Buyer claims an item is faulty after inspected purchase

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#726820 4-Dec-2012 14:07

timmmay: External factors should be considered - magnets, radio waves, etc. Perhaps they can try it in another part of their house.

Yeah, almost looks like the old "hum bars" from flourescent lighting, adjacent mains wiring interference, or from unshielded speakers, but this an LCD screen and should be practically immune from outside influences....

mattwnz

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#726821 4-Dec-2012 14:18

Maisy:
mattwnz:
bagheera: looking at the pic they have taken - if it was like that before she bought it - her inspection should have easily have spotted that issue, that more then faint lines, and any one inspecting to use it for graphic would have easily spotted that issue.

I am not sure on that. As I said previously, Grey will show panel problems far worse than other colours. I doubt that would show up on a white screen. I have seen that sort of thing on cheap poor quality screens before.

I consider this to be relatively moot, given that during the pre-purchase inspection the screen was viewed in a variety of conditions.

Yes, but was it viewed with that colour of grey screen, which is often used as the photoshop background? eg DId they test it with photoshop when they tested it? I actually think that that particualr colour really highlights the problem at it's worst, as I have seen that sort o thing before. So if the screen was darker or lighter the problem would diminish. I think that if it was an LCD panel problem, it would display as individual lines, so I think the problem could be related to a video card issue or something in the monitors own hardware. Whether they have been caused by the buyer banging the computer during transit is always a possibility.

gzt

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#726841 4-Dec-2012 14:49

mattwnz: I think that if it was an LCD panel problem, it would display as individual lines, so I think the problem could be related to a video card issue or something in the monitors own hardware. Whether they have been caused by the buyer banging the computer during transit is always a possibility.

There are many possible LCD problems that will not appear as individual lines.

Backlight inverter issues, backlight issues, changed physical characteristics of the backlight plane including deformation caused by transport are other possibilities.

Based on the diffusion shown in the left side insert photo - my personal guess is one of those instead.

gzt

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#726846 4-Dec-2012 14:58

Looking at that picture again I can see two half round marks in the left hand insert photo just below the screen center.

Do you recall seeing those when you viewed the screen at the buyer's address? or at home before the buyer picked it up?

I wonder if that is a lens effect from the camera - or if is a mark where some item or part of an item has impacted or rested against the screen. Very difficult to tell from here.

mattwnz

20163 posts

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#726849 4-Dec-2012 15:03

gzt:
mattwnz: I think that if it was an LCD panel problem, it would display as individual lines, so I think the problem could be related to a video card issue or something in the monitors own hardware. Whether they have been caused by the buyer banging the computer during transit is always a possibility.

There are many possible LCD problems that will not appear as individual lines.

Backlight inverter issues, backlight issues, changed physical characteristics of the backlight plane including deformation caused by transport are other possibilities.

Based on the diffusion shown in the left side insert photo - my personal guess is one of those instead.

I meant the physical LCD layers itself minus any of the hardware that runs it. It don't think there is anything wrong with that, as usually impact damage will cause this to break where you get those vertical lines in it. But I don't think the photos are high enough resolution to really tell what the problem is.

I think those other marks of the screen are a reflection, as you can see a reflection in the bottom black poart of the screen too, and they look a similar colour. They are possibly the reflection of fingers holding a camera.

cyberbuddha

70 posts

Master Geek

#726853 4-Dec-2012 15:08

mattwnz: I think those other marks of the screen are a reflection, as you can see a reflection in the bottom black poart of the screen too, and they look a similar colour. They are possibly the reflection of fingers holding a camera.

They are what you say, curved fingers. If you blow the image up to 400% you can clearly see it.

Maisy

24 posts

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#726859 4-Dec-2012 15:21

cyberbuddha:
mattwnz: I think those other marks of the screen are a reflection, as you can see a reflection in the bottom black poart of the screen too, and they look a similar colour. They are possibly the reflection of fingers holding a camera.

They are what you say, curved fingers. If you blow the image up to 400% you can clearly see it.

That is correct, the original image shows the reflection of the photographer fully but it is concealed by the white box which I used to protect the buyer's identity (there were a number of photographic files on the desktop)

Sharesies

Trade NZ and US shares and funds with Sharesies (affiliate link).

Maisy

24 posts

Geek

#726883 4-Dec-2012 15:41

mattwnz:
Maisy:
mattwnz:
bagheera: looking at the pic they have taken - if it was like that before she bought it - her inspection should have easily have spotted that issue, that more then faint lines, and any one inspecting to use it for graphic would have easily spotted that issue.

I am not sure on that. As I said previously, Grey will show panel problems far worse than other colours. I doubt that would show up on a white screen. I have seen that sort of thing on cheap poor quality screens before.

I consider this to be relatively moot, given that during the pre-purchase inspection the screen was viewed in a variety of conditions.

Yes, but was it viewed with that colour of grey screen, which is often used as the photoshop background? eg DId they test it with photoshop when they tested it? I actually think that that particualr colour really highlights the problem at it's worst, as I have seen that sort o thing before. So if the screen was darker or lighter the problem would diminish.

I am of the belief that the lines were not present at the time of purchase; particularly as the buyer's husband states in the most recent email which I received late last night, the lines are "immediately noticeable" and "very obvious".

mattwnz

20163 posts

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#726906 4-Dec-2012 16:05

Maisy:
mattwnz:
Maisy:
mattwnz:
bagheera: looking at the pic they have taken - if it was like that before she bought it - her inspection should have easily have spotted that issue, that more then faint lines, and any one inspecting to use it for graphic would have easily spotted that issue.

I am not sure on that. As I said previously, Grey will show panel problems far worse than other colours. I doubt that would show up on a white screen. I have seen that sort of thing on cheap poor quality screens before.

I consider this to be relatively moot, given that during the pre-purchase inspection the screen was viewed in a variety of conditions.

Yes, but was it viewed with that colour of grey screen, which is often used as the photoshop background? eg DId they test it with photoshop when they tested it? I actually think that that particualr colour really highlights the problem at it's worst, as I have seen that sort o thing before. So if the screen was darker or lighter the problem would diminish.

I am of the belief that the lines were not present at the time of purchase; particularly as the buyer's husband states in the most recent email which I received late last night, the lines are "immediately noticeable" and "very obvious".

Do they have photos of the screen with your background that you had installed so you can compare? That way you can tell pretty easily. A grey background will likely highlight the problem at it's worst.

Yogi02

238 posts

Master Geek

#727134 4-Dec-2012 23:22

I have had a look around and it seems like it is a manufacturing defect that Apple has put a warranty extension in for.
There are a few pics and vids around but no-one seems to have a solution other than replace the screen under warranty.
I was lead to these by googling iMac vertical white band and looking through the images for a match.
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1046739

http://www.socialnightlife.com/index.php?pg=searchvideo&v=wHZii0edA2U

While I feel for the buyer, this is the risk of a private sale via an Internet auction site. You have done no wrong and as long as you honestly had no knowledge of the defect.

cyberbuddha

70 posts

Master Geek

#727140 4-Dec-2012 23:53

I posted a link to the video above earlier.

The vertical lines thing is certainly a common issue as I also found the video by googling the same thing.

I am not sure how you would get on with the extended warranty thing for the monitor, but it's worth a try. Goods are supposed to last a reasonable period of time anyway, so you may have some lawful redress here anyway.

I hope you manage to get this matter sorted out. This has certainly put me off ever buying an iMac for sure!

mattwnz

20163 posts

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#727145 5-Dec-2012 00:11

cyberbuddha: I posted a link to the video above earlier.

The vertical lines thing is certainly a common issue as I also found the video by googling the same thing.

I am not sure how you would get on with the extended warranty thing for the monitor, but it's worth a try. Goods are supposed to last a reasonable period of time anyway, so you may have some lawful redress here anyway.

I hope you manage to get this matter sorted out. This has certainly put me off ever buying an iMac for sure!

Looks like the identical problem in that video, and they too can mainly see it on the grey background.They too said that if they weren't a graphic designer they probably wouldn't notice it or care too much about it. This therefore would suggest to me that this problem was always there, and possibly wasn't caused by a knock by the buyer.
I would hope apple would fix that, especially if it is a known issue.Manufacturers will often do a recall when this sort of defect occurs.

gzt

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#727172 5-Dec-2012 07:27

mattwnz: Looks like the identical problem in that video, and they too can mainly see it on the grey background.They too said that if they weren't a graphic designer they probably wouldn't notice it or care too much about it. This therefore would suggest to me that this problem was always there, and possibly wasn't caused by a knock by the buyer.

What evidence is there that problems of this class are 'always there' from when the machine is brand new and are just not noticed by the owner?

dickytim

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#727173 5-Dec-2012 07:31

timmmay: External factors should be considered - magnets, radio waves, etc. Perhaps they can try it in another part of their house.

I was thinking similarly, last year I upgraded my work laptop to a Toshiba from an Acer, purely on the higher spec of the Toshiba and got similar lines on my external screen, this was apparently caused by a possible earth loop, but when googling the issue there were possibilities for other types of interference causing the issue. I understand that the monitor is built in so theoretically the earth loop issue wouldn't happen as it has a common power supply, but that doesn't mean that the buyers power supply is clean.

With so many variables and the fact that the issue wasn't picked up during testing, and has not been seen before if I was the buyer I would be taking it to a professional or even a freind who knows what they are doing to have a look at first, that way there would be something to actually tell the seller, i.e. the computer has a faulty XYZ connection and likely had it when you sold it to me.

Maisy

24 posts

Geek

#727257 5-Dec-2012 09:35

gzt:
mattwnz: Looks like the identical problem in that video, and they too can mainly see it on the grey background.They too said that if they weren't a graphic designer they probably wouldn't notice it or care too much about it. This therefore would suggest to me that this problem was always there, and possibly wasn't caused by a knock by the buyer.

What evidence is there that problems of this class are 'always there' from when the machine is brand new and are just not noticed by the owner?

I have a bachelor of design (graphic design) and used the same computer in my graduation exhibition last year. I think I am qualified to notice it.

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