Is it legal for parking wardens to mark car tyres with chalk?

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frednz

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#198150 28-Jun-2016 13:32

I know this is rather trivial, but I'm interested to know whether city councils and private car park owners have the legal right to put large chalk marks on the tyres of parked cars?

I realise they do this so that they can later check up on which cars are "overstayers", but these marks sometimes take a while to disappear and I don't see why (in this case Countdown) has the right to deface my nicely recently blacked tyres!

Also, do I have the right to remove the chalk mark and leave my car in the car park on the grounds that I did not authorise anyone to play around with my car and put marks on it?

Why can't wardens just take photographs of the parked cars or write down the registration numbers on a piece of paper along with the current time?

Thanks

Fred

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#1581940 28-Jun-2016 13:42

Are they putting the marks on the sidewall of the tyre?

Normally they mark the tread, which wears off as soon as you drive it.

And, of course you have the right to remove the chalk, but you don't have the right to overstay the park (the terms of which you implicity agreed to when you parked there). They cannot 'fine' you for doing so, but they can recover their losses (including an admin fee) for you overstaying the agreed time. Usually if they have marked you, they are also probably still in the carpark (sitting in a parked car?) watching. I have been pinged at a Westfield park for 'Not being there as a customer' - and I wasn't - I was there doing work in a store in a Westfield and the guy saw me hop out of the car and go in the loading door of a store in the same carpark.

richms

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#1581943 28-Jun-2016 13:44

trig42:

Are they putting the marks on the sidewall of the tyre?

Normally they mark the tread, which wears off as soon as you drive it.

And, of course you have the right to remove the chalk, but you don't have the right to overstay the park (the terms of which you implicity agreed to when you parked there). They cannot 'fine' you for doing so, but they can recover their losses (including an admin fee) for you overstaying the agreed time. Usually if they have marked you, they are also probably still in the carpark (sitting in a parked car?) watching. I have been pinged at a Westfield park for 'Not being there as a customer' - and I wasn't - I was there doing work in a store in a Westfield and the guy saw me hop out of the car and go in the loading door of a store in the same carpark.

I hope you added that onto the bill for the place you were working for in that case.

Richard rich.ms

trig42

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#1581948 28-Jun-2016 13:47

richms:

trig42:

Are they putting the marks on the sidewall of the tyre?

Normally they mark the tread, which wears off as soon as you drive it.

And, of course you have the right to remove the chalk, but you don't have the right to overstay the park (the terms of which you implicity agreed to when you parked there). They cannot 'fine' you for doing so, but they can recover their losses (including an admin fee) for you overstaying the agreed time. Usually if they have marked you, they are also probably still in the carpark (sitting in a parked car?) watching. I have been pinged at a Westfield park for 'Not being there as a customer' - and I wasn't - I was there doing work in a store in a Westfield and the guy saw me hop out of the car and go in the loading door of a store in the same carpark.

I hope you added that onto the bill for the place you were working for in that case.

No, work did pay it though. I didn't even see the signs, but they were there. I have been back to that centre a couple of times since for work and always park in the same place, but just go into the store via the mall rather than the loading bay now.

wellygary

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#1581976 28-Jun-2016 13:53

Under our legal system pretty much anything is legal, until it is illegal,

I am fairly sure there is no statute/regulation that specifically allows tyre chalking but you would have to find some Statute/regulation that it is a violation of..

I think taking a claim for damage or loss would get laughed out of court or the disputes tribunal...

in short there is nothing to stop them doing it, but you are well within your rights to rub it off....

frednz

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#1581977 28-Jun-2016 13:54

trig42:

Are they putting the marks on the sidewall of the tyre?

Normally they mark the tread, which wears off as soon as you drive it.

And, of course you have the right to remove the chalk, but you don't have the right to overstay the park (the terms of which you implicity agreed to when you parked there). They cannot 'fine' you for doing so, but they can recover their losses (including an admin fee) for you overstaying the agreed time. Usually if they have marked you, they are also probably still in the carpark (sitting in a parked car?) watching. I have been pinged at a Westfield park for 'Not being there as a customer' - and I wasn't - I was there doing work in a store in a Westfield and the guy saw me hop out of the car and go in the loading door of a store in the same carpark.

Thanks for your reply. In my case, the chalk marks have usually been put on the top part of the tyre and not the sidewall. I guess it would be more annoying if they marked the sidewalls!

Fred

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#1582002 28-Jun-2016 13:58

Him outdoors reckons it's interfering with a motor vehicle, which is illegal.
Same goes for putting flyers under wipers.

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richms

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#1582006 28-Jun-2016 14:02

Things under the wipers really annoy me. Especially when you dont notice because its passanger side and you are already in the car. I usually just hit the wiper switch so they fall off onto the ground in that case.

Richard rich.ms

mattwnz

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#1582008 28-Jun-2016 14:07

Is putting a chalk mark on a cars tyre causing it damage? I don't think it would be any more damaging that someone putting an leaflet under a windscreen wiper.

frednz

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#1582019 28-Jun-2016 14:22

I think the point is whether or not someone is interfering with your car without your permission. For example if a bunch of kids sit on the bonnet and roof of your car and put jammy fingerprints all over it, they may not damage your car but they cause a clean up nuisance which must be against some law or other?
Fred

Satch

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#1582025 28-Jun-2016 14:27

mattwnz:

Is putting a chalk mark on a cars tyre causing it damage? I don't think it would be any more damaging that someone putting an leaflet under a windscreen wiper.

Is it any different to writing something on the side of someones car with lipstick? Also not damaging but it is defacing someone's property. I admit though that this is a pretty extreme comparison but the principle must surely be the same?

davidcole

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#1582027 28-Jun-2016 14:32

Don't worry, when the Wellington Parking trial is complete and it's rolled out anywhere, there's no need to chalk a car....as they know what park you are in and when you're paid until.

Next step is you'll have to display your license and they'll send an infringement right out to your address.

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wellygary

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#1582042 28-Jun-2016 14:42

frednz: I think the point is whether or not someone is interfering with your car without your permission. For example if a bunch of kids sit on the bonnet and roof of your car and put jammy fingerprints all over it, they may not damage your car but they cause a clean up nuisance which must be against some law or other?
Fred

The problem with that is "interfering with a motor vehicle" is not a solitary offence, it can only be enacted in cases where "conversion" or a motor vehicle is attempted, ( and it must be dishonest interfering to boot)

So someone sitting on a car with no intent to take it is not interfering with a motor vehicle under the Crimes act- If they damage it that is another matter... but "interfering" is not what most people would assume...

Crimes act 1961

226 Conversion of vehicle or other conveyance

(1) Every one is liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 7 years who, dishonestly and without claim of right, but not so as to be guilty of theft, takes or uses for his or her own purposes or another person’s purposes—

(a) any vehicle, ship, or aircraft; or (b) any part of any vehicle, ship, or aircraft; or (c) any horse.

(2) Every one is liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 2 years who attempts to commit the offence in subsection (1) or who, dishonestly and without claim of right, interferes with, or gets into or upon, any vehicle, ship, or aircraft.

MikeAqua

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#1582060 28-Jun-2016 15:02

I despise car spammers. One tried to put a leaflet on the Pajero over the weekend while I was in it waiting for someone

A Pajero has 4 high volume windscreen washers

richms:

Things under the wipers really annoy me. Especially when you dont notice because its passanger side and you are already in the car. I usually just hit the wiper switch so they fall off onto the ground in that case.

Mike

mattwnz

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#1582071 28-Jun-2016 15:14

Satch:

mattwnz:

Is putting a chalk mark on a cars tyre causing it damage? I don't think it would be any more damaging that someone putting an leaflet under a windscreen wiper.

Is it any different to writing something on the side of someones car with lipstick? Also not damaging but it is defacing someone's property. I admit though that this is a pretty extreme comparison but the principle must surely be the same?

There is quite a difference to any reasonable person judging the difference. CHalk causes no damage, isn't noticeable, and will disappear by itself after a short time. If however it does cause damage, that maybe a different story. I beleive one of the conditions of parking in a certain area, maybe that you do agree for parking wardens to carry out their tasks. Maybe it is on the terms when you enter a parking area, or in the councils own rules.

JonnyCam

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#1582075 28-Jun-2016 15:19

Doesn't interfering involve some type of intent (such as trying door handles to gain access to unlocked cars)

Even if the law is not clear, you would still need some police willing to enforce on that, which I think is unlikely. The chalk disappears after 1 or 2 tyre rotations anyway.

To the OP: How can the tyre black stay on the tread for more than a 10 second journey? (unless as stated above, they apply to the sidewall, which defeats the purpose of chalking, which is to ensure you move out a park when you are supposed to)

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