Are you better or worse off?

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#548699 23-Nov-2011 01:15

linuxluver: good points

networkn: I don't see you put forward any arguments to counter them. i'm quite keen to see if you really have any facts to share with us or debate those points

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#548761 23-Nov-2011 09:37

nakedmolerat: linuxluver: good points

networkn: I don't see you put forward any arguments to counter them. i'm quite keen to see if you really have any facts to share with us or debate those points

Because this thread is on a completely different topic to that and this isn't the place to discuss them.

I have also been involved and read other debates with this particular person, and I don't see any productive point in entering a discussion because he doesn't have an open mind. There was nothing in the tone of his post to suggest he would reasonably consider a different point of view. His mind is made up.

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#548770 23-Nov-2011 09:57

networkn:
nakedmolerat: linuxluver: good points

networkn: I don't see you put forward any arguments to counter them. i'm quite keen to see if you really have any facts to share with us or debate those points

Because this thread is on a completely different topic to that and this isn't the place to discuss them.

I have also been involved and read other debates with this particular person, and I don't see any productive point in entering a discussion because he doesn't have an open mind. There was nothing in the tone of his post to suggest he would reasonably consider a different point of view. His mind is made up.

Yes, he is a known MMP activist so like with most activists there is no point whatsoever in engaging with him.

crackrdbycracku

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#548779 23-Nov-2011 10:13

Linuxluver: This government isn't worth voting for. Here are some reasons:

1. They cut taxes claiming it was affordable. It wasn't. They either lied or were incompetent.

et al...

Dude, I respect your point of view,and your right to i,t but if you look at this thread you are the first person to name a party and put up an argument as to vote for or against.

Secondly a lot of what you say is subjective at best:

6. They have lied about the efficacy of the CBD rail loop in Auckland with Min. Steven Joyce cooking the books on how many cars it would remove from the roads to make the rail loop look like a poor investment. His numbers were SO bad they were obviously fictional.

The number of cars a CBD rail loop will take off the road is an estimate at best, maybe just 'made up'; worst it's an agenda driven estimate. Mark Twain: lies, damn lies and stats.

Your commentary on this number is bound to your ideological agenda. CrackedByCracku: Those who deny their ideological agenda are bound to be ruled by it.

I really like trains by the way.

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#548790 23-Nov-2011 10:24

crackrdbycracku: I really like trains by the way. ?

I have an ideological agenda. I know how to keep the trains running on time.

oxnsox

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#548793 23-Nov-2011 10:27

Re the MMP referendum.
It was my understanding that this was always going to happen sometime downstream of having made the change to it.
At the time we voted in MMP the MP's put the ability to change back, by saying there would be a referendum on it at a future date. Or did we have that one already and I was not in the country???

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#548820 23-Nov-2011 11:03

crackrdbycracku:
Linuxluver: This government isn't worth voting for. Here are some reasons:

1. They cut taxes claiming it was affordable. It wasn't. They either lied or were incompetent.

et al...

Dude, I respect your point of view,and your right to i,t but if you look at this thread you are the first person to name a party and put up an argument as to vote for or against.

Secondly a lot of what you say is subjective at best:

6. They have lied about the efficacy of the CBD rail loop in Auckland with Min. Steven Joyce cooking the books on how many cars it would remove from the roads to make the rail loop look like a poor investment. His numbers were SO bad they were obviously fictional.

The number of cars a CBD rail loop will take off the road is an estimate at best, maybe just 'made up'; worst it's an agenda driven estimate. Mark Twain: lies, damn lies and stats.

Your commentary on this number is bound to your ideological agenda. CrackedByCracku: Those who deny their ideological agenda are bound to be ruled by it.

I really like trains by the way.

You put that more eloquently than I would have, but I agree, subjective at best.

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#548872 23-Nov-2011 12:35

networkn:
nakedmolerat: linuxluver: good points

networkn: I don't see you put forward any arguments to counter them. i'm quite keen to see if you really have any facts to share with us or debate those points

Because this thread is on a completely different topic to that and this isn't the place to discuss them.

I have also been involved and read other debates with this particular person, and I don't see any productive point in entering a discussion because he doesn't have an open mind. There was nothing in the tone of his post to suggest he would reasonably consider a different point of view. His mind is made up.

Well said and because of that i won't reply to him. Did so on his blog but see my post somehow dissappeared.

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#548917 23-Nov-2011 14:39

tardtasticx:
Everyone's vote makes a difference believe it or not, It takes what, 10minutes to vote? I think everyone who can vote, should vote. Like they say, if you don't vote, no one cares about your opinion. Haha

There is nobody to vote for this election. I'm voting based on who will damage the country the least not which party I like the most.

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#549025 23-Nov-2011 19:26

oxnsox: Re the MMP referendum.
It was my understanding that this was always going to happen sometime downstream of having made the change to it.
At the time we voted in MMP the MP's put the ability to change back, by saying there would be a referendum on it at a future date. Or did we have that one already and I was not in the country???

It amazed me the prospect that he would complain about losing his vote (and the fact that evil National was responsible), and the ruin of democracy when a referendum is the exact opposite of that, and you would only lose your "vote" if more than 50% of the country also wanted it.

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#549027 23-Nov-2011 19:28

rphenix:
tardtasticx:
Everyone's vote makes a difference believe it or not, It takes what, 10minutes to vote? I think everyone who can vote, should vote. Like they say, if you don't vote, no one cares about your opinion. Haha

There is nobody to vote for this election. I'm voting based on who will damage the country the least not which party I like the most.

I can understand your point, but I think it's being a little harsh to say there isn't anyone decent to vote for, give credit where credit is due, it's been an exceptional 3 years to be in Government, I certainly would not have wanted to be PM

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#550118 25-Nov-2011 21:51

How would anyone know their vote isn't that one vote that counts? That's why I vote.
I am definitely worse off being a blue collar worker, my industry is always the first to suffer.

alexx

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#550134 25-Nov-2011 23:26

I'm better off - having the government borrow (and put up GST) to pay for my tax cut has probably been good for me in the short term at least.

I'm not sure that that those policies will be so good for my teenage/young adult children as they enter the workforce... but that wasn't the question asked in this thread.

Regarding migration to Australia... this is something National raised while in opposition so it is natural that people will judge them on that basis.

What can be done regarding the economy? There probably needs to be a move to a capital gains tax or other broadening of the tax base to encouraging productive investment (as opposed to speculation). So part marks to National for the changes regarding depreciation losses against investment properties, but more needs to be done.

#include <standard.disclaimer>

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#550458 26-Nov-2011 22:58

How funny, just what was being talked about here:

http://www.electionresults.govt.nz/electoratestatus.html

Christchurch Central 100.0% (counted) BURNS, Brendon (LAB) WAGNER, Nicky (NAT) 0 (margin)

So looks like a single vote could have made all the difference!!

Lurch

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#550906 28-Nov-2011 12:27

Worse off and it has been each year for a long time now. Food has gone up, Petrol has gone up, Electricity has gone up, Insurance has gone up, car registration has gone up... Tyre's have gone up, rates have gone up, rent has gone up and there are many more items that have gone up in price.

Only thing not going up is my pay even though our workload has increased and we're now doing things that are not even on the job description, some of the stuff isn't even IT releated. But such is the way of life in NZ :-)

As a side not about voting, I vote. But it saddens me that it's either Labour or National pulling the strings. Has been the same since I've been voting, even with FPP.

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