than, say, ‘total fuel cost’. So I guessed PHEV.

"Hybrid" came first and didn't include plug-in. If you want to be a pedant, it could easily be argued that the Hybrid's that came later are the ones to be prescriptive of.
If you see someone simply say 'Hybrid' then i'd start with a typical HEV (or maybe MHEV) unless further clarifications are offered (such as PHEV).

And FWIW my 2015 Prius Alpha took me direct from Auckland to Wellington with a full load (four of us and luggage) at Christmas... I consumed 36.76L which cost $95.55 ($2.59.9/L) at Waitomo Johnsonville. 630.7km (16.8km/L).

No signature to see here, move along...

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elpenguino

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#3473089 24-Mar-2026 12:02

One thing we leave out of these discussion is vehicle size. If you drove an ICE car but chose a Nissan Micra over a Nissan ute, you're still doing a good thing for 'the environment'.

But vehicles just get bigger and bigger and there's no regulatory penalty.

Most of the posters in this thread are just like chimpanzees on MDMA, full of feelings of bonhomie, joy, and optimism. Fred99 8/4/21

MikeAqua

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#3473095 24-Mar-2026 12:14

elpenguino:

One thing we leave out of these discussion is vehicle size. If you drove an ICE car but chose a Nissan Micra over a Nissan ute, you're still doing a good thing for 'the environment'.

But vehicles just get bigger and bigger and there's no regulatory penalty.

Vehicles are getting bigger, in part, to comply with safety standards. Minimum wheelbase requirements in utes in some markets would be an example.

Mike

Scott3

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#3473112 24-Mar-2026 13:31

elpenguino:

One thing we leave out of these discussion is vehicle size. If you drove an ICE car but chose a Nissan Micra over a Nissan ute, you're still doing a good thing for 'the environment'.

But vehicles just get bigger and bigger and there's no regulatory penalty.

"no regulatory penalty"

In many cases there is a regulatory incitive.

For example in NZ, a passenger car's fleet average emission limit in 2026 is 108 g /km (was 84.5 g/km before the increase). For a Ute / Light commercial this is 207 g / 100km (was 207g/ km before it was increased).

Impact is somewhat less given fines have been dropped by 80%, but there is still an incentive here.

Let's say a buyer wanted a 4x4 Vehicle with low range to take a single occupant and a bag & folding rod to a fishing spot.

A Jimny (3 door) emits 162g / km (3p WLTP conversion), 54g over the limit.
calc

A triton double cab GLX 4wd wellside emits 233g / km of CO/2. 26g over the limit.

At the new fine rates ($15/g, was previously $67.50/gram) , this is a $420 incentive for a seller to encourage the buyer into dramatically higher emitting ute. Quite a perverse outcome.

You can stack this with fringe benefit taxi laws, that allow one to commute in a company ute to an accountancy firm without paying FBT, while the same trip in a (non taxi) 5 seat prius would incur FBT.

It's should not be a surprise that Utes are a big seller in NZ given this favorable treatment.

Worst example is the USA, where vehicles like the Chrysler PT Cruiser form factor is determined to meet the classification rules of a light truck...

elpenguino

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#3473131 24-Mar-2026 13:43

MikeAqua:

elpenguino:

One thing we leave out of these discussion is vehicle size. If you drove an ICE car but chose a Nissan Micra over a Nissan ute, you're still doing a good thing for 'the environment'.

But vehicles just get bigger and bigger and there's no regulatory penalty.

Vehicles are getting bigger, in part, to comply with safety standards. Minimum wheelbase requirements in utes in some markets would be an example.

Last time I checked, the Suzuki Swift was still available. I know its one of the top sellers.

But so many people dream of the big car.

Most of the posters in this thread are just like chimpanzees on MDMA, full of feelings of bonhomie, joy, and optimism. Fred99 8/4/21

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