Greens' Proposed restrictions in Kiwi Saver?

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Hmm, what to write...
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#1614730 20-Aug-2016 09:25

Fred99:

Lias:

dafman:

Geektastic:

Lias:

There needs to be a law against political correctness.

My Kiwisaver provider could be run by North Korea or ISIL for all I care as long as it returns a decent profit.

+1

A question for both of you. Are you happy to invest in a cluster bomb manufacturer as long as it returns a decent profit?

Can't speak for geektastic, but I'm fairly okay with it.

Too bad if it was your own kids blown to pieces eh?

That's okay huh - can probably buy replacements using the profit?

Well since none of the countries that make or use cluster bombs actually signed up to the treaty, (incusing the USA) I'm not losing any sleep about it

Matthew

Fred99

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#1614748 20-Aug-2016 09:49

mdooher:

Fred99:

Lias:

dafman:

Geektastic:

Lias:

There needs to be a law against political correctness.

My Kiwisaver provider could be run by North Korea or ISIL for all I care as long as it returns a decent profit.

+1

A question for both of you. Are you happy to invest in a cluster bomb manufacturer as long as it returns a decent profit?

Can't speak for geektastic, but I'm fairly okay with it.

Too bad if it was your own kids blown to pieces eh?

That's okay huh - can probably buy replacements using the profit?

Well since none of the countries that make or use cluster bombs actually signed up to the treaty, (incusing the USA) I'm not losing any sleep about it

So by your logic (or lack of) you wouldn't lose sleep if someone was going to break down a door and murder your neighbours, unless the murderer had signed up to an agreement that they wouldn't do that?

Linuxluver

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#1614764 20-Aug-2016 10:13

mdooher:

Well since none of the countries that make or use cluster bombs actually signed up to the treaty, (incusing the USA) I'm not losing any sleep about it

It's illegal in NZ.

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gzt

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#1614771 20-Aug-2016 10:31

mdooher:
Fred99:

Lias:

dafman:

Geektastic:

Lias:

There needs to be a law against political correctness.

My Kiwisaver provider could be run by North Korea or ISIL for all I care as long as it returns a decent profit.

+1

A question for both of you. Are you happy to invest in a cluster bomb manufacturer as long as it returns a decent profit?

Can't speak for geektastic, but I'm fairly okay with it.

Too bad if it was your own kids blown to pieces eh?

That's okay huh - can probably buy replacements using the profit?

Well since none of the countries that make or use cluster bombs actually signed up to the treaty, (incusing the USA) I'm not losing any sleep about it

This is incorrect. The UK is a massive arms supplier. The UK used to manufacture cluster weapons. The UK signed up. The UK no longer manufactures cluster weapons. Win.

Rikkitic

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#1614773 20-Aug-2016 10:32

Sometimes I really wish Geekzone allowed rating posts with -1. There are a couple here that have certainly earned it.

Apart from that, I wish the Greens bashers would grow up and get over themselves. I am not a Greens supporter, mainly because I distrust their eagerness to micro-manage everyone's lives. But this smug assertion that everything they say and do is by definition somehow wrong is just stupid. I have voted for the Greens in the past as the least worst option and I will probably do so again in the future. I don't like all their ideas but at least they represent progressive thinking and that is something this country badly needs more of.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

gzt

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#1614775 20-Aug-2016 10:45

In other news, cluster munitions continue to rain down on the people of Yemen.

Those used were manufactured by the UK, USA, and Brazil.

https://www.amnesty.org.uk/press-releases/saudi-arabia-led-coalition-has-used-uk-manufactured-cluster-bombs-yemen-new-evidence

UK ceased manufacture a while back so these are a previous Saudi purchase. USA although not a signatory came under pressure and agreed to halt supply to Saudi Arabia. I presume Brazil continues manufacture and supply.

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mdooher

Hmm, what to write...
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#1614776 20-Aug-2016 10:45

The whole objection to cluster bombs is that some of them don't go off and so, like landmines, they lie around until someone (a child) picks them up and shakes them.

I would be all for putting more money into research in to making cluster bombs more reliable and efficient. Then change the treaty/law to make it illegal to use non certified cluster bombs.

Matthew

dafman

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#1614778 20-Aug-2016 10:51

mdooher:

The whole objection to cluster bombs is that some of them don't go off and so, like landmines, they lie around until someone (a child) picks them up and shakes them.

I would be all for putting more money into research in to making cluster bombs more reliable and efficient. Then change the treaty/law to make it illegal to use non certified cluster bombs.

The whole objection is cluster bombs.

gzt

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#1614779 20-Aug-2016 10:53

mdooher:
The whole objection to cluster bombs is that some of them don't go off and so, like landmines, they lie around until someone (a child) picks them up and shakes them.

I would be all for putting more money into research in to making cluster bombs more reliable and efficient. Then change the treaty/law to make it illegal to use non certified cluster bombs.

A standard was promoted and legislated by USA for failure and use.

The American cluster bombs used in Yemen were designed to meet those standards apparently. They do not even meet those standards.

Transfer of further cluster munitions from USA to Saudi Arabia was quietly blocked by the executive (apparently).

http://foreignpolicy.com/2016/05/27/exclusive-white-house-blocks-transfer-of-cluster-bombs-to-saudi-arabia/

freitasm

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#1614780 20-Aug-2016 10:55

Rikkitic:

Sometimes I really wish Geekzone allowed rating posts with -1. There are a couple here that have certainly earned it.

Apart from that, I wish the Greens bashers would grow up and get over themselves. I am not a Greens supporter, mainly because I distrust their eagerness to micro-manage everyone's lives. But this smug assertion that everything they say and do is by definition somehow wrong is just stupid. I have voted for the Greens in the past as the least worst option and I will probably do so again in the future. I don't like all their ideas but at least they represent progressive thinking and that is something this country badly needs more of.

And we won't have -1 (at least it's my position now) because that would easily and quickly allow for greater bullying - anonymous people who down vote others, in a group. No thanks.

Otherwise we should fight on ideas. And while this is not personal - you folks are on a fine line but at the moment this discussion is basically about the ideas, that's fine. Don't make personal folks because then someone gets angry, posts things and gets banned.

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dafman

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#1614784 20-Aug-2016 11:07

I'll vote with my feet on this one. My superannuation provider was named in the press story. I have asked them to advise if any of my investments are in funds that invest in companies making cluster bombs and anti-personnel mines. I will be changing providers if the answer is yes.

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freitasm

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#1614786 20-Aug-2016 11:34

I have registered interest in a new non-profit fund provider that is a about to launch. Will keep you folks posted.

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#1614837 20-Aug-2016 15:23

The problem with this is where does it stop? Today, cluster bombs and nuclear weapons (the latter I have no problem with BTW but that's another subject), and tobacco. Tomorrow alcohol. Next week sugary drinks? Then meat? Then oil? Then cars?

The problem is if you divest from everything the Green Part doesn't like, you have a very small investment base

mdooher

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#1614849 20-Aug-2016 16:30

dafman:

mdooher:

The whole objection to cluster bombs is that some of them don't go off and so, like landmines, they lie around until someone (a child) picks them up and shakes them.

I would be all for putting more money into research in to making cluster bombs more reliable and efficient. Then change the treaty/law to make it illegal to use non certified cluster bombs.

The whole objection is cluster bombs.

Why? are they somehow worse than Hellfire missiles, fuel air bombs, and Napalm?

Matthew

Fred99

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#1614852 20-Aug-2016 16:41

mdooher:

dafman:

mdooher:

The whole objection to cluster bombs is that some of them don't go off and so, like landmines, they lie around until someone (a child) picks them up and shakes them.

I would be all for putting more money into research in to making cluster bombs more reliable and efficient. Then change the treaty/law to make it illegal to use non certified cluster bombs.

The whole objection is cluster bombs.

Why? are they somehow worse than Hellfire missiles, fuel air bombs, and Napalm?

Yes.

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