Second hand EVs worth it?

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#3416775 20-Sep-2025 17:33

gzt:
Unless you're driving long distance for the most part it's just convenience. Imo 400-500km is the sweet spot for average NZ tikitouring and charger availability.

what car can drive 400km in the south island in winter (hills, wind, cold, and rain)? we drive at 100km/h not 60 as most of the area are rural don't even have mobile reception - even One NZ satellite trial didn't give me reception. also i'm presuming you don't plan to arrive at 0%.

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#3416776 20-Sep-2025 17:38

Jase2985: There are still massive gaps in charging infrastructure round NZ, and it makes it difficult for some routes or destinations, look at the south island, lose a charger, and it puts a lot more stress on the other ones or makes it hard to get to the next one due to the distance.

We are not talking about averages here, we are talking about the <5% of cases. A Nissan Leaf would suit everyone if that were the case. But people want the flexibility to go somewhere on a whim and not worrying about having to charge. its a little different to just popping into the pump for 5 mins to fuel up, it's usually a double-digit hit to your time if you need to charge if you are caught short.

Longer ranged EV's also come with a higher purchase price, not everyone can afford $40k+ for an EV with substantial range.

My Wifes car cost $32k and has 420km range per charge. Plenty of cheaper higher range vehicles out there too on the second hand market which is the topic of this discussion.

I agree, a Nissan Leaf will actually suit the majority of New Zealanders. Most people who have a Nissan Leaf also have another vehicle for longer trips but use the Leaf the majority of the time.

Gaps in infrastructure? You can charge at 10a off a regular power point if you really need to. I've never had a problem driving all over NZ. Even the electricity powering this sign can charge my EV's:

You generally don't have a plan a trip in an ICE vehicle, all you do is know where you are going and stop as needed for gas or the restroom. You don't need to plan in a 35-minute stop at xyz for 56% charge so you can make it to abc.

How often have you had to wait for a petrol pump?

It's more work planning, and it takes more time to go on a long trip in an EV, you can't argue that.

You've really got to stop with the FUD here... I've stopped to charge in Turangi multiple times during holidays and have actually beat the queue of cars waiting to get fuel. There's also no real planning, I use charging stations when I have to just like others use petrol stations when they have to but the key is I've got a charger in my own driveway. Stopping to charge and stretch my legs 2 times for ~15mins on a trip from Wellington to Auckland is really not a dealbreaker considering I'm saving all that time not having to visit petrol stations.

When I had an ICE I've had to queue for petrol stations quite often especially with cheap fuel days. Don't pretend queues don't exist there. I can honestly say I've never had to queue for EV charging the odd times I've needed it in ~90,000km of driving.

Anyway, can we get back on topic now?

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Mehrts

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#3416778 20-Sep-2025 17:41

Batman:

what car can drive 400km in the south island in winter (hills, wind, cold, and rain)? towns are 70-100kms apart. we drive at 100km/h not 60. also i'm presuming you don't plan to arrive at 0%.

Any of the actual long-range cars. Tesla Model 3 LR is a decent contender for this distance in these conditions.

Hell, even the Model 3 RWD has a decent real-world range of 400km with a good chunk of open road driving thrown into the mix. The longest drive I did without stopping for a break in my car (Model 3 RWD) was from Stratford to Levin (220km). It used exactly half of the available battery capacity to do this, and that wasn't while driving like a nana.

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#3416784 20-Sep-2025 18:24

michaelmurfy:

My Wifes car cost $32k and has 420km range per charge. Plenty of cheaper higher range vehicles out there too on the second hand market which is the topic of this discussion.

I agree, a Nissan Leaf will actually suit the majority of New Zealanders. Most people who have a Nissan Leaf also have another vehicle for longer trips but use the Leaf the majority of the time.

Gaps in infrastructure? You can charge at 10a off a regular power point if you really need to. I've never had a problem driving all over NZ. Even the electricity powering this sign can charge my EV's:

Your wife's car is tiny and Chinese made, which does put off a lot of people.

It has a stated range of 420km, what does it actually get? Maybe 90% of that round town and 80% of that on longer trips?

I could post up a screenshot of the chargenet map and how many chargers are not functional to counter your one picture there. More common to see a EV charger not working than a petrol station out of gas.

michaelmurfy:

You've really got to stop with the FUD here... I've stopped to charge in Turangi multiple times during holidays and have actually beat the queue of cars waiting to get fuel. There's also no real planning, I use charging stations when I have to just like others use petrol stations when they have to but the key is I've got a charger in my own driveway. Stopping to charge and stretch my legs 2 times for ~15mins on a trip from Wellington to Auckland is really not a dealbreaker considering I'm saving all that time not having to visit petrol stations.

When I had an ICE I've had to queue for petrol stations quite often especially with cheap fuel days. Don't pretend queues don't exist there. I can honestly say I've never had to queue for EV charging the odd times I've needed it in ~90,000km of driving.

Anyway, can we get back on topic now?

Its not FUD, its reality. I'm not spreading anything that isn't untrue.

You own a car which can do 500km or more per charge currently that's in the minority of the EV's in the fleet (yes its skewed buy a lot of leafs) and yes a lot of new EV's in the market have 400km+ range, but they are also a lot more expensive and out of reach of most. Your need to charge is also a lot less than most due to the range of your EV.

Your comments in relation to my comment "How often have you had to wait at a petrol pump?" is out of context, I was talking about "comfortable waiting at chargers" not queuing for them. i may have missed a word or used the wrong word there.

Your experiences also do not hold for the majority of people at this point in time.

Until they achieve price parity, range parity (for the cost), re-charging parity (time), there will always be those that dont want them because they have to change their habits. If these things were not an issue, there would be more adoption of them.

I would love to see the uptake of EV's increase in NZ, I would love to see the infrastructure increase. It will come with time. But at the moment there are still factors putting people off the transition.

Shoes2468

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#3416789 20-Sep-2025 19:01

blackjack17:

Spent yesterday at the car yards and test drove a number of cars.

First up Omoda E5 420 range $38,999 new no ORC

Really liked the dash, (how it didn't seem like they popped a tablet in the middle of the dash), handled well.
However when slamming the accelerator lost traction on wet road. Good boot size.
Was a "big car" (CX5 size and we wanted something smaller)
Looked nice but limited to 4 boring colours
My wife is really concerned about range and so sales people talked us into trying the Leapmotion C10 with range expander 1000km+ range (150 on electric). $44,990 + ORC

massive tablet like display with way to many features. No android auto (screen mirroring to come...) Big tablet was also reflective.
it felt like a really big car and it drove like a tank
I don't care that you can change the LED light colours and they will flash in time to music, I don't care that update will make the car "better" I want a car to do what I want now.
Tried a second hand 2022 (Nov) Peugeot 2008 50K on the clock $28,000 no ORC

Really liked it, nice finish, felt like a car quirky, small but okay boot space
Driving it felt just like a car should.
Might have a little small in the drivers seat but I had just been driving the leapmotion, and it is my wife's car.
Range is only 330 km and my wife is concerned about driving to Tauranga which she has to do for work every now and again
really nice looking car
Next tried a Opel Mokka 2023 17K on the clock $33,000

The green looked incredible (but that was already sold so the one available was the black and white which my wife didn't like as much)
Smaller than the Citroen but built on the same platform, drove the same
Didn't have the quirkiness of the Citroen but worked as a car.
Looked at the MG4 new $40,000 + ORC

The rubber trim around the doors on two different cars was starting to go white with oxidation.
Didn't test drive
Drove Hyundai Kona 2023 76K on the clock $30,000

felt like a car, looks good from the outside but kind of basic inside
My wife loves the idea of the nearly 500km range
inside just kind of felt boring, hard plastics etc.
Looked at the Polestar 2 $40,000

massive boot, has the extras but just didn't feel it. It kind of felt like a race car
Will be looking at a 2022 Citroen eC4 tomorrow $30,000

built on the same platform as the Opel and Peugeot
Has all the extras, heated seats, slightly quirky (but not as much as as the Peugeot
Nice looking car but rather plain paint job.

My wife is leaning towards the Hyundai for range, I like the Peugeot / Citroen for style / extras

Will also be looking at some hybrid / plug in hybrid AWDs for myself. Outlander / rav 4s

Hi there, what did you think of the Citroen? Compared to something like the Peugeot, much variation size wise?

Also did you end up purchasing anything as yet?
I'm looking at the $30k mark but struggling to find much, like the Kia Niro but none to be seen in Chch.

Also looking at model 3’s but pretty low to get in and out of.

michaelmurfy

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#3416794 20-Sep-2025 19:22

Jase2985:

Your wife's car is tiny and Chinese made, which does put off a lot of people.

It has a stated range of 420km, what does it actually get? Maybe 90% of that round town and 80% of that on longer trips?

Actually no, it's not that tiny and many vehicles these days are Chinese made (Tesla, Polestar amongst the many others). Have also achieved near enough to the quoted range on roadtrips.

I could post up a screenshot of the chargenet map and how many chargers are not functional to counter your one picture there. More common to see a EV charger not working than a petrol station out of gas.

Perhaps expand on this and post the Plugshare map of NZ showing all charging networks along with the many other places you can grab a charge if needed?

Its not FUD, its reality. I'm not spreading anything that isn't untrue.

You're spreading rather common misinformation here and by focusing on a single charging network when in reality you know there are multiple are somewhat acting in bad faith here...

Back on topic...

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Jase2985

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#3416795 20-Sep-2025 19:31

michaelmurfy:

Actually no, it's not that tiny and many vehicles these days are Chinese made (Tesla, Polestar amongst the many others). Have also achieved near enough to the quoted range on roadtrips.

They are still a minority and some are still weary of them.

michaelmurfy:

You're spreading rather common misinformation here and by focusing on a single charging network when in reality you know there are multiple are somewhat acting in bad faith here...

I picked the largest one, as an example, like you picked a specific brand for of fuel for your image. There is zero misinformation in what I have posted, nor zero bad faith.

I'm pointing out that EV's are not for everyone at the moment, and challenged you on some of your statements which you appear to not have liked.

RunningMan

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#3416796 20-Sep-2025 19:33

To be fair, SH8 through Fairlie and Tekapo currently shows failed Charge Net chargers at both those (consecutive) locations (2 separate sites in Tekapo) and no other networks with DC chargers. The only option Plugshare shows is a caravan park in Fairlie (16 amp AC) that was last updated in 2018.

3 broken sites on the same route would be genuinely problematic for some EVs.

michaelmurfy

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#3416798 20-Sep-2025 19:41

Jase2985:

I picked the largest one, as an example, like you picked a specific brand for of fuel for your image. There is zero misinformation in what I have posted, nor zero bad faith.

I'm pointing out that EV's are not for everyone at the moment, and challenged you on some of your statements which you appear to not have liked.

Erm… you were acting in bad faith there. And no, I wasn’t focusing on a single brand. I was showing that fuel stations can and do run out of fuel to counter your statement.

You’re right though - I don’t appreciate common EV FUD especially when it doesn’t hold true to the majority of drivers and don’t appreciate it on a thread where people are asking for advice and will always counter this. We’ve established your other point at the very beginning.

michaelmurfy

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#3416799 20-Sep-2025 19:43

@RunningMan Yeah, Alpine Energy had one guy who cared about charging infrastructure who left and since then chargers haven’t really been maintained. There is a user on here who repairs them and is struggling with dealing with them. They’re not chargenet owned and that’s the main problem.

Same with the Contact Energy ones here in Wellington.

Jase2985

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#3416801 20-Sep-2025 19:58

michaelmurfy:

Jase2985:

I picked the largest one, as an example, like you picked a specific brand for of fuel for your image. There is zero misinformation in what I have posted, nor zero bad faith.

I'm pointing out that EV's are not for everyone at the moment, and challenged you on some of your statements which you appear to not have liked.

Erm… you were acting in bad faith there. And no, I wasn’t focusing on a single brand. I was showing that fuel stations can and do run out of fuel to counter your statement.

nor was i.... I'm sorry i didn't post every other EV brand there...... it was an example. i was showing that EV chargers sometimes have issues, just like you and your lack of fuel at a petrol station.

michaelmurfy:

You’re right though - I don’t appreciate common EV FUD especially when it doesn’t hold true to the majority of drivers and don’t appreciate it on a thread where people are asking for advice and will always counter this. We’ve established your other point at the very beginning.

its not the majority, though, that's the point I'm trying to make.

EV's are in the minority of vehicles type in NZ, long range EV's are in the minority of EV's out there.

For the OP's question, yes, second hand EV's are worth it, if it meets your wants and needs. For some this is an easy decision, and like you would never go back, for others it's a harder sell for all the reasons I've mentioned and more.

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DamageInc

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#3416893 21-Sep-2025 10:23

A good post, thank you. Will follow and add to later today.

@michaelmurfy will ask a few questions please.

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John225

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#3427732 24-Oct-2025 14:39

I've been using a 2015 Leaf I bought almost 5 years ago for my work commute and as a runaround. It's now worth about a 1/3 what I paid for it which wasn't really that much. Introduction of the clean car discount depreciated it about $3.5k overnight. Allowing the RUC exemption to expire was another hit. Depreciation has been about $2k per year, so really not too bad. As a car it's really been the most reliable thing, I've replaced the 12v battery once and some tires. I got some near new tires with the wheels off a P12 Primera from Pickapart for about $220. It might not be quick on paper but it feels quick and it corners very flat. The longest trip I've made in it was from Pukekohe to Albany to get a spare key made for it, 120+ km round trip. Charged it up to 100% and planed to stop at the airport on the way back for a quick charge. When I got close I still had plenty of charge so I thought I'll stop at Paerata Rise if I had to for a quick charge instead. Stop and go on the Auckland motorway kind of boosted my range, EV's can be very efficient at slow speeds. So I didn't stop for a charge. When I got home I was on the low low battery warning with just a handful of km's up my sleeve. With Google maps telling me the distance left to cover and the rangeometer telling me how far I could go, it was predictable and so not really that anxiety inducing. We took it to the in-laws once thinking we would plug it in there to have enough juice to get home, someone had hit a power pole the night before and power was out all day of all days, what are the chances. We stopped in Pokeno for a quick charge to get home, no problem. That's one of its few quick charges since I've had it. My charging regimen I've adopted to extend the battery life does mean I cannot be spontaneous in my use of the car so much. For an old tight wad like me its definitely been worth it. What we individually value is a big factor in a choice. Not using any oil and inadvertently sponsoring war is significant to me. Using domestically produced energy and so helping NZ's balance of trade also counts with me as significant.

Leaf vs Tiida Running cost @10,000km/year, 200km/week, 40km/day (5 day/week). Leaf platform is based on Tiida platform so similar in size.

Leaf uses about 7 units/day (estimated). Unit cost $0.29 not including portion of fixed charges, $2.03/day or $10.15/week. RUC's @ 200km/week ($76/1000km), $15.20/week. Total cost $25.35/week.

Tiida fuel economy 7.6l/100km @ 40km/day = 3.04l/day or 15.20l/week, @ $2.68/l for 91, Total running cost becomes $40.74/week.

The EV still costs less to run on a day to day basis, not a sweet as before the reintroduction of RUC's though. I'm not considering servicing costs in this which is way worse for ICE vehicles.

Excise tax is $0.70024/l so effective RUC's for Tiida is $10.64/week, quite a bit less than the EV.

When RUC's are applied to ICE vehicles efficient vehicles will see their running costs increase and inefficient vehicles like Utes and Vans will see their running costs decrease.

Note that vehicles under 1000kg GVM are exempt from RUC's. Is the government going to create a resurgence in motorcycle use with eRUC's? Motorcycles will be exempt (most of them).

Basil12

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#3427785 24-Oct-2025 16:46

I've had my 2026 24kWh Leaf for almost three years. Easy and fun to drive and is normally used just for the 35km round trip to work. It is sometimes used for the 92km trip to the beach, which is mostly on SH1 motorway speeds, where it usually hits the low on fuel warning with about 8kms to go. Longest trip was popping from Waitarere to Napier to pick something up - 234km each way - I was in Napier for about ten minutes. It was before road user charges to was a pretty cheap trip.

My costs average 16c/km for depreciation - I reckon it is now worth circa $4,000 with its 9 bars.

It used to eat tyres for breakfast but a trip to Thomsen Tyres in Petone seems to have fixed that issue. Including all actual costs other than electricity is 15c/km. Electricity averages only 2c/km. Total 32c/km for the almost three years I've had it (with some rounding).

My cheapest car to run was the 2011 Yaris the Leaf replaced - this was only 29c/km based on $2.50 per litre. Main saving was the tiny depreciation as it only lost $3,250 between 2015 and 2023, or only 4c/km. It was a manual so also fun to drive.

But the Leaf is warm on a winter's morning (I park outside) with nothing to scrape off the windscreen on a chilly morning. Heated steering wheel and seats. Always a full tank in the morning as I tend to charge it most nights - I use a smart plug instead of the internal timer. And wonderfully nippy even though I drive it in Eco. I've very happy with my Leaf.

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RunningMan

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#3427797 24-Oct-2025 19:12

Basil12:

I've had my 2026 24kWh Leaf for almost three years.

Sure it's a 2026?

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