Slightly different CGA query

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#1484196 3-Feb-2016 10:31

Jase2985:

but the goods are not faulty, and how often would an oven liner fail?

what's happened is unfortunate but I don't see how it would be a CGA issue

The reason it may be a CGA issue is because of the part of the act I quoted, which stated that spare parts should be available for a reasonable period. This is in direct conflict to what the manufacturer told us.

Consider someone who doesn't have insurance (which luckily we do have). Is it reasonable to expect them to have to pay $2100 to replace an oven, when it could be fixed for $400 - $600 if the part was available? Looking at the construction of the oven, it definitely looks like it was designed to come out. And the manufacturer stated to us that the reason it can't be replaced is because they don't keep that part in stock, not that it is not a serviceable part.

dclegg

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#1484198 3-Feb-2016 10:34

networkn:

Right, the thing I was denoting however, is unintended negative long term effects of "fixing" it. Acid/scratching etc, to get the foil off, may not affect the oven for a while, but eventually it might.

Yeah, that's weighing at the back of my mind. I really want to make sure we do the right thing here. And at this stage it is looking quite likely that this will indeed involve having to replace the entire oven.

As an aside: When we rang our landlord, she was more worried that we wouldn't have an oven to cook with for a while, than the damage to the oven. So it's lucky we have a pretty good relationship with her. It is at her request that we're investigating repair after the manufacturer told us it couldn't be done. We had actually initiated steps towards a full replacement with our insurer yesterday.

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#1484201 3-Feb-2016 10:39

dclegg:

networkn:

Right, the thing I was denoting however, is unintended negative long term effects of "fixing" it. Acid/scratching etc, to get the foil off, may not affect the oven for a while, but eventually it might.

Yeah, that's weighing at the back of my mind. I really want to make sure we do the right thing here. And at this stage it is looking quite likely that this will indeed involve having to replace the entire oven.

As an aside: When we rang our landlord, she was more worried that we wouldn't have an oven to cook with for a while, than the damage to the oven. So it's lucky we have a pretty good relationship with her. It is at her request that we're investigating repair after the manufacturer told us it couldn't be done. We had actually initiated steps towards a full replacement with our insurer yesterday.

Sounds like a great relationship. You sound like an excellent tenant!

dclegg

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#1484213 3-Feb-2016 10:40

networkn:

Sounds like a great relationship. You sound like an excellent tenant!

A bit of background: We're only renting because our house is being reclad (it's a leaky home). So we're keenly aware of how important one's largest asset is. We are doing all we can to ensure we can protect hers.

Jase2985

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#1484217 3-Feb-2016 10:45

yes spare parts of things that are likely to fail/need replacing. do they have to keep a stock of spare frames for the oven? new beziels etc?

they don't have to keep EVERY part in stock

all im saying is how often would an oven liner need to be replaced? almost never, so its unlikely they would carry spares

"The manufacturer can contract out of this guarantee by letting you know at the time of purchase that repair facilities and spare parts are not available"

dclegg

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#1484222 3-Feb-2016 10:52

Jase2985:

all im saying is how often would an oven liner need to be replaced? almost never, so its unlikely they would carry spares

I'd actually dispute that. Based on one of the repairers I spoke to this morning, our mistake is one that is commonly made.

As I said earlier, it's a habit that has been ingrained in many for years. My wife didn't even give it a second thought. Ironically she was trying to save the oven from damage from baked on food. That kinda backfired :-)

MikeAqua

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#1484232 3-Feb-2016 11:06

Over cleaner (NaOH) usually attacks aluminium foil. And we know oven cleaner is safe to use in an oven. My chem is little rusty (excuse the pun) but you should end up with sodium aluminate which is water soluble (I.e. washes off)

Ventilate well, it should produce hydrogen gas as byproduct - but so will coke via an acid + metal reaction.

Mike

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mrdrifter

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#1484264 3-Feb-2016 12:01

Your understanding of the CGA is correct, I have been in the same position, replacement parts should be available for a reasonable period for new products sold within New Zealand, the replacements parts themselves don't necessarily need to be stored locally, but the manufacturer/distributor should be able to order parts in. This (as I'm sure you appreciate) doesn't mean the replacement parts will be free, just hope the liner doesn't also cost $2100! :-)

andrewNZ

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#1484280 3-Feb-2016 12:21

Im not convinced the liner should be available as a spare. It probably depends on the construction of the oven.

andrew027

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#1484291 3-Feb-2016 12:43

IANAL, but in my opinion there is a CGA issue here.

I would think that every part should be available as a spare, unless the manufacturer/retailer has specifically contracted out of this by stating it at the time of purchase, and you have agreed by completing the purchase.

Some parts of an oven might be expected to fail more often (e.g. interior light bulbs, rubber door seals...) and some parts less often (elements, door glass, fan motors...) and some parts not at all (oven liner...) but there is always the possibility of damage to any part, either due to issues during manufacturing, or through user error or some unforeseen circumstances. If it's user error then the repair might not be covered by warranty, so you have to fork out for the total cost of parts and labour, but you should still be able to get a repair. If the manufacturer can't do this then I think it does contravene the clause from the CGA.

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#1484301 3-Feb-2016 13:04

When you called the company was it just a CS rep you spoke to? It is possible that they have just looked to see a list of parts and yours wasn't on there.

Maybe you can try to speak to the sales manager, ask if they can get the part from overseas, if it can be taken from a faulty item that have had returned (I used to do this all the time, if we had a switchboard that had a cracked base and a customer needed the front cover I'd give it to them)

If none of those work ask them what they make of the CGA section on parts, it may be resolved quicker that way.

I apologise if I am assuming you didn't do above but you have.

dclegg

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#1484303 3-Feb-2016 13:07

dickytim:

When you called the company was it just a CS rep you spoke to? It is possible that they have just looked to see a list of parts and yours wasn't on there.

Maybe you can try to speak to the sales manager, ask if they can get the part from overseas, if it can be taken from a faulty item that have had returned (I used to do this all the time, if we had a switchboard that had a cracked base and a customer needed the front cover I'd give it to them)

If none of those work ask them what they make of the CGA section on parts, it may be resolved quicker that way.

I apologise if I am assuming you didn't do above but you have.

All good suggestions. My wife actually made the call. She was brushed off pretty quickly, and none of the above was raised. She was actually unaware of what the CGA might provide in this context.

MurrayM

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#1484319 3-Feb-2016 13:28

If you hand it over to your insurance company then won't your insurance company deal with Westinghouse to arrange the repair / replacement? I'm pretty sure your insurance company will know the CGA inside-out and if they think they can get the repair cheaper by insisting that the liner be replaced then they'll do everything they can to save themselves some money!

dclegg

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#1484333 3-Feb-2016 13:41

MurrayM:

If you hand it over to your insurance company then won't your insurance company deal with Westinghouse to arrange the repair / replacement? I'm pretty sure your insurance company will know the CGA inside-out and if they think they can get the repair cheaper by insisting that the liner be replaced then they'll do everything they can to save themselves some money!

Yeah, thats a thought that occurred to me today too. The only difference was that if repair was an option, it may have been attractive to do that outside of insurance. Especially if it would impact our no claims bonus.

SATTV

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#1484362 3-Feb-2016 14:18

In this case the CGA does not apply, you did not purchase the oven.

The supplier of the oven, probably has never supplied this as a spare part and has never been asked to supply it as a spare part, the other side of the coin is that it may cost more than a new oven as a spare part. I doubt that Ford or GM have a Chassis as a spare part or that Panasonic have a new case for their DVD players etc.

Often spare parts are made by a different company as they can have a different part number to the production part number, this is one of the reasons that parts can cost more.

As for cleaning the aluminium foil , you could always try stewed Rhubarb, preferably with the leaf as the Oxalic acid is a very good cleaner, excellent for rust, copper bottom pots or when you have boiled the pot dry.

Stew the Rhubarb down and put over the aluminium foil and leave overnight hopefully it will come right off.

You could always fill a roasting dish with hot water and put the oven on say 180, get it hot a steamy and hopefully it will come off.

John

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