An idea regarding Air NZ and Airpoints

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Geektastic

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#1370673 20-Aug-2015 08:39

They might send Big Ron and Crusher round from the bookies to 'have a chat' with you....

MikeAqua

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#1370748 20-Aug-2015 10:29

I don't believe it's not money laundering unless you are trying to legitimize money made illegally or hide it to avoid paying tax.

Hard to argue that it's fraud if you are within the T&C's.

However I think you will struggle to find goods or services that: -
1) Are treated as purchases; and
2) Refundable; and
3) After any cancellation fees or similar make it worthwhile compared to just purchasing tickets.

Mike

andrewNZ

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#1370796 20-Aug-2015 11:07

MikeAqua: I don't believe it's not money laundering unless you are trying to legitimize money made illegally or hide it to avoid paying tax.

Hard to argue that it's fraud if you are within the T&C's.

However I think you will struggle to find goods or services that: -
1) Are treated as purchases; and
2) Refundable; and
3) After any cancellation fees or similar make it worthwhile compared to just purchasing tickets.

I'm not suggesting it is money laundering. What I'm saying is large sums of money in and out will raise red flags. The anti money laundering rules that came I recently made banks etc take a active role in stopping money laundering.

wasabi2k

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#1370868 20-Aug-2015 13:14

blackjack17: You used to be able to buy chips at a casino with a credit card and then automatically cash out the chips (This was over 10 years ago). This would give you a cash advance interest free as well as earning reward points. From memory credit card companies now treat casino chip purchases as a cash advance.

You still can, but will have to provide photo ID and transactions over a certain value get included in a report. Suspicious transactions are flagged to DIA and police. Also as discussed I suspect most banks would not grant rewards on gambling related purchases.

Good Luck.

CitizenErased

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#1370872 20-Aug-2015 13:30

It's simple: read the T&Cs at Bet365.com (or any other gambling site):

You can only withdraw funds to the same card you deposited from
If you deposit funds with the intention of not using them for gambling (i.e. deposit and withdraw without spending anything) they reserve the right to pass on any bank/credit card fees they incur

scuwp

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#1370919 20-Aug-2015 15:18

Lias: It's not fraud, it's common sense.

If you can legally work the system to get something for nothing, then more power to you.

It's called using a document for pecuniary advantage, or possibly obtaining by deception. It's fraud. Get that on your record and you won't have to worry about air points because you won't be able to travel anywhere.

An analogy off the top of my head is tying a piece of string to a coin and then using that coin in a vending machine. Once you have the bag of chips you pull the string out again. You gain something by unlawfully deception.

Lazy is such an ugly word, I prefer to call it selective participation

Batman

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#1370923 20-Aug-2015 15:32

it's only unlawful if it's illegal. try taxation ...

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Geektastic

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#1370994 20-Aug-2015 17:07

scuwp:
Lias: It's not fraud, it's common sense.

If you can legally work the system to get something for nothing, then more power to you.

It's called using a document for pecuniary advantage, or possibly obtaining by deception. It's fraud. Get that on your record and you won't have to worry about air points because you won't be able to travel anywhere.

An analogy off the top of my head is tying a piece of string to a coin and then using that coin in a vending machine. Once you have the bag of chips you pull the string out again. You gain something by unlawfully deception.

I thought that only worked for Top Cat?

khull

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#1371170 20-Aug-2015 21:20

Life is too short to try and get around hacking Airpoints - when you earn enough it does not matter. I give away my points away to family members for koru etc etc. Status points is far more important :)

Lias

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#1371265 20-Aug-2015 23:36

scuwp:
Lias: It's not fraud, it's common sense.

If you can legally work the system to get something for nothing, then more power to you.

It's called using a document for pecuniary advantage, or possibly obtaining by deception. It's fraud.

IANAL but I very much doubt that, I suspect it falls more in the realm of card counting in casinos. They don't like it, tell you you can't do it, they kick you out if they catch you, but it's perfectly legal.
I'm sure the card issuers would likely revoke the issuing of points and close your accounts if caught, but I don't see a legal issue, at most a civil breach of contract issue once they have updated their T&C to forbid such things.

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sbiddle

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#1371281 21-Aug-2015 07:26

khull: Life is too short to try and get around hacking Airpoints - when you earn enough it does not matter. I give away my points away to family members for koru etc etc. Status points is far more important :)

They go hand in hand really, since most people would use a credit card, not a OneSmart, for such challenges.

eracode

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#1371293 21-Aug-2015 08:16

A similar thing can be done at some retailers. Buy something using your credit card and get the associated Air Points. Take the item back for a credit. When they hand you the Eftpos handset, click on 'cheque account' rather than 'credit card'. The credit funds go to cheque and the Points arising from the sale don't get reversed. You also get free credit for the carry period of the card.

Unless you do this with a large amount, it's certainly not worth doing deliberately - so just pointing it out as a matter of principle, not principal.

Also it's dishonest and probably against their T&Cs.

Sometimes I just sit and think. Other times I just sit.

Geektastic

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#1371295 21-Aug-2015 08:26

khull: Life is too short to try and get around hacking Airpoints - when you earn enough it does not matter. I give away my points away to family members for koru etc etc. Status points is far more important :)

It's amazing how fast it can be gained too.

My wife worked for 12 months in Auckland and flew from Wellington and back weekly, staying up there during the week.

She went from peasant status to Gold by the end of that contract and is now only a short way from Elite - and on Monday she starts a new contract in Auckland for 3 months..!

And the good thing about Elite is that there is a Partner card which has all the actually useful benefits so I get to have it too!

All that achieved with not a single international flight (ANZ always too expensive for that!) but next month we are heading to Burma and flying Thai, so her Gold status now gets us priority check in and lounge access. Hurrah!

sbiddle

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#1371296 21-Aug-2015 08:32

Geektastic:
khull: Life is too short to try and get around hacking Airpoints - when you earn enough it does not matter. I give away my points away to family members for koru etc etc. Status points is far more important :)

It's amazing how fast it can be gained too.

My wife worked for 12 months in Auckland and flew from Wellington and back weekly, staying up there during the week.

She went from peasant status to Gold by the end of that contract and is now only a short way from Elite - and on Monday she starts a new contract in Auckland for 3 months..!

And the good thing about Elite is that there is a Partner card which has all the actually useful benefits so I get to have it too!

All that achieved with not a single international flight (ANZ always too expensive for that!) but next month we are heading to Burma and flying Thai, so her Gold status now gets us priority check in and lounge access. Hurrah!

Just because you fly lots domestically doesn't guarantee status. It'd be very easy to fly a weekly return flight with Air NZ and not even get gold by the end of the year if you're on cheap tickets.

Book higher priced tickets and you'll get there easily.

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