Where-to when your ISPs and TDR can't help?

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301 posts

Ultimate Geek

#554769 6-Dec-2011 23:42

Nope, calls are about as clear as you can get!

You're right, most of the ones I've dealt with aren't terribly technical, though they know how to wire things up just fine. Optimising and fixing things like this, none so far seem to have even had a clue :-/

lucky015

743 posts

Ultimate Geek

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#554778 7-Dec-2011 01:05

Yeah, They seem to pull out their little boxes that check for sync then go "She's good" when a connection is made then its the race onto the next job.

Seen a few referred to as "ADSL Tech's" but they seem to be no more knowledgeable about it, As if they where the ones who stood up when someone asked "Who wants a laptop and an old Dlink". (Typically an old IBM or Lenovo and something made by DLINK that may or may not even support ADSL2+)

From what you have said Slingshot have already deemed you to be more effort than you are worth as a customer so perhaps a change of ISP is in order, At the very least its a fresh set of eyes and perhaps a more helpful/competent call center.

I would suggest that next time you are visited by a Chorus tech you explain exactly how many times you have been visited, What they have done and ask what can be done further such as line replacement (outside of your premises) port changing/resetting, or a more in depth look into the lines running into your house, Call center staff are generally trained to do the same set of fixes over and over again and it doesn't help that you speak to a different one every time round, Often with larger problems they will completely overlook larger scale fixes even when they are a last resort in favor of doing the same thing the last 29 did.

Also I have found previously that T1.413 seems to be more resilient than ADSL2+ or G.DMT if it is available and can possibly cut down on the quantity of disconnections if it is available.

ChillingSilence

301 posts

Ultimate Geek

#554799 7-Dec-2011 07:29

The only down-side to another ISP is the data plans. I'm going to be using around 100GB when this is all resolved, and the likes of Orcon want significant extra moolah for it. Telecom goes up to around 60 or 80GB then stings you on overage charges. Vodafone I'm not the biggest fan of, neither TelstraClear.

Not to mention there's bugger all to stop the next ISP from also saying "You know what, we don't care enough to fix it"... Considering Slingshot would be the second ISP to try that. My previous ISP was a smaller ISP who resold Odyssey.

Unfortunately I'm not always around when the Chorus techs visit. I've tried that methodology when I *do* see them though. They have zero ideas :(

ChillingSilence

301 posts

Ultimate Geek

#554935 7-Dec-2011 12:12

So I've emailed the Slingshot Resolutions Manager suggesting:
1) They see if the results of OrbMT were of any use
2) That they check for a line tap
3) That because they've put me on a long-range profile as a 'band-aid' to get me over the 10mbps "acceptable threshold" that it's quite possibly clouding the real issue.

I then went on to say:
Being on a cabinet only 400m away I shouldn't have to be on anything but the standard profile and that seems like a band-aid to put over the real issue that something is wrong with either the line from the street to the house demarc, the line from the street to the cabinet, or possibly with the port / line card I'm terminating at.
Either way we should be able to have some description of a customer relations manager at Chorus, who handles Slingshots account with them, make the appropriate arrangements to get this all looked in to. That way it won't be taking up Slingshots time as much, as the onus really is upon them. It will require somebody at Slingshot to actually *make* that kind of call to Chorus to have it arranged.
It shouldn't be difficult. Let me know how you go.

I have just got a nice little email back:

Just to keep you updated, I have been in discussion with the Call Centre Manager about this and we have requested further assistance from Telecom Wholesale (who as you know mange the relationship with Chorus) to obtain a report on this with the further information you have provided.
Now I can not give you a timeframe on when we will receive this but I will be all over this, as I can appreciate your frustrations.

So, fingers crossed we get somewhere, though I've requested previously they get in touch with whoever manages their account at Telecom Wholesale and it didn't happen.
Thanks to all who've replied. If there's anything more that any of you can think of in the mean time I could try / do, then by all means suggest away, I'm all ears!

Cheers! :)

DonGould

3892 posts

Uber Geek

#554956 7-Dec-2011 12:52

ChillingSilence: ..."...requested further assistance from Telecom Wholesale (who as you know mange the relationship with Chorus)..."...

Ok, sorry, but I'm confused as hell here...

I thought the whole purpose of this separation thing was that ISPs would be dealing directly with the network arm which was a totally different company to Telecom Retails operations?

Am I to understand that ISPs are not dealing directly with Chorus at all and we in fact how have 2 layers in there before you even get to network? (Consumer -> ISP -> Telecom -> Chorus)

Promote New Zealand - Get yourself a .kiwi.nz domain name!!!

Check out mine - i.am.a.can.do.kiwi.nz - don@i.am.a.can.do.kiwi.nz

ChillingSilence

301 posts

Ultimate Geek

#554958 7-Dec-2011 12:55

Telecom Xtra also buys from Telecom Wholesale I believe, though they are not required to.

Cymro

283 posts

Ultimate Geek

#554983 7-Dec-2011 13:35

DonGould:
ChillingSilence: ..."...requested further assistance from Telecom Wholesale (who as you know mange the relationship with Chorus)..."...

Ok, sorry, but I'm confused as hell here...

I thought the whole purpose of this separation thing was that ISPs would be dealing directly with the network arm which was a totally different company to Telecom Retails operations?

Am I to understand that ISPs are not dealing directly with Chorus at all and we in fact how have 2 layers in there before you even get to network? (Consumer -> ISP -> Telecom -> Chorus)

(Consumer -> ISP -> Telecom Wholesale -> Chorus) = Operational Separation model

(Consumer -> ISP -> Chorus) New Demerged model

Chorus now runs the Wholesale shop directly for UBA

Sharesies

Trade NZ and US shares and funds with Sharesies (affiliate link).

ChillingSilence

301 posts

Ultimate Geek

#554984 7-Dec-2011 13:36

Ah, thank for clearing that up :)

DonGould

3892 posts

Uber Geek

#554989 7-Dec-2011 13:43

Cymro:
DonGould:
ChillingSilence: ..."...requested further assistance from Telecom Wholesale (who as you know mange the relationship with Chorus)..."...

Ok, sorry, but I'm confused as hell here...

I thought the whole purpose of this separation thing was that ISPs would be dealing directly with the network arm which was a totally different company to Telecom Retails operations?

Am I to understand that ISPs are not dealing directly with Chorus at all and we in fact how have 2 layers in there before you even get to network? (Consumer -> ISP -> Telecom -> Chorus)

(Consumer -> ISP -> Telecom Wholesale -> Chorus) = Operational Separation model

(Consumer -> ISP -> Chorus) New Demerged model

Chorus now runs the Wholesale shop directly for UBA

Did you read the bit I quoted?

Seems that they're not running under the demerger model at all?

Promote New Zealand - Get yourself a .kiwi.nz domain name!!!

Check out mine - i.am.a.can.do.kiwi.nz - don@i.am.a.can.do.kiwi.nz

Jaxar

383 posts

Ultimate Geek

#555000 7-Dec-2011 13:53

The demerger is definatly progressing. More than one salty dog working at ISP will still be letting the words Telecom wholesale slip through their lips when they mean Chorus.

What is happening is you get Consumer -> ISP - > Chorus -> Chorus -> Chorus

Please note: I have a professional bias towards Vodafone.

Cymro

283 posts

Ultimate Geek

#555001 7-Dec-2011 13:58

DonGould:
Cymro:
DonGould:
ChillingSilence: ..."...requested further assistance from Telecom Wholesale (who as you know mange the relationship with Chorus)..."...

Ok, sorry, but I'm confused as hell here...

I thought the whole purpose of this separation thing was that ISPs would be dealing directly with the network arm which was a totally different company to Telecom Retails operations?

Am I to understand that ISPs are not dealing directly with Chorus at all and we in fact how have 2 layers in there before you even get to network? (Consumer -> ISP -> Telecom -> Chorus)

(Consumer -> ISP -> Telecom Wholesale -> Chorus) = Operational Separation model

(Consumer -> ISP -> Chorus) New Demerged model

Chorus now runs the Wholesale shop directly for UBA

Did you read the bit I quoted?

Seems that they're not running under the demerger model at all?

I think the Customer service rep's terminology can be excused, given that Chorus have swallowed the majority of the Wholesale operation and all the b2b systems and processes used to provision/assure/bill ISP's have stayed the same.
It does mean that Chorus and Wholesale can choose to re-integrate now to reduce the process spaghetti left over by Operational separation.

The old Wholesale faults team is now a Chorus faults team, and will manage the relationship with the Chorus field force without the need to jump through any OpSep hoops, if that makes sense.

Cymro

283 posts

Ultimate Geek

#555003 7-Dec-2011 13:59

Jaxar: The demerger is definatly progressing. More than one salty dog working at ISP will still be letting the words Telecom wholesale slip through their lips when they mean Chorus.

What is happening is you get Consumer -> ISP - > Chorus -> Chorus -> Chorus

You get a Chorus line? /coat

ChillingSilence

301 posts

Ultimate Geek

#559427 19-Dec-2011 07:22

Just a quick update, it took until Friday to get them to get a Chorus Tech to come out (Tech visit #30). They came out with "No DSL" on the ticket, though part of that was the Techs fault as that was purely the "Category" that Slingshot had to put the request for a port-change under.

So I really wonder about these Techs:
1) Wrong info on the dispatch (Or they read it wrong)
2) This guy has been out to my place twice before but doesn't remember going under my home and inspecting the stuff, nor does he remember talking about things with me previously
3) He has no idea about what actually goes on in the Cabinet. I tried asking him about the ikanos line cards and he was clueless.
4) He had never heard of Draytek before when I showed him my stash of routers, and he said the AM300 was terrible and I should be using the Thomson TG585 or a D-Link. If it was so terrible, why is it able to re-establish a connection so much faster and keep te connection more reliably than the TG585? He didn't have an answe for that one...

Anyways so I emailed back the Operations Manager (The Resolutions Manager has passed over to him as she goes away on holiday soon), told him the update that it still wasn't fixed and was still disconnecting. Interestingly enough I'm now able to sync at 13mbps on the standard DSL profile, when previously I would sync around 9mbps (They had put me on a long-range profile just to get me to sync over 10mbps).

Where to from here? Request they pull me a whole new line from the cabinet?

Ragnor

8222 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#559468 19-Dec-2011 10:17

The AM300 is a solid modem in my experience, however it doesn't sync as high as modems with broadcom chipsets like the old Dynalink 1320 or TP Link TD 8840 eg: On my line at home I'd get around 13-14Mbit with the AM300 but 17-18Mbit with the TP Link.

If the port change hasn't solved the issue... and.. neighbours aren't having the same disconnecting problem and slingshot + chorus have ruled out anything at their end eg: faulty equipment in the cabinet or dodgy radius server etc... then it's probably the line.

ChillingSilence

301 posts

Ultimate Geek

#559489 19-Dec-2011 11:26

They brought their Dynalink 1320 when they did the testing for 60 minutes to see if they could find any fluctuations (Over 60 minutes, really Chorus?!). Theirs was syncing at exactly the same speed as mine if I remember rightly (Or within 200kbps, out of 12mbps), so I'm not *too* worried. Personally I just use the AM300 coz it doesn't disconnect, and it does Halfbridge so I use a WRT54GL with Tomato. Works well :)

I've emailed Slingshot, fingers crossed I'm not waiting another 10 days for something to happen again ...

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