ADSL line speed drops off at ~5:00pm every night, then comes back around 6:00am every day

Forums › Spark New Zealand (including Skinny and BigPipe) › ADSL line speed drops off at ~5:00pm every night, then comes back around 6:00am every day

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#2472200 27-Apr-2020 16:37

Hard to tell from the public Chorus map, but at a guess there's no active ADSL cabinets around the outskirts of Oxford. There's a central core of VDSL coverage with a corresponding larger area of ADSL (on longer lines obviously). If that's the case, unlikely to be a conklin, just a very long line.

Really need to know if the sync rate and noise margin change at night. If the noise margin drop, and the sync rate goes with it, then there is some sort of interference - could even be from other lines in the same feeder at that distance. If the sync rate and noise margin remain unchanged, there's some other congestion.

Chorus have been publishing usage graphs periodically during the last few weeks - they quite clearly show the daily high demand times, and the evening is a peak when people are streaming entertainment.

snnet

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#2472203 27-Apr-2020 16:39

Linux:

@snnet Chours does not have to do anything if it's overloading on the Chorus hardware IE Conklin Cabinet

Really? If it's affecting a whole bunch of customers having no internet for 12 hours? Do they not have any service standard with ISPs? Better halve the price of the access for those customers then seeing as they can only access it half the time

Detrimental to any maintenance for those customers' access, but if they aren't going to bother making it accessible why is it ok?

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#2472210 27-Apr-2020 16:45

Hi Dominic, do you have a photo of the cabinet and tell us and code markings on it?

Cyril

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#2472213 27-Apr-2020 16:46

snnet:

Linux:

@snnet Chours does not have to do anything if it's overloading on the Chorus hardware IE Conklin Cabinet

Really? If it's affecting a whole bunch of customers having no internet for 12 hours? Do they not have any service standard with ISPs? Better halve the price of the access for those customers then seeing as they can only access it half the time

Detrimental to any maintenance for those customers' access, but if they aren't going to bother making it accessible why is it ok?

They dont lose internet, it just goes from really slow, to really really really slow. Thats unfortunately the case with copper, no speed it guarenteed and as they are the last address they would even sell it to, complaining about it would probably just result in the coverage area shrinking further and ADSL no longer being an option for the address.

Richard rich.ms

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#2472216 27-Apr-2020 16:48

sesh, that looks identical to my line before it was cabinetized after the loading coal was removed.

DM me your details, i'll give it a peak. if it's at exactly 5pm every night, sounds like some sort of a load is turning on at that time and causing interfaerance.

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#2472218 27-Apr-2020 16:49

snnet:

Linux:

@snnet Chours does not have to do anything if it's overloading on the Chorus hardware IE Conklin Cabinet

Really? If it's affecting a whole bunch of customers having no internet for 12 hours? Do they not have any service standard with ISPs? Better halve the price of the access for those customers then seeing as they can only access it half the time

Detrimental to any maintenance for those customers' access, but if they aren't going to bother making it accessible why is it ok?

@snnet I know someone that put up with this for about 10 years off an overloaded Conklin cabinet and it was only recently upgraded to VDSL and they can't get VDSL as they are about 4 - 5km from the cabinet

There is no law saying Chorus has to swap out overloaded hardware, Chorus is upgrading them where possible, No point upgrading a Conklin cabinet if you can't upgrade the back-haul to the Cabinet

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#2472219 27-Apr-2020 16:51

richms:

They dont lose internet, it just goes from really slow, to really really really slow. Thats unfortunately the case with copper, no speed it guarenteed and as they are the last address they would even sell it to, complaining about it would probably just result in the coverage area shrinking further and ADSL no longer being an option for the address.

the few conklins that still exist on BUBA (literally can count them on my fingers now..) still do have the 128kbit comitant over 5 mins required.

is why i'm kinda fearful of these cabinets that are being upgraded with 2mbit links still existing.

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snnet

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#2472231 27-Apr-2020 17:19

Linux:

@snnet I know someone that put up with this for about 10 years off an overloaded Conklin cabinet and it was only recently upgraded to VDSL and they can't get VDSL as they are about 4 - 5km from the cabinet

There is no law saying Chorus has to swap out overloaded hardware, Chorus is upgrading them where possible, No point upgrading a Conklin cabinet if you can't upgrade the back-haul to the Cabinet

I know some rural areas are awful for internet. Sorry, I must've misread before, I thought they had no service for 12 hours and many others in the area had the same problem, not just a slow down. I know there's no law saying it but I thought they may want to if a lot of customers are affected in this way - obviously a slowdown is not the same as no access at all

snnet

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#2472232 27-Apr-2020 17:21

richms:

They dont lose internet, it just goes from really slow, to really really really slow. Thats unfortunately the case with copper, no speed it guarenteed and as they are the last address they would even sell it to, complaining about it would probably just result in the coverage area shrinking further and ADSL no longer being an option for the address.

Sorry, I misread and thought it said disconnected. Some rural connections are terrible, my parents have ADSL (would be VDSL if not for the 1km driveway) at 17Mbit, (rural), around the corner maybe a 5 min drive a customer of mine is on a Conklin getting 900Kbps sync rates :x

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#2472238 27-Apr-2020 17:32

@hio77 will be able to tell if @dstove PMs his details through, but I'm not convinced this is a Conklin. The typical symptoms were d/s sync rate of 7000kb/s with a high noise margin and very low throughput. With this, sync rate seems to be consistent with throughput, and combined with the very high attenuation and basic info from Chorus, looks more like a very long line.

The fluctuating throughput with time is interesting and need to know if the sync rate/noise margin changes (so interference), or if just throughput drops (congestion).

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#2472249 27-Apr-2020 17:53

snnet:

Linux:

@snnet I know someone that put up with this for about 10 years off an overloaded Conklin cabinet and it was only recently upgraded to VDSL and they can't get VDSL as they are about 4 - 5km from the cabinet

There is no law saying Chorus has to swap out overloaded hardware, Chorus is upgrading them where possible, No point upgrading a Conklin cabinet if you can't upgrade the back-haul to the Cabinet

I know some rural areas are awful for internet. Sorry, I must've misread before, I thought they had no service for 12 hours and many others in the area had the same problem, not just a slow down. I know there's no law saying it but I thought they may want to if a lot of customers are affected in this way - obviously a slowdown is not the same as no access at all

Yes, the SLA is "best effort". No speed is guaranteed at all - but certainly a fault could still be placed to check everything.

Having said that I'm sure I remember reading somewhere that Oxford was going to get fibre - but if you're outside the township on the Plains, that's a different story.

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#2472270 27-Apr-2020 18:23

RunningMan:

Hard to tell from the public Chorus map, but at a guess there's no active ADSL cabinets around the outskirts of Oxford. There's a central core of VDSL coverage with a corresponding larger area of ADSL (on longer lines obviously). If that's the case, unlikely to be a conklin, just a very long line.

Really need to know if the sync rate and noise margin change at night. If the noise margin drop, and the sync rate goes with it, then there is some sort of interference - could even be from other lines in the same feeder at that distance. If the sync rate and noise margin remain unchanged, there's some other congestion.

Chorus have been publishing usage graphs periodically during the last few weeks - they quite clearly show the daily high demand times, and the evening is a peak when people are streaming entertainment.

Down

Rate:

942 kbs

698 kbs

Max Rate:

809 kbs

776 kbs

Noise Margin:

12.2 dB

13.4 dB

Attenuation:

63.0 dB

30.2 dB

Output Power:

15.7 dBm

12.3 dBm

Went down about 5:40, up again at 5:46pm

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#2472311 27-Apr-2020 18:39

Streetlighting maybe? If its resyncing at a lower speed, something is trashing the band and I cant think of anything else that comes on and goes off like that.

A router that can give you a spectrum might help narrow it down since if its AM radio that is usually pretty clear since the freqs line up. In either case its normally a fault on the line thats messing up the ballance of it.

As it is dropping I would push for this to be looked at as a fault.

Richard rich.ms

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#2472366 27-Apr-2020 19:06

richms:

Streetlighting maybe? If its resyncing at a lower speed, something is trashing the band and I cant think of anything else that comes on and goes off like that.

A router that can give you a spectrum might help narrow it down since if its AM radio that is usually pretty clear since the freqs line up. In either case its normally a fault on the line thats messing up the ballance of it.

As it is dropping I would push for this to be looked at as a fault.

Good thought. Not sure if it will be for me, as I don't think three are any street lights in my area, but I've put it out on the local facebook page to ask people if they can check for a connection.

Dominic

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#2472370 27-Apr-2020 19:20

That's a really interesting issue, definitely not a congestion thing though. Something is introducing a lot of noise on the line to cause it drop and resync. Is there something like an electric fence controller that comes on, or some other machinery that fires up at about the time the problem?

How do you get it to resync back at the higher rate, does it need a modem power cycle, or is it coming back by itself?

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