The Prime Minister and the waitress

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Geektastic

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#1292651 27-Apr-2015 22:52

ajobbins:
networkn:
This post actually made me laugh out loud. Should we wait till there is terrorism on local soil before we act? Surely you can't be serious? We are global citizens and therefore we should participate in doing what we can to remove evil where ever it is in the world.

There is plenty to be done within NZ, yet here we all are discussing for 24 pages a waitress having her hair pulled. Shows how much we really care about all the other stuff. What chance of getting solutions do the real issues have when this issue makes the first 5 pages of any newspaper.

Hows about we actually do something real about things that ARE happening in NZ right now, like the women and children who are killed every year at the hands of their partners in domestic violence incidents.

By involving ourselves in other wars we make ourselves a target.

Sadly it appears unpopular to pass a law that prevents morons from getting married and having children. Short of that I am not sure what can be done apart from build more prisons and never let those convicted out again.

Based on reports of sentences handed down for a variety of offences, my opinion is that the NZ judiciary err towards leniency far too often. When people do not fear the consequences, they have little reason not to act.

qyiet

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#1292715 28-Apr-2015 08:46

JWR:
ajobbins: John Oliver, amazing as always
https://www.facebook.com/SoHoChannel/videos/818195264935293/

...
It still doesn't look nearly as bad as piece on Tony Abbott:)

If that's our current standard we are in deep trouble.

Warning: reality may differ from above post

6FIEND

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#1292764 28-Apr-2015 10:01

sir1963:
This man does NOT need to be told, no one needs to be told. What John Key did was ALWAYS WRONG...

Here I fundamentally disagree with you.

John Key should absolutely have been told. By the waitress. The first time it occurred.

alasta:
chatterbox: Even if she was upset by this, she needed to just say CONVINCINGLY ONCE, that she didn't like it...

How can you be sure that she didn't?

The waitress, by her own testimony, tells us that she didn't. Her words:

"I didn’t address his behaviour at all"
"Despite my obvious annoyance I didn’t comment on his behaviour"
"It then happened yet again when he next visited the cafe and again I didn’t respond verbally"
"My reasoning was simple, I could tell him that I didn’t like it – but I shouldn’t HAVE to."
"I shouldn’t have to tell THE PRIME MINISTER that I don’t like it when he pulls my hair"

The salient fact here is that as soon as she asked him to stop, he stopped and apologised. But instead of saying anything, the waitress cultivated the situation - nurturing her offence for more than 6 months, letting the PM continue to believe that he was actually being amusing and that his familiarity and goofeyness were welcome.

What John Key did was idiosyncratic and rather juvenile (As I'm sure even the most up-tight of geekzone commentators can be in their time off) but it was not inherently wrong. No more so than when a stranger clasps your shoulder when you're shaking hands, or put's their arm around you for a group photo, or any of the other innocuous forms of "touching" that occur in every day life. I'm certainly not saying that people should put up with unsolicited touching like this - I'm just saying that if someone finds it uncomfortable, they should speak up. And speak up to the person concerned, rather than trying to tell enough other people that someone finally passes their message on for them...

geek4me

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#1292801 28-Apr-2015 10:48

Perhaps someone should buy The Prime Minister a Ponytail Palm plant for his office. That way when he feels the urge he can pull on its leaves and leave women's ponytails alone!

These plants are really quite attractive as plants go so they should do nicely to avoid the wrong ponytail being pulled. I'll contribute $1 to buy one for him.

surfisup1000

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#1292834 28-Apr-2015 11:18

Ahh, good old Bob Jones, putting this story in its rightful place...

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11439407

I like this bit...

"My second prediction was that the expected flow of contrived outrage from middle-age women (older ladies are more sensible), perpetual offence seekers, would bear a direct co-relationship in their venom with the authors' ugliness."

He could have added GZ'ers to his list of the outraged had he known of its existence .

andrew027

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#1292842 28-Apr-2015 11:24

JWR: I think it is very similar to what Aaron Gilmore did.

But, John Key is the Prime Minister.

...but this on the other hand...

Yes is is similar to what Gilmore did isn't it. (note the lack of question mark).

It's not similar at all.

Gilmore bullied a waiter and specifically tried to use the power of his office as a threat - something he also did in the MBIE emails. Key's actions, while certainly inappropriate and probably still classifiable as bullying behaviour, was unrelated to his position. I don't think he ever thought "I'm pulling your hair and you have to let me because I'm the Prime Minister." Going by the many examples of him doing it to younger girls that have been dug out of the video vaults since Ponytailgate started (I must have seen half a dozen by now) it seems to be some uncontrollable urge he has around ponytails, and he would have done it whether he was PM, an MP, or some mid-level public service grunt (like me), without invoking “parliamentary privilege”.

networkn

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#1292854 28-Apr-2015 11:26

andrew027:

JWR: I think it is very similar to what Aaron Gilmore did.

But, John Key is the Prime Minister.

...but this on the other hand...

Yes is is similar to what Gilmore did isn't it. (note the lack of question mark).

It's not similar at all.

Gilmore bullied a waiter and specifically tried to use the power of his office as a threat - something he also did in the MBIE emails. Key's actions, while certainly inappropriate and probably still classifiable as bullying behaviour, was unrelated to his position. I don't think he ever thought "I'm pulling your hair and you have to let me because I'm the Prime Minister." Going by the many examples of him doing it to younger girls that have been dug out of the video vaults since Ponytailgate started (I must have seen half a dozen by now) it seems to be some uncontrollable urge he has around ponytails, and he would have done it whether he was PM, an MP, or some mid-level public service grunt (like me), without invoking “parliamentary privilege”.

Well said.

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DonGould

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#1292855 28-Apr-2015 11:27

andrew027: It's not similar at all.

You raise some good points.

Thanks.

Promote New Zealand - Get yourself a .kiwi.nz domain name!!!

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networkn

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#1292857 28-Apr-2015 11:27

Key has received almost universal praise for his Anzac Day speech. Was very well delivered and heartfelt and not over the top. I was impressed.

MikeB4

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#1292858 28-Apr-2015 11:28

surfisup1000: Ahh, good old Bob Jones, putting this story in its rightful place...

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11439407

I like this bit...

"My second prediction was that the expected flow of contrived outrage from middle-age women (older ladies are more sensible), perpetual offence seekers, would bear a direct co-relationship in their venom with the authors' ugliness."

He could have added GZ'ers to his list of the outraged had he known of its existence .

Bob Jones is hardly a good reference. His track record is poor to say the least. "putting this story in its rightful place..." not even close.

Geektastic

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#1292859 28-Apr-2015 11:29

networkn: Key has received almost universal praise for his Anzac Day speech. Was very well delivered and heartfelt and not over the top. I was impressed.

Didn't see it but not surprised.

DonGould

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#1292862 28-Apr-2015 11:31

6FIEND: John Key should absolutely have been told. By the waitress. The first time it occurred.

The salient fact here is that as soon as she asked him to stop, he stopped and apologised. But instead of saying anything, the waitress cultivated the situation - nurturing her offence for more than 6 months, letting the PM continue to believe that he was actually being amusing and that his familiarity and goofeyness were welcome.

Yes you raise some good points too.

Have we put people like Key on a pedastool that we shouldn't be?

We're all New Zealanders. Have we lost our ability to simply say "I'm sorry, do you mind not touching my hair sir"?

That's the other side to all of this, is there more to this?

What's really going on?

Again I come back to our focus on this issue v's some of the other stuff in our community that's really more important isn't it?

...or is it more important?

Are we in fact quite broken when we can't just be adults with each other and view people like Key as a rock star that can't be touched? (but ironically can touch us)

Promote New Zealand - Get yourself a .kiwi.nz domain name!!!

Check out mine - i.am.a.can.do.kiwi.nz - don@i.am.a.can.do.kiwi.nz

networkn

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#1292866 28-Apr-2015 11:34

DonGould:
6FIEND: John Key should absolutely have been told. By the waitress. The first time it occurred.

The salient fact here is that as soon as she asked him to stop, he stopped and apologised. But instead of saying anything, the waitress cultivated the situation - nurturing her offence for more than 6 months, letting the PM continue to believe that he was actually being amusing and that his familiarity and goofeyness were welcome.

Yes you raise some good points too.

Have we put people like Key on a pedastool that we shouldn't be?

We're all New Zealanders. Have we lost our ability to simply say "I'm sorry, do you mind not touching my hair sir"?

That's the other side to all of this, is there more to this?

What's really going on?

Again I come back to our focus on this issue v's some of the other stuff in our community that's really more important isn't it?

...or is it more important?

Are we in fact quite broken when we can't just be adults with each other and view people like Key as a rock star that can't be touched? (but ironically can touch us)

At the risk of offending you, do you read what you write before you post it? When you read your comments do they make sense to you? I am constantly confused by what point you are trying to make.

surfisup1000

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#1292869 28-Apr-2015 11:38

MikeB4:
surfisup1000: Ahh, good old Bob Jones, putting this story in its rightful place...

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11439407

I like this bit...

"My second prediction was that the expected flow of contrived outrage from middle-age women (older ladies are more sensible), perpetual offence seekers, would bear a direct co-relationship in their venom with the authors' ugliness."

He could have added GZ'ers to his list of the outraged had he known of its existence .

Bob Jones is hardly a good reference. His track record is poor to say the least. "putting this story in its rightful place..." not even close.

Are you in the outraged people camp? I'm guessing so?

If by 'track record ' you mean un-pc behaviour then you'd be right.

surfisup1000

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#1292870 28-Apr-2015 11:39

maybe time to lock this thread too, not much new being added.

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