Our next national election - policies, promises and people

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#2404895 22-Jan-2020 18:25

elpenguino:

MikeB4:

I can't see Bridges performing well in a debate against a raisin or a turnip

He's going to have to start making better choices than having his trip to China organised by someone who is described as a trainer of Chinese spies (but who may well do more than that).

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/118419927/national-mp-jian-yang-organised-simon-bridges-controversial-china-trip-emails-show

Way to go Simon.

Labour isn't exactly clean in this regard either, from what I understand, which is probably why their MPs have little to say about it and it's mostly being driven by the kind of people who bought into the Chinese Last Names scandal.

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#2404905 22-Jan-2020 18:56

GV27:

Labour isn't exactly clean in this regard either, from what I understand, which is probably why their MPs have little to say about it and it's mostly being driven by the kind of people who bought into the Chinese Last Names scandal.

Its probably a case of stuffing up and learning from it. Some learn, some dont. Labour has had plenty of well deserved criticism, but at least they tried and failed. You wont see any Kiwibuilds in election year policies. Aside from the well publicised last election key policy fails, we are in good shape. As are education and health even though they wanted more. Roading is getting a much needed hit, which will benefit the economy. I give them a 6/10 overall, id expect less policy stuff ups this time round if there is a this time round. Nats need to get with the play and have policies for a change. I mean hard policies not talk, which goes both ways.

And please goodbye NZF, or at least Jones.

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#2404912 22-Jan-2020 19:10

I don't see this latest outrage as a National/Labour thing. Simon Bridges crossed a line when he embraced a Philippines government official who has proudly gone on record stating that he regards the Holocaust and those who perpetrated it as a model for his own country. That is despicable beyond words. Bridges needs to go.

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#2404916 22-Jan-2020 19:21

Rikkitic:

I don't see this latest outrage as a National/Labour thing. Simon Bridges crossed a line when he embraced a Philippines government official who has proudly gone on record stating that he regards the Holocaust and those who perpetrated it as a model for his own country. That is despicable beyond words. Bridges needs to go.

Any outrage will end up being glossed over in favour of Nats vs Labs. I agree though, we could debate or comment the nuances, but it always ends up aggressive. I would wager that they will dump Bridges and do a new look National, with JC in charge, as a boost for the election, so right now, he is safe as houses. A change will be closer to the election, to add momentum.

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#2404918 22-Jan-2020 19:44

Judith Collins as leader what a horrific thought.

GV27

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#2405006 22-Jan-2020 20:12

MikeB4: Judith Collins as leader what a horrific thought.

Can't see her as leader tbh. The media won't put up with a strongwoman as a party leader, they want someone who will talk about things like child poverty or housing deprivation until it comes time to actually deliver on it, at which point they will be given a free ride. JuCo isn't that. She's the muscle you want in a senior whip, but as a leader? I can't see it.

We're effectively heading towards 2005. Brash/Bridges will flame out with a shift to the right, Labour will have to revert to big bold promises to avert attention from an abysmal failure to deliver pretty much anything and the shift back to the main two parties will imperil Winston and the Greens. I'd say you're more likely to end up with an FPP result instead of an MMP one come September/Whenever.

The only thing that will save them for sure is if Labour plays the same game they've been complaining about in Epsom for years, but I doubt they'd be too ashamed about it if it meant they have friends to play with after election night

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#2405064 22-Jan-2020 22:34

Dump Twyford for a start (should have been done when kiwi build turned t*ts up), God help us if NZ First get back in, Jones and the Peter's clan has to go end of , JA needs to also show some backbone and not just the airy fairy stuff.

National has a great following as a party but won't get in with Bridges at the helm, IMO.

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tdgeek

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#2405096 23-Jan-2020 06:26

GV27:

MikeB4: Judith Collins as leader what a horrific thought.

Can't see her as leader tbh. The media won't put up with a strongwoman as a party leader, they want someone who will talk about things like child poverty or housing deprivation until it comes time to actually deliver on it, at which point they will be given a free ride. JuCo isn't that. She's the muscle you want in a senior whip, but as a leader? I can't see it.

We're effectively heading towards 2005. Brash/Bridges will flame out with a shift to the right, Labour will have to revert to big bold promises to avert attention from an abysmal failure to deliver pretty much anything and the shift back to the main two parties will imperil Winston and the Greens. I'd say you're more likely to end up with an FPP result instead of an MMP one come September/Whenever.

The only thing that will save them for sure is if Labour plays the same game they've been complaining about in Epsom for years, but I doubt they'd be too ashamed about it if it meant they have friends to play with after election night

She is a no nonsense person, not a wimp, thats the difference. Labour hasn't delivered pretty much anything? Your over focusing on KB and CGT. They have pottered away with gains, economy is in good shape, education and health has had a boost, just not a 9 year catchup boost. 12B roads projects will help the economy, debt is down, etc. While few like JC, Nats need a LEADER. She's no nonsense, a shaker not a whiner, and she would compete with Adern in debates, dilute Adern. Or they could go with an unknown as Labour did, no baggage, but that wont compete with Adern. Does national want a strong leader or not??

IMO put the emotive stuff to one side and look at it rationally. JC is really the only choice, unless you want to flag this election and look ahead to 2023 and groom someone.

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#2405104 23-Jan-2020 07:18

Do you remember JC created a hole for herself in China and was stood down from cabinet.

Sorry, but she is tainted with stupidity too.

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#2405106 23-Jan-2020 07:28

sir1963:

Do you remember JC created a hole for herself in China and was stood down from cabinet.

Sorry, but she is tainted with stupidity too.

Correct. The same can be said about any MP who holds a portfolio. Im merely suggesting an option that would make a material difference to Nationals lack of leadership. I hear what you say, but if that was taken literally, then the only leadership options for any of the parties that exist, is a null option. Or an unknown that no one had heard of. JA was one of those but she is also tainted as its frequently mentioned that she has no backbone. .Apart from Shaw, IIRC he isnt tainted yet

GV27

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#2405110 23-Jan-2020 07:38

sir1963:

Do you remember JC created a hole for herself in China and was stood down from cabinet.

Sorry, but she is tainted with stupidity too.

Shane Jones has spent the last term doing pretty much the same thing without so much as a stern talking to.

GV27

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#2405111 23-Jan-2020 07:41

tdgeek:

Your over focusing on KB and CGT. They have pottered away with gains, economy is in good shape, education and health has had a boost, just not a 9 year catchup boost. 12B roads projects will help the economy, debt is down, etc.

Debt is down because they didn't spend half the money they said they would or do the things they campaigned on. The biggest inroads they made were in state housing and the debt for that doesn't count because it was farmed out to Housing NZ as opposed to being on the Govt's books.

As for 'over focussing', there are plenty of other major stuff-ups that town hall resets or years of undelivered delivery can't make up for, no matter how breathlessly the media repeats them rather than actually asking why stuff isn't being done in the first place.

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#2405113 23-Jan-2020 07:46

GV27:

tdgeek:

Your over focusing on KB and CGT. They have pottered away with gains, economy is in good shape, education and health has had a boost, just not a 9 year catchup boost. 12B roads projects will help the economy, debt is down, etc.

Debt is down because they didn't spend half the money they said they would or do the things they campaigned on. The biggest inroads they made were in state housing and the debt for that doesn't count because it was farmed out to Housing NZ as opposed to being on the Govt's books.

As for 'over focussing', there are plenty of other major stuff-ups that town hall resets or years of undelivered delivery can't make up for, no matter how breathlessly the media repeats them rather than actually asking why stuff isn't being done in the first place.

And that bolded part only seems to apply to Labour. If you apply it to the previous 9 years then you get a raft of excuses

GV27

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#2405140 23-Jan-2020 09:00

tdgeek:

And that bolded part only seems to apply to Labour. If you apply it to the previous 9 years then you get a raft of excuses

What does the previous government have to do with whatever bait-and-switch policies Labour made during their campaign?

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#2405141 23-Jan-2020 09:04

GV27:

tdgeek:

And that bolded part only seems to apply to Labour. If you apply it to the previous 9 years then you get a raft of excuses

What does the previous government have to do with whatever bait-and-switch policies Labour made during their campaign?

Forget it

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