The Prime Minister and the waitress

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#1292239 27-Apr-2015 14:02

surfisup1000:
Yes, but for whom would you vote?

Conservatives are religious and colin craig is a bit odd, greens are absolute communists economically and the country would fail, act are impotent and a little bizarre under jamie whatshisface, labour have whacko ideas such as nationalising power generation and forcing you install low pressure shower heads. As for nz first, I guess if you like horse racing then they might be for you but winnie is a liar and I don't think you can trust him on anything.

Perhaps JK is the best of a bad bunch? Although , I've had enough of him, time for a fresh face but please not steven joyce!!!

I felt that going into the 2nd term, and voted for JK as the "safer option", but just couldn't stomach myself to do the same again last time. JK/National appear to be swinging more and more Pro US, pro IP/TPPA, pro big business. The biggest thing that stopped me voting National this time was TPPA, with 5EYES/Snowden coming up second place. I just felt last election that no matter how much I dislike the communist left, and how much they will bankrupt the country with airy fairy policies, it's better to live in a fiscally bankrupt country than a morally bankrupt one, and TPPA/5EYES are morally abhorrent.

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MikeB4

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#1292245 27-Apr-2015 14:23

We are witnessing the Third Term Government malaise. It is why we seldom have a fourth term Government, from memory the last was The Sir Keith Holyoake National Government. I do not believe the Key Government will see a fourth term.

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

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#1292252 27-Apr-2015 14:42

MikeB4: I do not believe the Key Government will see a fourth term.

Forth and fifth if we keep seeing what I've been seeing on the political stage for the past decade.

Who's going to rise up against National with a message that the country wants to hear?

Do your home work and you'll quickly find I've typically been a green labour supporter for the past while, with a bit of Internet party thrown in for good measure.

But I'm a minority with a strong swing to National by the general public.

This hair thing is nothing but noise.

I fully agree that the country is going to tell JK to keep his hands in his pockets and off womens hair other than his wifes. but they're going to use social media to send that message not their ballot paper.

When it comes to ballot papers they're after the real issues.

People wanted to see our power companies sold. They wanted a strong single team. They wanted a guy who is worth tens of millions to lead our country in the hope that they might too get more wealth.

What they didn't want was a return to center left world of benefits and unemployment with unions calling the shots.

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#1292253 27-Apr-2015 14:45

DonGould:
MikeB4: I do not believe the Key Government will see a fourth term.

Forth and fifth if we keep seeing what I've been seeing on the political stage for the past decade.

Who's going to rise up against National with a message that the country wants to hear?

Do your home work and you'll quickly find I've typically been a green labour supporter for the past while, with a bit of Internet party thrown in for good measure.

But I'm a minority with a strong swing to National by the general public.

This hair thing is nothing but noise.

I fully agree that the country is going to tell JK to keep his hands in his pockets and off womens hair other than his wifes. but they're going to use social media to send that message not their ballot paper.

When it comes to ballot papers they're after the real issues.

People wanted to see our power companies sold. They wanted a strong single team. They wanted a guy who is worth tens of millions to lead our country in the hope that they might too get more wealth.

What they didn't want was a return to center left world of benefits and unemployment with unions calling the shots.

I am a National Party supporter, I have also voted Green Party and Labour, I believe the NZ public will feel it is time for a change and will vote out the National Government in the next election

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

DonGould

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#1292255 27-Apr-2015 14:49

MikeB4: I am a National Party supporter, I have also voted Green Party and Labour, I believe the NZ public will feel it is time for a change and will vote out the National Government in the next election

Why? On what policy platform?

Remind me what labours policies are?

15% CGT?

While CGT is on the table National is in government.

Have Labour pulled that policy?

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#1292257 27-Apr-2015 14:52

DonGould:
MikeB4: I am a National Party supporter, I have also voted Green Party and Labour, I believe the NZ public will feel it is time for a change and will vote out the National Government in the next election

Why? On what policy platform?

Remind me what labours policies are?

15% CGT?

While CGT is on the table National is in government.

Have Labour pulled that policy?

I am not saying that they will vote for Labour, NZ Green and NZ First but vote against The National Party, we say it when the Norman Kirk Government was elected and again when David Lange Government was elected.

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

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#1292264 27-Apr-2015 15:19

At the end of the day, people will vote for whichever option best answers their personal issues.

I think you need a reason to change government that has to be a whole lot more important than the fact that you don't like the personality (as opposed to the competence) of the man in the 9th floor office at the Beehive. Otherwise it's like selling a very good car just because you don't like the stereo...

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#1292268 27-Apr-2015 15:21

Geektastic: At the end of the day, people will vote for whichever option best answers their personal issues.

I think you need a reason to change government that has to be a whole lot more important than the fact that you don't like the personality (as opposed to the competence) of the man in the 9th floor office at the Beehive. Otherwise it's like selling a very good car just because you don't like the stereo...

Logic and Politics seldom link together

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

Geektastic

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#1292271 27-Apr-2015 15:24

ajobbins:
Geektastic:

He's not unlike Margaret Thatcher in his polarisation. IME it usually comes down to which side of the fence you sit on. If you make your own money and do not expect the government to do more than the minimum in your life, you tend to like people like this. If you expect the government to pay you various allowances and do everything for you, you tend to dislike people like this.

There are still people in the UK foaming at the mouth over the Poll Tax introduced by Mrs T for no reason other than the fact that it actually made people pay for local government on a per capita basis, so instead of one lot of rates covering a houseful of people who therefore got subsidised by all the houses with only one or two people in, all of a sudden they had to pay their fair share - something they seemed to find objectionable for reasons I never understood. That was in 1988 and they still bang on about it.

I've voted for National and JK before, and I wouldn't rule out voting for National again in the future - but not under John Key, and not with National's current direction. I'm not a blind follower of one ideology and have seen a steady decline through the 2nd and now 3rd term of the Key government in terms of doing what is best for the nation and increased pandering to the rich, big business and foreign nations (Particularly the US).

Geektastic:
If you make your own money and do not expect the government to do more than the minimum in your life, you tend to like people like this. If you expect the government to pay you various allowances and do everything for you, you tend to dislike people like this.

This particular statement clearly spells out your particular idealogical views. In my view (as someone who makes his own money and expects the government to do the minimum in my life), I see many of the things the Key government doing as not beneficial to the country as a whole or anyone other than small (and privileged) groups. I don't live in NZ right now and pay a marginal tax rate materially higher than the highest marginal rate in NZ and I probably don't pay enough tax (And I am not dodging any). I'm smart enough recognise the value of a fair and balanced system where society as a whole benefits from a mix of socialised tax spend and incentives to work hard. Too many people are fooled by the principal that there is a direct relationship between hard work/initiative and reward. While there is a link, the power and privilege elements tend to be overlooked (or vehemently denied) to the detriment of most and benefit of few. The Key government is going in the wrong direction on this (IMO) and is why I will not vote for them.

Anyway, back on topic....

I'm perfectly happy with both power and privilege - neither are going anywhere soon and both have been with humanity in some form or another since the year dot. I have more than some and equally many have more than me. That's just how life is.

Geektastic

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#1292272 27-Apr-2015 15:25

MikeB4:
Geektastic: At the end of the day, people will vote for whichever option best answers their personal issues.

I think you need a reason to change government that has to be a whole lot more important than the fact that you don't like the personality (as opposed to the competence) of the man in the 9th floor office at the Beehive. Otherwise it's like selling a very good car just because you don't like the stereo...

Logic and Politics seldom link together

Sadly true.

jonathan18

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#1292311 27-Apr-2015 16:13

Geektastic: He's not unlike Margaret Thatcher in his polarisation. IME it usually comes down to which side of the fence you sit on. If you make your own money and do not expect the government to do more than the minimum in your life, you tend to like people like this. If you expect the government to pay you various allowances and do everything for you, you tend to dislike people like this.

There are still people in the UK foaming at the mouth over the Poll Tax introduced by Mrs T for no reason other than the fact that it actually made people pay for local government on a per capita basis, so instead of one lot of rates covering a houseful of people who therefore got subsidised by all the houses with only one or two people in, all of a sudden they had to pay their fair share - something they seemed to find objectionable for reasons I never understood. That was in 1988 and they still bang on about it.

As just one recent example

versus

"... strong commitment to ethical causes... exposure to a multitude of diverse cultures and peoples... mission to make a lasting contribution to the world by raising awareness and leveraging current affairs, and promoting the need for change..."

http://www.marcusadamsphoto.co.nz/ABOUT/1

I really can't reconcile what I read on these two sites about who is apparently the one and same person. Would the real Geektastic please stand up??!!

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#1292312 27-Apr-2015 16:14

DonGould:
MikeB4: I am a National Party supporter, I have also voted Green Party and Labour, I believe the NZ public will feel it is time for a change and will vote out the National Government in the next election

Why? On what policy platform?

Remind me what labours policies are?

15% CGT?

While CGT is on the table National is in government.

Have Labour pulled that policy?

Yep. I sent an email to labour letting them know that some of their policys were losing them votes in the last election.

I also added in compulosry super, saying some people already had arrangements so why should they be forced into a government sanctioned one.

I got reply back, which looked like a lot of work had been put into it, but it was just justifying their position, and saying their policys were the right economic thing to do.

Even if right no good if it's not the way a lot of voters see it, they can't seem to learn.

A lot of people would've been against asset sales at last election, but Labour wasn't helping themselves with the policys they were putting forward.

Also Kim dot com distraction didn't help them last election.

When next election I'd expect people to make their decision on a lot more info then just the pony tail affair.

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#1292315 27-Apr-2015 16:18

surfisup1000: Conservatives are religious and colin craig is a bit odd,

This is a misconception. The Conservatives have appeal among religious people, but they have been very clear that they are intending to be secular party. I do personally have concerns around their authoritarian approach to issues like abortion and euthanasia.

greens are absolute communists economically and the country would fail,

The Greens are a lot more moderate than they used to be but their commitment to global warming seems to clash with their intention to drive population growth through incentivising people having children. I also don't like what I consider to be the bizarre practice of politicising sexual habits.

act are impotent and a little bizarre under jamie whatshisface,

Jamie resigned after the 2014 election.

DonGould

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#1292326 27-Apr-2015 16:39

rugrat:

Yep. I sent an email to labour letting them know that some of their policys were losing them votes in the last election.

I also added in compulosry super, saying some people already had arrangements so why should they be forced into a government sanctioned one.

I got reply back, which looked like a lot of work had been put into it, but it was just justifying their position, and saying their policys were the right economic thing to do.

Even if right no good if it's not the way a lot of voters see it, they can't seem to learn.

A lot of people would've been against asset sales at last election, but Labour wasn't helping themselves with the policys they were putting forward.

Also Kim dot com distraction didn't help them last election.

When next election I'd expect people to make their decision on a lot more info then just the pony tail affair.

Most people are actually for asset sales. They're quite happy to get the stuff that the sales gave us.

In my case I got insulation and heating in my exwifes home for my son. That's a bonus for me.

I know we got rid of the power companies off the books before everyone just dived in to solar, which they are in spades.

As I see it, Labour can't go back on CGT. If they say "Ok we're listening, we won't do that" then National will just point to the back flip and draw attention to Labour not having real policy but just wanting to do the 'me too' thing, so they're stuffed.

On the super front, National is letting people use their super to buy houses for them selves. That's just a winner.

Kim Dotcom helped national get over the line and berried the left. I have no idea what was really going on in his head, but it just looked to me that he was holding himself up as a target that he must have known New Zealanders would hate and it swung vote to National. Even he said on election night that his brand was poison. (or something like that, I don't completely recall).

As for this stupid pony tail crap, who cares. If you're a woman with a pony tail don't stand next to John Key. Ok we got that message.

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#1292332 27-Apr-2015 16:56

Geektastic: At the end of the day, people will vote for whichever option best answers their personal issues.

This is NZ, you are more likely to find that recent All Blacks performance will be the election decider.

As in AB success benefits the incumbent at the time.

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