Huawei ... spying on us or not ?

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2566 posts

Uber Geek

#601904 29-Mar-2012 13:30

surfisup1000:

Whats to stop <x> incorporating a remotely programmable control chips into their gear? This could be accessed via cryptographic keys.

(Where <x> is Cisco/Juniper/any other corporation/country + the NSA)

FTFY

hangon

397 posts

Ultimate Geek

#601914 29-Mar-2012 13:43

Not so much a chinese mega-corp as they are the Chinese Government.

I'd tend to believe the Aussies and the US experts over the under resourced kiwis.

Whats to stop Huawei incorporating a remotely programmable control chips into their gear? This could be accessed via cryptographic keys.

China is still a communist country. If the experts are saying this is a risk then who am I to differ?

Too many armchair experts in this country.

"Experts"... to me they are influenced by lobby groups.

"remotely programmable control chips" - any evidence?

"China is still a communist country" - yeah right like no one allowed to own any assets or run companies... funny anything big is considered the "Government". Pengxin is Chinese government, Huawei is Chinese government, heck even Foxconn is Chinese government? There are "remotely programmable control chips" in your IPADs!

"Huawei spying on us or not?" How can you spy on encrypted traffic between the server and the client using some "remotely programmable control chips"? And how about willingly or unwillingly being spied by facebook or Google on a daily basis?

Many countries including USA, Ozie and China are spying on their civilians and rest of the world, either government agencies, or enterprises. Using unsupported suspicion to rule out a competitor is an entirely different story.

surfisup1000

5288 posts

Uber Geek

#601941 29-Mar-2012 14:40

hangon:
"Experts"... to me they are influenced by lobby groups.

I doubt a lobby group could influence national defense such that sovereign security is breached.

"remotely programmable control chips" - any evidence?

Ummm... I am writing this on a computer than can be controlled remotely ha ha.

hangon:
"China is still a communist country" - yeah right like no one allowed to own any assets or run companies... funny anything big is considered the "Government". Pengxin is Chinese government, Huawei is Chinese government, heck even Foxconn is Chinese government? There are "remotely programmable control chips" in your IPADs!

Remember Tienanmen square? The chinese state uses it's power to execute dissenters. You'd be naive to think the Chinese govt do not wield some influence over strategic chinese companies.

The Chinese are not likely interested in your iPad pics. Rather, they would be interested in the closer NZ/AU/US defence ties and interception of information flowing between them.

"Huawei spying on us or not?" How can you spy on encrypted traffic between the server and the client using some "remotely programmable control chips"?

Heard of code breakers? On top of that, plenty of sensitive data has not been encrypted in the past, and it is likely to occur in future too.

Many countries including USA, Ozie and China are spying on their civilians and rest of the world, either government agencies, or enterprises. Using unsupported suspicion to rule out a competitor is an entirely different story.

Nonsense. It is the US / Aus govt ruling out Huawei for national defense reasons. This is not related to a competitor.

Wob

310 posts

Ultimate Geek

NBN Co

#601946 29-Mar-2012 14:45

I read a really good well-balanced article on this yesterday, can't find it now though...

The upshot was that the Aus government didn't really have a choice with regard to telling Huawei not to bid for NBN contract, compliments of the USA government.

The US government have always had concerns about Huawei (typical paranoid behaviour), and as such have a policy (I'm not sure whether it's mandated or not) against the manufacturing giant.

Because of the relationship between the two governments (Aus and US) if Australia was to endorse Huawei as an equipment supplier for the NBN it would be a bit of a slap in the face to our US allies.

It's not like Huawei haven't got a strong presence in Aus (and NZ) anyway, and they will still continue to win work due to their competitive pricing and incentives to telcos.

I tend to agree with many of you; I'd be more worried about the Aus, US (and even NZ) spying on us than I would be about Huawei.

Now based in Perth WA.

hangon

397 posts

Ultimate Geek

#601951 29-Mar-2012 14:55

I doubt a lobby group could influence national defense such that sovereign security is breached.

you would be very surprised.

langers1972

1039 posts

Uber Geek

#601952 29-Mar-2012 14:57

I'd be much more worried about the US government than China/Huawei.

I'm afraid there are all sorts of things going on in the modern world that we probably are better off not knowing about.

surfisup1000

5288 posts

Uber Geek

#601960 29-Mar-2012 15:12

langers1972: I'd be much more worried about the US government than China/Huawei.

I'm afraid there are all sorts of things going on in the modern world that we probably are better off not knowing about.

You prefer governments that murder political dissenters and shut down free speech do you?

You are happy to post your preference for a communist government yet if we had a communist government your ability to post your views would be seriously curtailed.

I do find the anti-american sentiment that runs within many New Zealanders puzzling.

Quic Broadband

Move to New Zealand's best fibre broadband service (affiliate link). Note that to use Quic Broadband you must be comfortable with configuring your own router.

ajw

1932 posts

Uber Geek

#601971 29-Mar-2012 15:23

johnr:
old3eyes:
johnr: Over reaction

?

Agreed. ?I think the Greens saw a press release out of Australia and jumped on the band wagon..

Well that answers that the Green party has gone down the tubes!

To try and justify their menial jobs.

vinnieg

2260 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#601983 29-Mar-2012 15:39

surfisup1000:
I do find the anti-american sentiment that runs within many New Zealanders puzzling.

You don't think it's to do with any previous matters, or the amount of situations where the US has almost bullied NZ into complying with it? Or for that matter, making us join in their pointless wars?

I have moved across the ditch. Now residing in Melbourne as a VOIP/Video Technical Trainer/Engineer.

kiwitrc

4123 posts

Uber Geek
Inactive user

#601985 29-Mar-2012 15:42

surfisup1000:
langers1972: I'd be much more worried about the US government than China/Huawei.

I'm afraid there are all sorts of things going on in the modern world that we probably are better off not knowing about.

You prefer governments that murder political dissenters and shut down free speech do you?

You are happy to post your preference for a communist government yet if we had a communist government your ability to post your views would be seriously curtailed.

I do find the anti-american sentiment that runs within many New Zealanders puzzling.

I didnt really want to get into this, except to say dont confuse anti American with Anti American Government ( or any Govt for the that matter).

I was in Vietnam a couple years ago and was getting a really anti US war lecture during a visit to a military museum, so I asked the guide if they still hated Americans, he replied they never hated Americans, just their government.

Linuxluver

5828 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Subscriber

#602018 29-Mar-2012 16:25

Mark: So what is the opinion around here about Huawei ? Anyone think they build spyware into their products ? Or is it just a case of them being a chinese mega corporation that has painted them with the "evil" brush ?

Me personally ... I think given the chance the chinese government would love to engineer in backdoors and spyware to products going out to the foreigners! :-) Just not sure yet if they have.

Pretty much anyone based in the US providing top-tier network services must allow the US government to spy on their networks. That has been going on for years...and at least a decade illegally before the US Patriot Act made it legal to spy on Americans. It has always been legal to spy on foreigners. That's us.

Blackberry ran into trouble in the Middle East and Central Asia because a few governments there had not yet gained access to their network for purposes of surveillance.

The new CIA Director, General Petraeus (late of Afghanistan) has said in recent days that smart phones make it easy to eavesdrop on device users as the mics can be remotely activated for serrepticious listening.

If Huawei weren't, in some way, allowing access to the Chinese government it would indicate the Chinese have more respect for personal privacy than the US, UK or New Zealand.

That isn't likely.

I'm afraid we have to assume that any and perhaps all governments can spy on us if they want.

The lesson here is that as long as you're a good peasant and don't attract attention to yourself....you'll be just fine. But should the "Eye of Sauron" be drawn to you.....then throw away your phones, sleep in garages and pay cash for everything.....wearing a hoodie.

_____________________________________________________________________

I've been on Geekzone over 16 years..... Time flies....

Linuxluver

5828 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Subscriber

#602024 29-Mar-2012 16:33

surfisup1000:
langers1972: I'd be much more worried about the US government than China/Huawei.

I'm afraid there are all sorts of things going on in the modern world that we probably are better off not knowing about.

You prefer governments that murder political dissenters and shut down free speech do you?

You are happy to post your preference for a communist government yet if we had a communist government your ability to post your views would be seriously curtailed.

I do find the anti-american sentiment that runs within many New Zealanders puzzling.

The US shut down free speech quite effectively with a recent law making it a felony to protest at federal buildings...or to conspire to protest at federal buildings. You don't even have to attend. Jail for you.

China isn't communist any more by any sensible definition. It's devolved into a corporatist / fascist state. The US is approaching the same destination from the other direction.

I don't think anyone here is "anti-American". But many of us will be pro-democracy, pro-free speech and pro-justice. In recent years the US government (as opposed to "America") hasn't measured up in those areas: Abu Graibh, lying to invade Iraq, crashing the global financial system through bad law on finance and even worse regulation.....etc...etc. Stuff the average American is just as much a victim of as anyone....especially as it is all done in their name.

I have a lot of sympathy for Americans. I hope they regain control of the country and make it a democracy one day. The situation today - where 98% of House incumbents are re-elected each two years from heavily gerrymandered districts - has hurt the United States hugely as democracy is effectively dead.

_____________________________________________________________________

I've been on Geekzone over 16 years..... Time flies....

tangent

14 posts

Geek

#602139 29-Mar-2012 19:54

This is just typical U.S. Government Status Quo behaviour....

Everything and anything that threatens their markets or control of information will always have its own "WMD", "Terrorist" or be a "Copyright Infringer"..In this case they are labelling it as espionage/spying.

And don't assume that everyone is an armchair critic, there are people who use this site who are involved in LI as well as deployment Huawei solutions...... Basically.... ANYTHING the U.S. Government says...ever......Always ask yourself how it serves them...find your balance.

Here is my balance - I do happen to know that Huawei outright refuse to disclose the full list of AT Commands for their devices...which does kind of lead me to believe there is an element of "something" they are hiding. (every other mobile adapter or cellphone manufacturer has no problem disclosing their AT set.)

surfisup1000

5288 posts

Uber Geek

#602146 29-Mar-2012 20:01

kiwitrc:
surfisup1000:
langers1972: I'd be much more worried about the US government than China/Huawei.

I'm afraid there are all sorts of things going on in the modern world that we probably are better off not knowing about.

You prefer governments that murder political dissenters and shut down free speech do you?

You are happy to post your preference for a communist government yet if we had a communist government your ability to post your views would be seriously curtailed.

I do find the anti-american sentiment that runs within many New Zealanders puzzling.

I didnt really want to get into this, except to say dont confuse anti American with Anti American Government ( or any Govt for the that matter).

I was in Vietnam a couple years ago and was getting a really anti US war lecture during a visit to a military museum, so I asked the guide if they still hated Americans, he replied they never hated Americans, just their government.

So, who votes in the government? Just saying.

tangent

14 posts

Geek

#602156 29-Mar-2012 20:06

Nonsense. It is the US / Aus govt ruling out Huawei for national defense reasons. This is not related to a competitor.

In this case, same diff....?

Defence reasons/Competition are one in the same.........you think this whole Kim.com thing is not part of a defence strategy?

America are broadly defending their MARKETS in a military-like offensive.... Its one in the same.......

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