Spark goodwill & loyalty credit

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513 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2168608 27-Jan-2019 19:54

Jase2985:

but your not comparing apples with apples.

spark own all their infrastructure, other smaller ISP's dont they buy off others or they dont have hand overs everywhere.

there is so much more to it than just matching price of the competition.

Spark doesn't really own all their infrastructures. Chorus owns most of the landline/broadband network for one.

They own their mobile network though.

Jase2985

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#2168611 27-Jan-2019 20:03

zyo:

Jase2985:

but your not comparing apples with apples.

spark own all their infrastructure, other smaller ISP's dont they buy off others or they dont have hand overs everywhere.

there is so much more to it than just matching price of the competition.

Spark doesn't really own all their infrastructures. Chorus owns most of the landline/broadband network for one.

They own their mobile network though.

oh come on, chorus own all the copper infrastructure, and them and the other LFC's own all the fibre stuff.

look at the local exchanges and see who has what in there. at the handovers etc.

again you dont sound like you know what your talking about.

zyo

513 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2168614 27-Jan-2019 20:06

Jase2985:

zyo:

Jase2985:

but your not comparing apples with apples.

spark own all their infrastructure, other smaller ISP's dont they buy off others or they dont have hand overs everywhere.

there is so much more to it than just matching price of the competition.

Spark doesn't really own all their infrastructures. Chorus owns most of the landline/broadband network for one.

They own their mobile network though.

oh come on, chorus own all the copper infrastructure, and them and the other LFC's own all the fibre stuff.

look at the local exchanges and see who has what in there. at the handovers etc.

again you dont sound like you know what your talking about.

You are right I dont really know how the local exchanges are run but from my experience with various ufb providers I don't really see any performance differences as a normal user. Maybe you guys with your home servers etc can appreciate what Spark is doing and happy to pay for the extra services

snnet

1410 posts

Uber Geek

#2168616 27-Jan-2019 20:11

I could absolutely be totally wrong here but I thought I had read somewhere with the separation Telecom/Spark retained ownership of the exchange buildings themselves?

SBQ

104 posts

Master Geek

#2168621 27-Jan-2019 20:30

Jase2985:

but your not comparing apples with apples.

spark own all their infrastructure, other smaller ISP's dont they buy off others or they dont have hand overs everywhere.

there is so much more to it than just matching price of the competition.

Point to me where i'm wrong but the excuse Spark told me for the rise in my monthly fee is because I was on copper and that Chorus (in Christchurch) owned the lines. The fact is, Enable (that own the fiber lines in Chch) charge Spark a lower fee than Chorus does.

I think what Spark is doing to Christchurch customers is slowly flicking them off because they don't make $ off those stuck on copper. If that's the case, how can other retail providers charge a lower price for the same service? And speaking of service, what more does a customer need if the lines present no problem? (why should they if they're owned by a 3rd party)? The way I see it, Spark is just only a middle man like everyone else for Chch customers.

hio77

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Lizard Networks

#2168623 27-Jan-2019 20:39

SBQ:

Point to me where i'm wrong but the excuse Spark told me for the rise in my monthly fee is because I was on copper and that Chorus (in Christchurch) owned the lines. The fact is, Enable (that own the fiber lines in Chch) charge Spark a lower fee than Chorus does.

I think what Spark is doing to Christchurch customers is slowly flicking them off because they don't make $ off those stuck on copper. If that's the case, how can other retail providers charge a lower price for the same service? And speaking of service, what more does a customer need if the lines present no problem? (why should they if they're owned by a 3rd party)? The way I see it, Spark is just only a middle man like everyone else for Chch customers.

Chorus own the copper everywhere.

Enable have UFB in most of chch (there are parts that are still Chorus).

There is a previous thread along with articles discussing sparks reasons for raising the price on copper services.

#include <std_disclaimer>

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.

yitz

2074 posts

Uber Geek

#2168626 27-Jan-2019 20:48

They say there is more cost to manage copper connections. https://www.spark.co.nz/broadbandpricechange/

Oh and btw, there is also Flip for copper landline broadband (no faxability though). Flip operate their own unbundled MSAN network to deliver the landline component.

If Now NZ are resaleing Spark's landline with faxability and all then $81 is a very low price.

The three options for 'landline' over copper are:

RGW voice (Vodafone and 2degrees?)
Unbundled MSAN (Flip and maybe Slingshot still... Compass?)
Resale Spark PSTN

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Talkiet

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#2168632 27-Jan-2019 21:19

Thread review: Some accurate info but too much wilfully misinterpreted stuff, half truths and outright falsehoods for most people to draw any useful information.

Signal to noise ratio : 3/10 (Terrible)

Spelling and grammar : 6/10 (above average)

Godwin's Law metric : 0/10 (so far!)

Overall Threadscore: 2.5/10. Thread doesn't pay attention in class and thinks it knows best. Very very short attention span. Could try harder. Wouldn't read again.

Please note all comments are from my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.

yitz

2074 posts

Uber Geek

#2168641 27-Jan-2019 22:01

unplan sux :(

Btw @Talkiet, now that Unplan is out, what is the progress on the free goodwill loyalty upgrade to 200 Mbps for those in Chch?

tdgeek

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#2168704 28-Jan-2019 07:18

SBQ:

Jase2985:

but your not comparing apples with apples.

spark own all their infrastructure, other smaller ISP's dont they buy off others or they dont have hand overs everywhere.

there is so much more to it than just matching price of the competition.

Point to me where i'm wrong but the excuse Spark told me for the rise in my monthly fee is because I was on copper and that Chorus (in Christchurch) owned the lines. The fact is, Enable (that own the fiber lines in Chch) charge Spark a lower fee than Chorus does.

I think what Spark is doing to Christchurch customers is slowly flicking them off because they don't make $ off those stuck on copper. If that's the case, how can other retail providers charge a lower price for the same service? And speaking of service, what more does a customer need if the lines present no problem? (why should they if they're owned by a 3rd party)? The way I see it, Spark is just only a middle man like everyone else for Chch customers.

As stated on another thread, the copper increase is due to the extra support copper requires. Issues and fails are high for copper, you see threads here every other week on that. More calls in because of copper issues that have to be diagnosed and a ticket sent to Chorus. If your copper has connection issues do you call Spark and they say "sorry not our network, bye"? No

Fibre is super reliable

SBQ

104 posts

Master Geek

#2169701 29-Jan-2019 15:59

Well it seems not all is simply. Today was suppose to be day I switch over from Spark to Now! NZ (ADSL to VDSL). I plugged in a VDSL modem to find out my connection was still on ADSL. After a few phone calls I learned that Now! got a 'reject' order from Chorus (that owns the copper lines in Christchurch). Apparently Chorus has the right to reject orders from ISPs to switch IF a fiber option is available in that area. This explains why my email received an order notice from Enable (fiber lines in Christchurch). I thought I make it very clear that switching over to keep only the copper connection and maintain our telephone line setup.

Not going smoothly :( - Now will get back to me tomorrow. Not saying goodbye to Spark yet, I may have no choice.

Jase2985

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#2169706 29-Jan-2019 16:06

couple of points

that owns the copper lines in Christchurch, they own the copper lines pretty much everywhere

chorus wouldn't stop you going to VDSL because fibre is available, its highly likely that the fibre is owned by Enable, so chorus wont be making any money off you by refusing the switch. so that makes no sense.

why dont you want to go to fibre, you can do pretty much the same things on fibre as you could on copper now days.

yitz

2074 posts

Uber Geek

#2169747 29-Jan-2019 16:13

Sounds like Now NZ has a policy of ordering fibre over copper in areas where fibre is available.

SBQ

104 posts

Master Geek

#2169771 29-Jan-2019 16:40

Jase2985:

couple of points

that owns the copper lines in Christchurch, they own the copper lines pretty much everywhere

chorus wouldn't stop you going to VDSL because fibre is available, its highly likely that the fibre is owned by Enable, so chorus wont be making any money off you by refusing the switch. so that makes no sense.

why dont you want to go to fibre, you can do pretty much the same things on fibre as you could on copper now days.

Sorry I don't follow. Yes most of the fiber lines in Chch are owned by Enable. There are a few pockets of fiber owned by Chorus but I don't understand the motivation for Chorus to deny existing customer a switch over if it brings them revenue? Wouldn't forcing customers to go fiber is a loss for Chorus?

My reasons for not going to fiber is the shoddy installation work Enable would do. The fiber connection point is the longest distance on our section - say about 30+ meters and while I had attempts in the past to get a drop in fiber (I had trenched half of the distance for a driveway), they refused to do the drop in time. It was clear the installers (who were appointed to me) were lazy because they didn't want to go underground. I even offered to make the install easier by drilling my own hole in the concrete foot paths around my house so they can blow a line in and the guy didn't seem I could do it.

I recall my neighbour having his fiber installed and they literally butchered up his concrete pathway and did a shoddy patch job on mixing new concrete to path up the cuts.

Yes Fiber is the future and I know it's only a matter of time i'll have to switch. But at the moment, my home alarm system works on copper fine, likewise with my faxability (sorry I can't tell my customers to "Get with the times" and stop sending faxes, many even refuse to do online DC bank payments and prefer chq writing for business).

It is strange that Now didn't consult with me before putting in a fiber installation order with Enable. I had to call Enable up to see what's going on and have cancelled the order.

hio77

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Lizard Networks

#2169815 29-Jan-2019 18:10

SBQ:

After a few phone calls I learned that Now! got a 'reject' order from Chorus (that owns the copper lines in Christchurch). Apparently Chorus has the right to reject orders from ISPs to switch IF a fiber option is available in that area.

Highly doubt this is the case.

Chorus have not started any withdrawal of services. It's certainly on the cards but a long way ahead.

As far as your transaction is concerned, Now has ordered fibre.

the chorus connection would be untouched, with a fibre order logged.

If now have tried to do a copper while you wait option, then you may find the reject actually relates to the information they supplied for the port.

overall, you seem to have a unique tech requirement... a Fax line. Have you considered a Fax to Email service as a bridge for that gap?

in many cases, fax works fine over fibre, there are some situations where it doesn't though.

Your welcome to stay with spark too.. just sayin` ;)

#include <std_disclaimer>

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.

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