CGA. Is it fair?

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#1112125 20-Aug-2014 14:55

BTR: In my opinion I find that a 1 year warranty on a cell phone or computer is long enough and if you want to extend the warranty you should have to pay for it.

Average warranty without taking CGA into account.

$2000 Laptop = 1 Year

Going by what I have said I think a 1 warranty for most devices is perfectly fine however I am interested to know everyone else's thoughts.

So you think a laptop only lasting 365 days is ok, and you don't mind replacing it yearly if it fails just out of warranty? Part of the problem is that is is cost prohibitive to get many things repaired now, and the parts and labour can often cost more than a new appliance. Also you don't mind that parts may not be available?
If the CGA didn't exist, then retailers could get away with imported lower quality of goods, and manufactures could reduce the quality of goods so they don't last as long. It would also be terrible for the environment, as more product would end up in the landfill.
We also also talking here about higher priced goods that may only have a 12 month warranty, but you would expect to last 10 years, such as washing machines, cookers, dishwashers, which can range in price from 1k-10k. The higher value stuff at the moent I beleive does get better CGA coverage though, as the CGA is based on the value of the goods, so lower value goods may not be expected to last as long as higher value ones.

I think the CGA is fine as it is, it neither favours the consumer nor the retailer, if it is being applied properly. The problem is that NZers knowledge on it is poor, and they will pull out the CGA ticket for everything, including damage they caused, when it wouldn't be covered.

mattwnz

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#1112126 20-Aug-2014 15:02

networkn:

A few years ago retailers may have tried to take the mickey, but these days by in large I think it's actually the other way around.

That is part of the problem, some retailers got people to buy extended warranties when they were already covered by the CGA, and potentially mislead consumers on their legal rights under the CGA. I have come across retailers who have done this myself from what they verbally told me, so it was reasonably widespread I believe prior to more recently changes. It is better now than it was. But if the CGA was being applied properly there shouldn't be any problems. A retailer should also contest it if they beleive they are in the right. Many do contest them. If they fold, then that is their problem. I don't believe saying it is going to take too much time to contest it is an excuse, it is more being lazy. If it went to the DT, then more often than not the right decision will be made. If they can show to the consumer that they have already been to the DT on something very similar and won, then the consumer will probably agree that they can't take it any further. Part of the problem is the lack of precedents.

shk292

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#1112146 20-Aug-2014 15:16

The CGA is one of the few reasons to buy from a local retailer rather than amazon.com etc
So, loss or reduction of CGA would be very damaging to local retailers - be careful what you wish for

sxz

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#1112149 20-Aug-2014 15:20

shk292: The CGA is one of the few reasons to buy from a local retailer rather than amazon.com etc
So, loss or reduction of CGA would be very damaging to local retailers - be careful what you wish for

Your +1 button is missing! This is a very good answer - 100% agreed.

All my gadgets would come from Amazon(etc.) if it weren't for the CGA.

Edit: upon refresh your +1 button is back. Consider yourself +1'd

JWR

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#1112162 20-Aug-2014 15:33

I think the CGA has been a really good thing. It was often a major hassle to get warranties honored.

As soon as the act came out, I went and got a copy of it and I still have it.

I see it is dated 1993. So it has been around for a while now.

mattwnz

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#1112166 20-Aug-2014 15:41

JWR:
I think the CGA has been a really good thing. It was often a major hassle to get warranties honored.

As soon as the act came out, I went and got a copy of it and I still have it.

I see it is dated 1993. So it has been around for a while now.

It's been amended since then I believe with updates.

dclegg

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#1112170 20-Aug-2014 15:46

shk292: The CGA is one of the few reasons to buy from a local retailer rather than amazon.com etc
So, loss or reduction of CGA would be very damaging to local retailers - be careful what you wish for

Indeed. Its a risk I took recently, and one where the cards did not fall in my favour (see my thread here).

And that incident hints at exactly why we need the CGA for locally purchased goods. Its just one instance in a growing trend I've noticed of goods being constructed with lessening levels of quality. Its the third incident in a year I've had with quality issues in what I'd expect to be reasonably constructed products, considering their price points. In addition to this issue on a turntable which I've only been using since the end of last year, I also have:-

A PS4 purchased in February which has a recurring 'auto disc eject' issue. Once the console is in this state, it no longer accepts discs. I'm waiting for it to recur again (it seems to happen every month or so) so I can take video footage as proof to get it repaired or replaced under warranty. Its a reasonably widely reported issue online, and can be resolved by powering down the console (which also makes it very difficult to demonstrate the issue).

A iPhone 5s purchased in March which has a Home button that feels to be of dubious quality. While it always works, it will occasionally click twice when I press it down. My wife purchased a 5s at the same time, and hers doesn't suffer from this. Her Home button also feels a lot more robust when you do click it. Its not something I feel I can do much about, as the button does still function. It just makes the button mechanism occasionally feel cheap and nasty when using it, and has me wondering if it will eventually fail. Although on this one my judgement may be clouded by the fact that it was replacing an iPhone 4 that suffered the widely reported failing Home button. So I'm a little bit paranoid about this one eventually failing too.

Samsung

Shop now on Samsung phones, tablets, TVs and more (affiliate link).

bazzer

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#1112172 20-Aug-2014 15:50

KiwiNZ: If there is a premium I paid it as well. I paid for you as well.

Not really (unless I also needed a repair on my iMac, which I don't). The "premium" you paid doesn't begin to cover the cost of your repair. That cost is covered by all the people that paid the "premium" and didn't need the repair, and they didn't have a choice about it. Is that fair?

Edit: I should add that I am generally in favour of the CGA and use it to its full whenever required. It's obvious that if you've had something repaired under CGA that wouldn't have been covered by warranty usually that you'd be pro-CGA but that doesn't make it "fair", necessarily.

Talkiet

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#1112177 20-Aug-2014 15:53

bazzer:
KiwiNZ: If there is a premium I paid it as well. I paid for you as well.

Not really (unless I also needed a repair on my iMac, which I don't). The "premium" you paid doesn't begin to cover the cost of your repair. That cost is covered by all the people that paid the "premium" and didn't need the repair, and they didn't have a choice about it. Is that fair?

Well, that's just what insurance, rates and taxes are...

Cheers - N

Please note all comments are from my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.

shk292

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#1112179 20-Aug-2014 15:54

sxz:
shk292: The CGA is one of the few reasons to buy from a local retailer rather than amazon.com etc
So, loss or reduction of CGA would be very damaging to local retailers - be careful what you wish for

Your +1 button is missing! This is a very good answer - 100% agreed.

All my gadgets would come from Amazon(etc.) if it weren't for the CGA.

Edit: upon refresh your +1 button is back. Consider yourself +1'd

Thanks

A good example for me is waterproof underwater cameras. Reading the reviews, a small %age always fails in normal use, and I would rather have the "fit for purpose, normal use" argument in a real shop with a real person in the event of failure than have to send a camera back to Amazon and be told the failure was my fault. So in this case, I pay the extra 20% and buy locally. But, for simpler things less likely to fail I'll use Amazon etc

bazzer

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#1112182 20-Aug-2014 16:01

Talkiet:
bazzer:
KiwiNZ: If there is a premium I paid it as well. I paid for you as well.

Not really (unless I also needed a repair on my iMac, which I don't). The "premium" you paid doesn't begin to cover the cost of your repair. That cost is covered by all the people that paid the "premium" and didn't need the repair, and they didn't have a choice about it. Is that fair?

Well, that's just what insurance, rates and taxes are...

That's kinda my point, at least we have a choice about some of those. That's just my interpretation of what the OP was asking. Otherwise, of course the CGA is fair. What's not fair about getting the retailer to replace the junk they sell you when it breaks?

Geektastic

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#1112183 20-Aug-2014 16:06

dclegg:
shk292: The CGA is one of the few reasons to buy from a local retailer rather than amazon.com etc
So, loss or reduction of CGA would be very damaging to local retailers - be careful what you wish for

Indeed. Its a risk I took recently, and one where the cards did not fall in my favour (see my thread here).

And that incident hints at exactly why we need the CGA for locally purchased goods. Its just one instance in a growing trend I've noticed of goods being constructed with lessening levels of quality. Its the third incident in a year I've had with quality issues in what I'd expect to be reasonably constructed products, considering their price points. In addition to this issue on a turntable which I've only been using since the end of last year, I also have:-

A PS4 purchased in February which has a recurring 'auto disc eject' issue. Once the console is in this state, it no longer accepts discs. I'm waiting for it to recur again (it seems to happen every month or so) so I can take video footage as proof to get it repaired or replaced under warranty. Its a reasonably widely reported issue online, and can be resolved by powering down the console (which also makes it very difficult to demonstrate the issue).

A iPhone 5s purchased in March which has a Home button that feels to be of dubious quality. While it always works, it will occasionally click twice when I press it down. My wife purchased a 5s at the same time, and hers doesn't suffer from this. Her Home button also feels a lot more robust when you do click it. Its not something I feel I can do much about, as the button does still function. It just makes the button mechanism occasionally feel cheap and nasty when using it, and has me wondering if it will eventually fail. Although on this one my judgement may be clouded by the fact that it was replacing an iPhone 4 that suffered the widely reported failing Home button. So I'm a little bit paranoid about this one eventually failing too.

Manufacturers who offer international warranties are always at the top of my list when choosing products and all else being equal will get the business.

I don't give a hoot about retailers: customers are always paramount because they hold all the power. If a retailer decides it can't cope and folds, they will be replaced pretty fast in most markets. Retailers must respond to customer requirements overall or they will not trade - the customer will go elsewhere.

What amazes me more is that, unlike say the USA, very few NZ retailers ever use customer service/warranty to differentiate themselves from their competitors. It's rare to see a retailer offer MORE than the CGA requires them to offer. They will shout loudly about low prices (quite literally sometimes - Big Save, I am looking at you!) but rarely try to compete on service by saying in effect 'no we are not the cheapest - but we offer X,Y and Z benefits that our competitors do not'.

Jase2985

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#1112184 20-Aug-2014 16:07

heres a good example of why the we need the CGA

there are 2 different house holds
the first is a married couple
the second is a married couple with 4 kids under 5

they both buy the same washing machine from the same shop. the first couple do 2 loads of washing a week, the second couple is doing a load a day and 2 ion a saturday. the second couple is using their machine 4x as much as the first couple yet the manufactures warranty only covers both couples for 2 years. the likely hood of the first couples machine failing in the warranty period is very very low. where as the second couple have a higher probability as they do 4x the amount of washing.

same deal with the laptop thing, some people use it every day others use it on the odd occasion. the more you use something the higher the chance it will fail.

notice its use that generally causes things to fail, not time :) hence why the CGA is good as it states the item should last a reasonable amount of time with reasonable use.

Talkiet

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#1112185 20-Aug-2014 16:12

Geektastic: [snip]
What amazes me more is that, unlike say the USA, very few NZ retailers ever use customer service/warranty to differentiate themselves from their competitors. It's rare to see a retailer offer MORE than the CGA requires them to offer. They will shout loudly about low prices (quite literally sometimes - Big Save, I am looking at you!) but rarely try to compete on service by saying in effect 'no we are not the cheapest - but we offer X,Y and Z benefits that our competitors do not'.

Because New Zealanders don't care about service, they want the lowest price. I am generalising, but on average, this is pretty damn close to spot on.

Oh, except that we expect top line service and support in addition to the lowest prices.

I know there are individuals that this doesn't apply to, but individuals do not a business case make.

Cheers - N

Please note all comments are from my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.

JWR

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#1112216 20-Aug-2014 16:39

Talkiet:
Geektastic: [snip]
What amazes me more is that, unlike say the USA, very few NZ retailers ever use customer service/warranty to differentiate themselves from their competitors. It's rare to see a retailer offer MORE than the CGA requires them to offer. They will shout loudly about low prices (quite literally sometimes - Big Save, I am looking at you!) but rarely try to compete on service by saying in effect 'no we are not the cheapest - but we offer X,Y and Z benefits that our competitors do not'.

Because New Zealanders don't care about service, they want the lowest price. I am generalising, but on average, this is pretty damn close to spot on.

Oh, except that we expect top line service and support in addition to the lowest prices.

I know there are individuals that this doesn't apply to, but individuals do not a business case make.

Cheers - N

I think its is more complicated that that.

Historically, we have paid very high prices here. There still a few things that are much higher priced in NZ.

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