Child support rant.

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#1253774 9-Mar-2015 10:17

Using the calculator linked above, the $300 amount looks like a non-shared care situation where the non-carer has no children living with them, no partner and looks after the children for < 40% of the time (potentially 0% of the time) IMHO, under these circumstances, my gut feel is that sounds about right... (EDIT: Actually it sounds low to me if I do some quick back-of-napkin calculations on my own kids and our circumstances - but then as others have pointed out above: regional differences)

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#1253783 9-Mar-2015 10:22

Have you ever thought of doing a private agreement where you sit down with your ex and work out the real costs and divide it half write up a contract and both sign it send a copy to IRD and hey presto no more IRD based child support

tdgeek

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#1253802 9-Mar-2015 10:27

Athlonite: Have you ever thought of doing a private agreement where you sit down with your ex and work out the real costs and divide it half write up a contract and both sign it send a copy to IRD and hey presto no more IRD based child support

That can and does happen. Aside from itemising costs to any nth degree. But its often not possible, due to reasons that I wont delve into

MikeB4

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#1253807 9-Mar-2015 10:31

Athlonite: Have you ever thought of doing a private agreement where you sit down with your ex and work out the real costs and divide it half write up a contract and both sign it send a copy to IRD and hey presto no more IRD based child support

If the custodial parent is in receipt of Income Support and you want a private agreement it must be at least that which the Child Support Agency would assess. Voluntary agreements must be approved by the Child Support Agency.

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

Geektastic

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#1253813 9-Mar-2015 10:34

tdgeek:
Geektastic: OOI what guarantee is there that the person receiving the support is paying an equal amount?

It seems likely to me that they could just use the $300 or whatever it is to fund the child and none of their own money? Or not even use the $300 for the child?

Say the mother is on DPB. She doesn't get child support paid by the father, the Govt does. Now, say it costs $600 per week to raise a child as per this thread. Father pays half, leaving the mum to foot the other $300 per week. The child doesnt have to pay rent, be clothed or fed as much as the Mumn or have as many incidentals, so you would then expect the cost of the Mum's living to exceed the child, which is clearly the case. Does she then recieve a DPB based on well over $600 per week for herself, plus the $300 that she will contribute to the $600 per week she will be spending on the child?

Sure, a stretch of numbers, or is it? Costs of a child will vary and you cannot include already existing costs. Its complex. But the Mum gets a low DPB, and pays that supposed $300 per week herself plus rent, food for herself, power for the house, and so on, doesnt add up.

There needs to be fair way, no idea what that could be. It needs to eb based on a fair cost, and not on what anyone earns.

I don't know anything about DPB - I have never met anyone who gets benefits - but $600 a week seems like a lot for benefits when 40 hours on $12/hr or whatever minimum wage is comes to $480 gross..!

MikeB4

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#1253819 9-Mar-2015 10:43

Geektastic:

I don't know anything about DPB - I have never met anyone who gets benefits - but $600 a week seems like a lot for benefits when 40 hours on $12/hr or whatever minimum wage is comes to $480 gross..!

You probably have met folks on Income Support they don't usually wear badges stating they do ;P

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

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Geektastic

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#1253834 9-Mar-2015 10:50

KiwiNZ:
Geektastic:

I don't know anything about DPB - I have never met anyone who gets benefits - but $600 a week seems like a lot for benefits when 40 hours on $12/hr or whatever minimum wage is comes to $480 gross..!

You probably have met folks on Income Support they don't usually wear badges stating they do ;P

I suppose it's possible. Where would I meet them?

tdgeek

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#1253838 9-Mar-2015 10:53

Geektastic:
tdgeek:
Geektastic: OOI what guarantee is there that the person receiving the support is paying an equal amount?

It seems likely to me that they could just use the $300 or whatever it is to fund the child and none of their own money? Or not even use the $300 for the child?

Say the mother is on DPB. She doesn't get child support paid by the father, the Govt does. Now, say it costs $600 per week to raise a child as per this thread. Father pays half, leaving the mum to foot the other $300 per week. The child doesnt have to pay rent, be clothed or fed as much as the Mumn or have as many incidentals, so you would then expect the cost of the Mum's living to exceed the child, which is clearly the case. Does she then recieve a DPB based on well over $600 per week for herself, plus the $300 that she will contribute to the $600 per week she will be spending on the child?

Sure, a stretch of numbers, or is it? Costs of a child will vary and you cannot include already existing costs. Its complex. But the Mum gets a low DPB, and pays that supposed $300 per week herself plus rent, food for herself, power for the house, and so on, doesnt add up.

There needs to be fair way, no idea what that could be. It needs to eb based on a fair cost, and not on what anyone earns.

I don't know anything about DPB - I have never met anyone who gets benefits - but $600 a week seems like a lot for benefits when 40 hours on $12/hr or whatever minimum wage is comes to $480 gross..!

Thats my point. The numbers dont work. If a child is $600 per week, how much does it cost me to live? $1800 per week? My wide another $1800 per week? My 16yo dauighter, another $600 per week? Having to come up with a formula is ok, but it seems to me to be well out of reality. Makes a solo mum a worthwhile career, and that phrase has been alive in this country sibce the year dot

MikeB4

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#1253839 9-Mar-2015 10:53

Geektastic:
KiwiNZ:
Geektastic:

I don't know anything about DPB - I have never met anyone who gets benefits - but $600 a week seems like a lot for benefits when 40 hours on $12/hr or whatever minimum wage is comes to $480 gross..!

You probably have met folks on Income Support they don't usually wear badges stating they do ;P

I suppose it's possible. Where would I meet them?

I think there are secret meetings at the Wairarapa Stone Henge :)

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

jonathan18

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#1253846 9-Mar-2015 11:01

Geektastic: I don't know anything about DPB - I have never met anyone who gets benefits - but $600 a week seems like a lot for benefits when 40 hours on $12/hr or whatever minimum wage is comes to $480 gross..!

Never miss a chance to prove the quality of your provenance and those in the circles you mix with! Luckily, there are people like me who didn't receive a private school education and have received social security benefits during times of need to help you understand what life may be like for the great unwashed.

It will be rare for someone receiving the minimum wage ($13.75, going up to $14.25 from 1 April) to be solely receiving this amount. First, many minimum wage jobs are not 40 hour s a week - many people in these sectors paying minimum wage will be having to work more than one job and/or may be not making it to a 'full-time equivalent'. Some will be on casual 'on-call' agreements, adding even more to financial instability and insecurity.

And a majority of low-income households will be receiving some level of financial help from the Government - paid for (sarcasm alert) by that Communist state-sanctioned theft from "us" (wealthy and deserving folk who work hard) and redistributed to "them" (the lazy bludgers who really should get a job and learn how to keep it in their collective pants).

This is particularly the case for those with children, and can include:

* the minimum family tax credit
* families tax credit
* in-work tax credit
* Accommodation Supplement (or income-related rents for those in HNZ houses)
* other social security payments such as Childcare Subsidy, Disability Alowance...

networkn

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#1253848 9-Mar-2015 11:04

jonathan time to get off your soapbox, bottom line is as someone pointed out, that as a student you get $175 a week, why is it supposed that at 18 you only need $175 but at 13 you need $300+?

I'd like someone who thinks a kid needs more than $300 a WEEK to tell me what they are spending that $300 on?

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Geese

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#1253851 9-Mar-2015 11:08

Geektastic: Where would I meet them?

Right here. I'm a soul boy - I'm a dole boy -
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Geese

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#1253855 9-Mar-2015 11:11

jonathan18: the minimum wage ($13.75, going up to $14.25 from 1 April)

It is $14.25 now, going up to $14.75 on 1 April.

MikeB4

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#1253861 9-Mar-2015 11:14

networkn: jonathan time to get off your soapbox, bottom line is as someone pointed out, that as a student you get $175 a week, why is it supposed that at 18 you only need $175 but at 13 you need $300+?

I'd like someone who thinks a kid needs more than $300 a WEEK to tell me what they are spending that $300 on?

You are not taking into account all the costs of raising a child.

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

networkn

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#1253867 9-Mar-2015 11:17

KiwiNZ:
networkn: jonathan time to get off your soapbox, bottom line is as someone pointed out, that as a student you get $175 a week, why is it supposed that at 18 you only need $175 but at 13 you need $300+?

I'd like someone who thinks a kid needs more than $300 a WEEK to tell me what they are spending that $300 on?

You are not taking into account all the costs of raising a child.

Well given I took two of my sisters teenagers in and have 2 kids of my own (though they are very young right now), I think I have a reasonable idea).

Obviously people can choose to raise their kids to different standards, and my kids don't bath in caviar twice a day are aren't feed lobster for school lunches, but I'd struggle to see >$300 a week in reasonable expenses personally.

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