Careless Driving

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SepticSceptic

2190 posts

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#855806 15-Jul-2013 13:00

If things were slightly different, and the motorcyclist suffered a serious injury, or disability, or even death, would the law enforcement look deeper into the cause of the accident and perhaps find the cyclist more culpable ? ( lane splitting)

bigal_nz

635 posts

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#855859 15-Jul-2013 14:03

This is a case of contributory negligence.

An example of contributory negligence would be where a car "A" fails to give way to car "B" - car A is at fault, but lets say car B was only driving with park lights on, or perhaps it was speeding.

The driver of car A will of course cry foul, and say the driver of car B "contributed" to the accident via his speed, or only park lights or whatever.

This is "contributory negligence". In civil cases blame can be apportioned, but not in criminal.

There is NZ case law (both High Court Judgements - Police v Jacobsen 1994, HC; Dobson v Geddes 1993, HC; for example) which state that contributory negligence is NOT a defence.

Relating back to your case, yeah the cyclist or motorbike or whatever undertook the van, which contributed to the accident, but as outlined above it appears this is not a defence.

If you both committed an offence, both getting a ticket is still an option....

bazzer

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#855911 15-Jul-2013 15:21

I know many people who have had the exact same accident at that location. Sometimes the vehicle turning in has been given a ticket, sometimes the vehicle making an extra lane has been ticketed. I've never been able to figure out any logic.

RunningMan

8955 posts

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#855995 15-Jul-2013 16:58

Ratez:
I have a question out of curiosity, does this mean a motorcycle can only pass on the left if the lane is available? Wouldn't the van make the lane unavailable?

http://www.legislation.govt.nz/regulation/public/2004/0427/40.0/DLM303043.html

Having difficulty with the cut and paste, but the link above will help with what is unavailable.

Ratez

72 posts

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#856010 15-Jul-2013 17:08

Im sorry to admit this but its like morse code to me. Thanks for taking the time to find it. Will read it further when I get home.

pctek

807 posts

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#856205 16-Jul-2013 05:55

You can let it go to court. Take your drawing and show the judge, you may or may not win.

The bike did come from the left.....which is something he shouldn't do......but....

bigal_nz

635 posts

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#856212 16-Jul-2013 06:53

pctek: You can let it go to court. Take your drawing and show the judge, you may or may not win.

The bike did come from the left.....which is something he shouldn't do......but....

As pointed out, that the bike was passing on the left is not a defence, but would be considered mitigating.

You might get a reduction in fine, but they will add on court costs ($130) if you loose, so even if you get a fine reduction you still pay more.

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dickytim

2514 posts

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#856217 16-Jul-2013 07:24

joker97: there are 2 issues here

1) unfortunately you were in the wrong legally as the cyclist was going straight hence had the right of way. however if the cyclist was in fact speeding past and overtaking the van on the left and knew you were coming, you could say in terms of common sense he was wrong.

2) every one of us would probably have made the turn given the circumstance. I guess defensive driving principles would say do not go if you can't see what's coming behind the van - you did not have line of sight, better safe and sorry. but yes, in the heat of the moment, most of us would have made the turn, including some of those who claim they wouldn't have.

lesson learnt.

I feel for the OP as I can hand on heart say I would have gone in this situation.

I do believe the motor cyclist was in the wrong as he was undertaking, but the cops obviously decided that he didn't deserve a fine, I wish they would as it is getting nuts where I work with motor cyclists cutting in and out of lanes and cutting off motorists.

Mark

1653 posts

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#856232 16-Jul-2013 08:08

dickytim:

I do believe the motor cyclist was in the wrong as he was undertaking, but the cops obviously decided that he didn't deserve a fine, I wish they would as it is getting nuts where I work with motor cyclists cutting in and out of lanes and cutting off motorists.

But filtering and lane splitting in and out of cars to get through the queues is part of the fun of being on a bike! Why else would people get them ? To sit and stare at tail lights and suck in exhaust fumes for 10% of their day ? :-)

Ratez

72 posts

Master Geek

#857766 16-Jul-2013 23:16

Hi all,

Great news for me. The police in charge of my case is dropping all fines and deemed that I am not at fault. I just received the phone call after he spoke to a guru. Thank god, I was wondering who was phoning me at near midnight but am glad to pick it up.

DravidDavid

1907 posts

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#857782 16-Jul-2013 23:45

Wow! Great news!

insane

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#857801 17-Jul-2013 00:43

Ratez: Hi all,

Great news for me. The police in charge of my case is dropping all fines and deemed that I am not at fault. I just received the phone call after he spoke to a guru. Thank god, I was wondering who was phoning me at near midnight but am glad to pick it up.

I wonder if the guru consulted the fountain of knowledge [geekzone] for the answer :p

keewee01

1737 posts

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#857870 17-Jul-2013 08:50

Awesome news, and a great outcome!!

You can sleep again now

Batman

Mad Scientist
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#857872 17-Jul-2013 08:51

Ratez: Hi all,

Great news for me. The police in charge of my case is dropping all fines and deemed that I am not at fault. I just received the phone call after he spoke to a guru. Thank god, I was wondering who was phoning me at near midnight but am glad to pick it up.

wow that should put some faith back in some people about the police ... but imagine if he didn't bother consulting a guru and called it as he saw it

Ratez

72 posts

Master Geek

#857874 17-Jul-2013 08:53

joker97:
Ratez: Hi all,

Great news for me. The police in charge of my case is dropping all fines and deemed that I am not at fault. I just received the phone call after he spoke to a guru. Thank god, I was wondering who was phoning me at near midnight but am glad to pick it up.

wow that should put some faith back in some people about the police ... but imagine if he didn't bother consulting a guru and called it as he saw it

Thanks all! I agree. I wonder what made him consult someone after mailing out my offense? Maybe the guru is a geekzone user haha.

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